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RE: More newbie thoughts... - 12/25/2005 6:01:28 PM   
fyreredsub


Posts: 3403
Joined: 10/7/2005
Status: offline 		excellent points EV. i had independance thrown at me through life and i hated it.yet fighting my burning belly and giving up the control that i now had is/was hard. Master has me doing task that take me out of myself w/out my losing the pride i have in my job/community.However, had it not been in my nature to be pleasing and to serve...i would have to be stayed sub and not a slave. i found that as a sub, i have the POWER and men still dance on the string to my manipulations so they can have kinky sex.lol. Master takes no bull but is fair.but it will ALWAYS remain his way or the highway.
i was raised to be a wife, a mother, take care of the home,,that hasnt changed as asingle parent, yet instead of wife i am slave and i must say under Masters care i do well. i have a structure,an order, i know my place.(however, it took much bratty behavior and correction for me to grow)Now i have a comfort that i didnt have when i was married and equal.
thank you for reminding me of this....
and bah humbug to social engineering
happy holidays

_____________________________

"Accordingly, men must then either fulfill their nature, or deny it, and in denying their nature, deny us ours, for ours is the complement to theirs. " Renegades

(in reply to EV)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: More newbie thoughts... - 12/25/2005 8:04:14 PM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
quote:

OK, back on track. Given that a couple may be in it for the long haul, a lifetime commitment as the goal, how does a master/slave relationship address the problems inherent in unequal division of labor?


Crazyx2
It doesn't.
First, by it's very nature a M/s relationship has the appearance of an unequal division of labor. Appearance, but not necessary fact. There are things that need doing, but there is also a decision and managment process. Thought, planning and managment are also "labor". Sometimes a person evaluating numbers and working formulas eight hours a day comes home more tired than a person digging ditches.

But your situation raises the point I made and felt strong enough about to make it a life choice. A "slave" can only have one Master. A slave should have focus on Master. I don't think it possible for a slave under that definition to have a job outside of the M/s household. If beth worked outside the home, I would be forced to accept another Master in her life. Until I had the ability to afford that choice, I didn't seek a slave. It wasn't a sacrifice - it was selfish. It was a conscience choice.

I knew I would accept nothing short of total commitment. I knew there would be an "unequal division of labor" in the household. I knew I would not tolerate a slave who had become tired, physically, emotionally, or mentally by serving another, in ANY capacity, for 8 hours a day. I don't think it's fair to expect that from any human being.

I greatly respect those household who manage to sustain a 24/7 M/s dynamic with the submissive component working. But I would find it hard to argue against your point. It's NOT fair. I'd say it's not reasonable. But I'm not saying it's impossible. Some Master's require work and income as an essential part of their dynamic. I just would hate to have beth say, she had a difficult time at the office and as a result was too tired to serve me. Because ultimately a slave is for service to Master, as Master sees fit. For this Master, I saw it as my responsibility to remove ALL other encumbrances to that service. It makes it much simpler.

Good Luck! Talk it out.

(in reply to Crazytwice)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: More newbie thoughts... - 12/25/2005 10:32:55 PM   
Sunshine119


Posts: 611
Joined: 8/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: fyreredsub

i guess i'm truly blessed Master gave me an order to my life
1. Mom
2. woman
3. slave

if and when we ever get to in the same home fulltime, i will have alot more responsibility as to his needs/pampering but Master is most fair and generous. the rest of the day to day stuff wouldnt really be any different than it is as as single-parent. i do it all now,just throw in dishes and laundry for one more.


Fyrered,

I'm glad you feel like your Master has given you order to your life, but surely things will significantly change if/when you live together. It is alot more than just throwing in extra dishes or doing laundry for one more.

Having been a single parent for kids who are now grown, I did it all. And I was exhausted all the time. Got up each morning to shower for work, got them up to get dressed for school, fed them, got them on the bus or drove them to school. Put in at least 8 hours each day at work, came home, fed them, cleaned up the dishes, threw in a load of clothes, helped them with homework, made sure they bathed, got them to bed, put clothes in dryer, took care of other household duties, folded clothes, collapsed into bed in order to start again the next day. Weekends I then cleaned house and took care of the yard and car as well. Heaven help the PTA if they called and asked for volunteers!

Now, having someone in the home that I adore and want to serve puts far more pressure on me to make sure everything is "perfect". I don't know where I would have even added "sex or fun" activities onto that list. 24/7 service? LOL....
OK, there are two choices, I can either stay home full time and take care of him exclusively or go to work and share the burdens at home. The choice is his. I explain that I love my job, but not more than him and if it is what he wants, I will stay home. Or.....he can take out the garbage, mow the lawn, take care of the hedges, shovel the snow and get the cars worked on and maintained. I'll do the rest. Pretty traditional breakdown of chores.

Like anything else we own, we can overuse it and wear it out. Break it without repair. We can, however, share the load so that the possession is not ruined and the free time shared will be one in which I can give myself totally... awake, aware and CAPABLE of serving.

(in reply to fyreredsub)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: More newbie thoughts... - 12/25/2005 10:53:28 PM   
Crazytwice


Posts: 145
Joined: 11/28/2005
From: North of Boston
Status: offline 		Wonderful, fabulous posts!
You folks continue to astound me with your insight, each and every time.
sharing your knowledge with no agenda, that is the true spirit of giving.
I'm delighted to learn that the best m/s relationships are ones of give and take. I could certainly, even eagerly, live with that.



_____________________________

"If you build it, he will come"
~Field of Dreams~

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: More newbie thoughts... - 12/26/2005 5:15:02 AM   
sunshine333


Posts: 203
Joined: 8/16/2005
Status: offline
quote:

For someone who wishes to retain the right to determine whether something is a need or a want for hirself, that person probably wouldn't be particularly interested in an Owner/servant - style relationship.


i think LadiesBladewing said it best. and i think this is a key point ... finding someone who can sensibley handle the responsibility to make that need/want distinction. if an Owner simply wishes to "use" a slave but not care for her ... then that slave will be used up before she has the chance to be of "full use." and no Owner (that i've ever met) wants that. both roles ... dominant and submissive ... incur giving and taking. being a slave does not simply mean forgoing your needs and serving your Owner. it means finding a suitable Owner who you can trust and rely on to care for your needs ... whatever he/she decides they are.

humbly,
sunshine

(in reply to Crazytwice)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: More newbie thoughts... - 12/26/2005 6:05:09 AM   
Manawyddan


Posts: 701
Joined: 1/2/2005
From: Petaluma (Northern California)
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: caitlyn
I think this is a well crafted and subtle conspiracy by a very select group of men, designed to use our darkest desires for wild sexual activity, as a method to get us all back into the kitchen.

Not a very well thought out strategy as it applies to me, as the "victor" would be forced to eat my cooking.


If I were your Dom, then, I would instruct you to take cooking classes.

I agree with the above posters that ... if I were to enter into a 24/7 fullt-time Master/slave relationship with someone, I would not do so unless I was capable of supporting the two of us, creating a very 'traditional' M/f division of labor.

(actually, however, I think flowers tend to wilt when they don't get any sun, and would instruct a slave to do something outside the house ... whether it be volunteering, adult ed classes, or the occasional short-term temp job).

_____________________________

_______________________________________________
"She always had a terrific sense of humor"
(Valerie Solonas, as described by her mother)
_______________________________________________

(in reply to caitlyn)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: More newbie thoughts... - 12/26/2005 9:44:53 AM   
EV


Posts: 7
Status: offline
quote:

bah humbug to social engineering



Delicious!



EV

(in reply to fyreredsub)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: More newbie thoughts... - 12/26/2005 9:50:11 AM   
fyreredsub


Posts: 3403
Joined: 10/7/2005
Status: offline 		yes i agree, i would struggle more w/ my being the perfect slave gene,lol.i would wish more time to pamper Master.however Master is most fair and constantly stresses to me, how i must tell him if i am feeling uncomfortable or overloaded,so that these scenarios and problems dont creep into play in our relationship.Master understands that i am bbout done w/ grad school and his main concern is that i finish
oopsie edited for a major typo.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sunshine119


quote:

ORIGINAL: fyreredsub

i guess i'm truly blessed Master gave me an order to my life
1. Mom
2. woman
3. slave

if and when we ever get to in the same home fulltime, i will have alot more responsibility as to his needs/pampering but Master is most fair and generous. the rest of the day to day stuff wouldnt really be any different than it is as as single-parent. i do it all now,just throw in dishes and laundry for one more.


Fyrered,

I'm glad you feel like your Master has given you order to your life, but surely things will significantly change if/when you live together. It is alot more than just throwing in extra dishes or doing laundry for one more.

Having been a single parent for kids who are now grown, I did it all. And I was exhausted all the time. Got up each morning to shower for work, got them up to get dressed for school, fed them, got them on the bus or drove them to school. Put in at least 8 hours each day at work, came home, fed them, cleaned up the dishes, threw in a load of clothes, helped them with homework, made sure they bathed, got them to bed, put clothes in dryer, took care of other household duties, folded clothes, collapsed into bed in order to start again the next day. Weekends I then cleaned house and took care of the yard and car as well. Heaven help the PTA if they called and asked for volunteers!

Now, having someone in the home that I adore and want to serve puts far more pressure on me to make sure everything is "perfect". I don't know where I would have even added "sex or fun" activities onto that list. 24/7 service? LOL....
OK, there are two choices, I can either stay home full time and take care of him exclusively or go to work and share the burdens at home. The choice is his. I explain that I love my job, but not more than him and if it is what he wants, I will stay home. Or.....he can take out the garbage, mow the lawn, take care of the hedges, shovel the snow and get the cars worked on and maintained. I'll do the rest. Pretty traditional breakdown of chores.

Like anything else we own, we can overuse it and wear it out. Break it without repair. We can, however, share the load so that the possession is not ruined and the free time shared will be one in which I can give myself totally... awake, aware and CAPABLE of serving.



< Message edited by fyreredsub -- 12/26/2005 9:51:35 AM >

_____________________________

"Accordingly, men must then either fulfill their nature, or deny it, and in denying their nature, deny us ours, for ours is the complement to theirs. " Renegades

(in reply to Sunshine119)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: More newbie thoughts... - 1/11/2006 5:12:34 AM   
EriaeMelody


Posts: 29
Joined: 1/10/2006
Status: offline
quote:

As a slave, are you expected to ignore your own needs for the goal of living in service?


No, not ignore your own needs...just transfer the meeting of them to someone else. It is then up to your owner to decide if you needs are actually just that...NEEDS...or if they are nothing more than wants.

quote:

Am I expected to set aside my own needs to meet those of one who is perfectly capable of tending to himself?


If that is what you and your Master agreed upon, then yes, without question. There are as many forms of consentual slavery as there are stars in the sky. What works for one person, may not work for another. It all depends on the parties involved.

_____________________________

"It's just another day in paradise"

(in reply to Crazytwice)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: More newbie thoughts... - 1/11/2006 5:48:20 AM   
fldrkhorse


Posts: 158
Joined: 11/5/2005
From: North Carolina
Status: offline 		IMHO, this is why the vast majority of vanilla realtionships don't work, because there is a constant and consistent struggle for power. If I may quote a Dom from a previous post (and forgive me I tried to find and paste it but couldn't). He stated as his wife left him she said, "I'm not your fucking slave."

This is why I enjoy the D/s relationships because the roles are, or should be, clearly defined. There are no power struggles, it is clear who is the boss and who has the final word. If your expectation, yes there's that word again, is different than that of your Dom, the frustrations will be on you, not him. It may not be that you're not submissive, but more so your expectation is different, causing you to fight for power to get him to do what you want him to do. This, for you, is a losing battle.

_____________________________

I'm not where I need to be, but I'm better than I was yesterday.

Namaste, I honor the divine in you

(in reply to Crazytwice)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: More newbie thoughts... - 1/11/2006 3:25:33 PM   
Arpig


Posts: 9930
Joined: 1/3/2006
From: Increasingly further from reality
Status: offline 		As far as I am concerned, the care and maintenance of the home is my sub's responsibility...however, before I get jumped on, let me clarify what I mean by that. She is responsible for insuring that what needs doing gets done, that can mean she does it herself, or that she informs me that it needs doing.
Of course, if we were a single income household (yeah, yeah, I know...dreamer, nothing but a dreamer....), then I would expect her to actually take care of doing the vast majority of the things that need doing.
This interpretation is based on the facts that while I really would prefer to have it all done for me; 1) it is unreasonable to expect her to do all the housework AND a full time job as well, 2) I am absent-minded at the best of times, and 3) I don't want to be bothered with the details.
I don't want to open the fridge and find we are out of cheese, so I expect her to make sure we are not out of cheese, either by going to the store herself, or by informing me that we are almost out.

_____________________________

Big man! Pig Man!
Ha Ha...Charade you are!

Why do they leave out the letter b on "Garage Sale" signs?

CM's #1 All-Time Also-Ran


(in reply to Crazytwice)
Profile   Post #: 31
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