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RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 3:14:56 AM

Madame4a

Posts: 2045
Joined: 2/4/2008
From: Washington, DC area
Status: offline

I agree with what everyone has said, BUT

you know, we've all had the weird or odd request, right? castrate me, blackmail me, keep me in a cage 24/7 and abuse me... or we've seen the profiles... "I want a women to take total control of me and abuse me"

sometimes, one person's abuse is another's kink -- and its only good if you tell others about the threat and shock them...

that said, if this is indeed abuse, my heart goes out to the man for all the reasons people have said, and he doesn't deserve it

again, though, without real proof, its important in our little communities to be careful when crying abuse ...

just saying

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Post #: 21

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 4:17:52 AM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline

I must admit, youngsubgeoff's story does raise a certain worry for me, albeit one that's about a bridge I've yet to come near to having to cross. That spectre of "sub-breaking" is raised again in relation to it. What actually does happen if a someone submits so completely to a a dominant, then that dominant abuses his/her position? A submissive's drive to submit can be very powerful, or so I've found. I guess an equally powerful dose of trust would have to be involved, too.

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Post #: 22

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 9:57:03 AM

youngsubgeoff

Posts: 900
Joined: 9/25/2007
From: The Asylum
Status: offline

understand as well peonforher, I was 18 at the time. I was still new to the scene and really naive to life in general. The thing about cronic abusers is that they have the ability to sell themselves as good people. They are also extremely manipulative. I was extremely foolish and jumped right into the relationship, no negotiations at all. I will never make that mistake again.

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You dont need to question my sanity, I can assure you Im quite mad. Its ok though, all the best people are

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Post #: 23

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 10:28:51 AM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
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quote:

ORIGINAL: youngsubgeoff

understand as well peonforher, I was 18 at the time. I was still new to the scene and really naive to life in general. The thing about cronic abusers is that they have the ability to sell themselves as good people. They are also extremely manipulative. I was extremely foolish and jumped right into the relationship, no negotiations at all. I will never make that mistake again.

Thank goodness you won't have to!

{hugs Geoff and K}

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Post #: 24

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 11:14:38 AM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
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Good god, YSG. Given how naive I was at age 18 (indeed, some would say how naive I am still), I can all too easily understand how you ended up in that horrifying situation.

I was extremely foolish and jumped right into the relationship, no negotiations at all. I will never make that mistake again.

Indelibly etched on my brain. Hopefully your relating your experience here will serve as a warning to others as well. Thank you for your courage and candour in sharing it.

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Post #: 25

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 11:17:37 AM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
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From: Island Of Misfit Toys
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Peon, Darling! Be my money pig, and I will take fabulous care of you! Just keep me in Mr Kipling's and Rowan yarn, and all will be well...

Easily Pleased Hib

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Post #: 26

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 11:20:20 AM

MsStarlett

Posts: 1879
Joined: 12/23/2007
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I'm just glad to hear that Geoff has found someone better to show him the correct way to go. I've been in several abusive relationships, all of which happened when I was 17 to early 20's. Those of us who learn early, never forget.

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It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed,
the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning,
It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.

(in reply to PeonForHer)

Post #: 27

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 11:26:06 AM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
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From: Island Of Misfit Toys
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Shoot, I did my abusive relationship in my mid 30's. Slow learner.

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Post #: 28

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 11:44:49 AM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
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Right, I understand "Mr Kipling's" and I can guess at "rowan yarn" - but "money pig"? Is that like a piggy bank? You mean you want to slot your spare coins into me in order to save for a rainy day? Oh well, each domina to her own, I guess.

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Post #: 29

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 11:46:34 AM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MsStarlett

I'm just glad to hear that Geoff has found someone better to show him the correct way to go. I've been in several abusive relationships, all of which happened when I was 17 to early 20's. Those of us who learn early, never forget.

. . . Or they don't learn and, instead, think that such abuse is the norm. I'm just glad that you did the former, Ms S. Very glad indeed.

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Post #: 30

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 11:46:42 AM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
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From: Island Of Misfit Toys
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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Right, I understand "Mr Kipling's" and I can guess at "rowan yarn" - but "money pig"? Is that like a piggy bank? You mean you want to slot your spare coins into me in order to save for a rainy day? Oh well, each domina to her own, I guess.

Maybe you could just carry my handbag.

Colinette yarn, too... how could I have forgotten that? And cream teas. (Ty-phoo, thanks). Coffee in the morning, NOT instant. Hm. This is more complex than I thought.

Demanding Hib

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[page 23 girl]

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Post #: 31

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 12:05:08 PM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
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Typhoo tea is rubbish, Lady Hib. Never speak to me of it again. Life is harsh for you Americans, starved as you are of quality tea. Frankly, I don't know how you all survive the miserable conditions out there.

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Post #: 32

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 12:06:58 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
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From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Typhoo tea is rubbish, Lady Hib. Never speak to me of it again. Life is harsh for you Americans, starved as you are of quality tea. Frankly, I don't know how you all survive the miserable conditions out there.

ASSAM, then. Or you can surprise me, as long as it isn't that dreck they call Earl Grey. bleh! The fairy cakes are vital, though, get those right! And those little jam tarts!

Sugar starved Hib

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[page 23 girl]

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Post #: 33

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 12:09:04 PM

MsStarlett

Posts: 1879
Joined: 12/23/2007
Status: offline

Oh yes, that horrid 65 degree (18.3 C) weather for the holiday was just dreadful to endure.

_____________________________

It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.
It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed,
the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning,
It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.

(in reply to PeonForHer)

Post #: 34

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 3:27:10 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

Thank you for the topic. I don't think people realize how often abuse is a part of the present or past of many involved in wiitwd. It's hard for us to discern it because much of what we do comes so close to what many main stream people would immediately identify as an abusive situation. You have to admit. The vanillas have us on that one. Signs of a physically or mentally abusive situation are more evident to them because in the regular world, certain things just aren't the norm. When they see odd bruises showing up, they are immediately concerned. When we see them, we think of them as the after effects of play. When the vanillas see an acquaintance that is withdrawing from family or social situations, the flags go up for their emotional well being. We see it as control imposed by a Dominant. The list goes on and on. These are only the evident signs. It says nothing of what's underneath.

I want to take a moment here to thank youngsubgeoff here for telling a bit of his story. (Before I forget, My greetings to your Mistress.) For someone who has never been in an abusive situation, they can't possibly know what kind of courage it takes to even show a small glimpse of what has happened to them. Even typing up words on a screen takes an enormous amount of strength. It isn't always that it is recognized what it really takes to talk about a non-consensual situation where damage has been done. When power, any power, has been misused, there is destruction left in the wake. I am glad that you are able to recognize that and heal.

Something that hasn't been mentioned in this thread is something that does need to be addressed. There is always the question of, why don't they leave? It seems so simple, looking from the outside in. Most people feel in control of their own lives, so they don't see it from the abused person's point of view. The reason for that is that the abused person no longer sees a reality based perception. A person often continues in an abusive relationship due to something that is often called the "Superman" syndrome. They often literally see their abuser as some type of Superman, who can and will accomplish any kind of harm a person can think of. It can go to such a degree that, even if an abused person thinks of stabbing the attacker in the chest, they literally believe that person can still get up and harm them. They literally have that kind of an unhealthy mental hold.

Yes, submissive het males are challenged more when it comes to openly admitting what happened to them and seeking help. Society has conditioned people in such a way that they can often ignore the power imbalance that should be evident. Why doesn't a male just over power a female? Why doesn't a gay lover just leave his partner? Why doesn't a person just tell? It is because society asks these very questions that many feel trapped and that they have no where to turn. Don't think those in a bad situation don't already hear these questions in their head before they are ever asked. Sometimes, it helps to create the very prison they live in.

I'll get off of the soapbox now. Perhaps someone else would like a turn.

_____________________________

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Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

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Post #: 35

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 3:49:07 PM

MsStarlett

Posts: 1879
Joined: 12/23/2007
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This is a very serious subject because so many of us HAVE been abused. Last night, I spent some time with my long time favorite Wall-e. He has always been just an internet & phone contact. He lives so far away that we didn't think we would ever get together, but we shared many a hot conversation about our fantasies. One of his favorites was to be kicked and trampled on mercilessly by a woman who cared nothing for his pitiful whining and crying. So, when we started playing, I started out with my normal 'warm up' of spanking... he squawked and complained. I teased him about it and moved on to some light bondage, clothes pins and flogging. He complained even louder. I thought it was all part of his fantasy and actually started enjoying my 'screamer'. I looked him in the eye and spat "What's the matter? Did you forget your safe word?" He whimpered that I never told him one. I felt rather badly and told him to simply call me by my real name then continued. He flinched away from me and fell, calling my name. I stopped immediately, helped him up, gave him a hug, removed the clothes pins and bindings, checked him for injury, stroked his face and asked if he was ok. He seemed genuinely surprised that I would do so. Then got embarrassed that he 'safe worded out' so quickly over things that my other boy enjoys. I told him that my Westie is a pain slut. I should have understood that he was NOT one, Wall-e's a doormat. They are different and I needed to use different toys on different boys. After realizing that I actually, genuinely CARE for him, his needs and his limits, he went much farther than I expected. We just needed to establish that I honestly enjoy inflicting pain... I do not get my jollies by being abusive. There is a difference.

_____________________________

It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.
It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed,
the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning,
It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 36

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 11/29/2008 5:20:29 PM

ShaktiSama

Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline

Yeah. Ditto Starlett on the basic message. I could never emphasize enough how useful it is to have genuine, caring support from a dominant when you're exploring your fantasies and limits. The situation she describes is one where she strayed away from the fantasy that was familiar to her sub, into play that wasn't particularly his bag. But with an inexperienced submissive, sometimes even the fantasies that are very dear to him/her are beyond present limits. The mind may love a certain scenario, but that's no sign that the body will be able to cope with the reality. Until you try it, you cannot know, and while you're trying it, you need to be able to stop at any time. Release, reassure and re-negotiate as needed.

< Message edited by ShaktiSama -- 11/29/2008 5:21:09 PM >

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Post #: 37

RE: Crossing over from Supremacy to Abuse - 12/21/2008 10:37:54 AM

Vanessacherry

Posts: 18
Joined: 12/13/2008
Status: offline

I have 20 years of personally experiencing what this "abuse" is first hand.
I think it's great that you care so much. I really feel for this friend. What a difficult situation you must be in.

I just wanted to say that I hope it works out for him..

(in reply to Lockit)

Post #: 38

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