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They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 12:10:42 PM   
celticlord2112


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They Won't Give Him Credit
Why not acknowledge the good along with the bad?

Or are we to prove Marc Antony, and inter the good with the bones?

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 12:25:36 PM   
SilverMark


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Well they should...not a fan but, give the man his due for the good  he has done....Seems almost incongruent to the rest of his performance.

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 12:29:32 PM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

They Won't Give Him Credit
Why not acknowledge the good along with the bad?

Or are we to prove Marc Antony, and inter the good with the bones?


And so the revisionist history begins, even before his term ends.

"Of course the left can say whatever they like about George Bush and the war in Iraq and the war on terror. But when he does something completely in line with their own stated principles and values, it is simply mean-spirited of them to deny him his due."
 
The fact he had some accomplishments in office doesn't negate the many, many, enormous blunders and outright incompetence of this administration.

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 12:30:47 PM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SilverMark

Well they should...not a fan but, give the man his due for the good  he has done....Seems almost incongruent to the rest of his performance.

Personally, I think it's of a piece with it. Regardless of what others think, the man does what he perceives is the right thing to do.

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:10:59 PM   
Sanity


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Yeah, they try to paint the man up as a monster, you know? But really, that's all he's ever done as far as I'm concerned, what he thought was the right thing to do. The way he sees it, the United States helped free 50 million people while he was Commander In Chief, and he's right. He did more to fight AIDS in Africa than any other president before him... really, I think history will be very kind to him, years from now. Any "revisionism" will only serve to remove all the fog cast around by the current left wing media that does us nothing other than a grave disservice.


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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:21:56 PM   
popeye1250


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


Yeah, they try to paint the man up as a monster, you know? But really, that's all he's ever done as far as I'm concerned, what he thought was the right thing to do. The way he sees it, the United States helped free 50 million people while he was Commander In Chief, and he's right. He did more to fight AIDS in Africa than any other president before him... really, I think history will be very kind to him, years from now. Any "revisionism" will only serve to remove all the fog cast around by the current left wing media that does us nothing other than a grave disservice.



"Africa?" What's he done to "fight aids" in the U.S.?

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:27:32 PM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

"Africa?" What's he done to "fight aids" in the U.S.?

http://www.whitehouse.gov/infocus/hivaids/

Towards the bottom it discusses domestic steps to combat AIDS.

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:35:49 PM   
kittinSol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
Yeah, they try to paint the man up as a monster, you know? But really, that's all he's ever done as far as I'm concerned, what he thought was the right thing to do.


Yep. The man has  a reduced intellectual scope. He may have done what he thought was the right thing to do precisely because his range is so limited. A person of higher intelligence would have seen through the calculations of Cheney and told him to go to hell.

Bush isn't a monster: he is a sad little man who was given way, way too much power for his stature. And now, we are reaping the rewards of his stupidity. Let's just erase him as a 'little' accident, a little like a dog peeing behind a door, and start again.

Edited because of a lapsus.

< Message edited by kittinSol -- 12/5/2008 2:37:47 PM >


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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:38:28 PM   
slvemike4u


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Come on CL and Sanity the man has been an unmitigated disaster as Commander in Chief.Quite frankly giving this man his due means more than cherry picking a program here or there.It means looking at trampling the constitution, codifying torture the failed response to Katrina....and on and on.
Giving him "his due" actually benefits Herbert Hoover more than anyone else....

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:39:12 PM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

And now, we are reaping the rewards of his stupidity.

So you consider $30Billion to fight AIDS in Africa "stupid"? Does that include the additional $30Billion that the G8 nations committed towards combating HIV/AIDS worldwide?

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:42:00 PM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

Giving him "his due" actually benefits Herbert Hoover more than anyone else...

Other than allowing Smoot-Hawley to pass, Herbert Hoover handled the 1929 economic downturn more or less ok, and if FDR had left well enough alone the Depression would have been over by 1936.

So yeah, give all of them their due. I'll even give Dear Leader his due.....as soon as he actually does something besides run his mouth.

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:42:22 PM   
kittinSol


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Rulemylife was spot on: we are witnessing the revisionists at work. It's fantasmagorical to see how lies can take over the truth so transparently. Fascinating.

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:47:04 PM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Rulemylife was spot on: we are witnessing the revisionists at work. It's fantasmagorical to see how lies can take over the truth so transparently. Fascinating.

The $30Billion is fact, kittin. Nothing revisionist about it.

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:47:23 PM   
kittinSol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112
So you consider $30Billion to fight AIDS in Africa "stupid"?


Aren't you exaggerating the figure just a tad? I thought it was more to the tune of 9 billion all in all, if all went well.  Anyway... I consider that good PR. And it surprises me that you should hold that as an example of his virtue.



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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:51:17 PM   
kittinSol


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Abstinence will prevent Aids, that's true. Unless, of course, you can't keep that proverbial aspirin between your legs  .

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:52:31 PM   
cjan


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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112


quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Rulemylife was spot on: we are witnessing the revisionists at work. It's fantasmagorical to see how lies can take over the truth so transparently. Fascinating.

The $30Billion is fact, kittin. Nothing revisionist about it.


You should know better. Nobody, either in Africa or  anywhere, has gotten a penny of  that money. I suppose the check is in the mail.


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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 2:52:34 PM   
slvemike4u


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At some point perhaps you might even consider refering to "Dear Leader by his name and or tittle....I mean if you are going to start a thread discussing giving Bush his "due"...you might want to look in the mirror and give "Dear Leader" his due...you know being elected President and all.

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 3:01:50 PM   
kittinSol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cjan
You should know better. Nobody, either in Africa or  anywhere, has gotten a penny of  that money. I suppose the check is in the mail.


PR.

PS: mike, mind who you address your  posts to, or I'll have to tweak your nipples again.

< Message edited by kittinSol -- 12/5/2008 3:02:53 PM >


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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 3:06:53 PM   
Edelbrock


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1. Bush did not inherit good economy from Clinton, he inherited a minor recession.
2. Clinton did not create good economy, Reagen did.
3. The economy didn't tank until the Democrats took control of Congress, those running for the office can promise anything they want but the President has very little influence on the economy.  The Executive branch does not control the monies, or write the laws, the Leguslative Branch does.
4. On Katrina, FEMA is NOT a first-response agency, first response is the responsibility of the local governments who both failed dismally.  No one called for FEMA when massive snow storms shut down the North.  In the recent Windstorm Louisville-Metro (Ky) did not call for aid when the entire power system for over a million people was knocked out.  In both cases the local government did its job, and fixed the problem.  And don't give me any guff about how different the scale of the events are, if you live in Hurricane ally, you keep yourself prepared for hurricanes.
5. "We didn't find any WMD in Iraq" technically unture, WMD weapons were found in Iraq (keep reading before you start pissing yourself and calling me stupid) the key is the weapons we found in Iraq were not the ones originally believed to be there.  (Nerve-gas laiden artillery shells, etc).  All of this is irrelevant considering the majority of the Congress approved the war with the exact same information at their disposal.  And more than once on this board George's statements (captured Iraqi general; Google it) have detailed how Iraq's weapons were moved to Syra prior to invasion.
6. The current economic crises  has 2 roots, the Democrat plans forcing lenders to give subprime loans, and labor unions making it unaffordable for major assembly companies like Ford, GM, etc. to operate within the US.  http://info.detnews.com/video/index.cfm?id=1189
7. President's prior to Bush had more than one chance to take out Bin-Laden, they never did it.  (and FYI cause I've read it twice, the US never supported Bin-Laden's particular mujahadeen cell)
8. If you want someone to blame for 9/11 look to the President who gutted both the Intelligence agency and created a wall between them and the FBI.  Give you a hint it wasn't Bush.
9.  The terrorists in India used blackberries to coordinate their operation, doesn't this sound kind of like a case where "warrantless wire-tapping" may have been helpful on the appropriate scale?
10. I can cite resources for ever statement made here, but the bottom line is when people have decided they are going to hate something no amount of source, logic, or reason is going to change their mind.  If you do seek resources to confirm or refute me 5 minutes on Google is all you will need.  The Associated Press website is a great resource.  If my schedule permits I will post resources later, if not use Google.

Now, despite what many of you may think I am not a rabid Bush fan, (not even a Republican) there are many things I disagree with him on that most people don't know or care about.  (Like his attempt to allow the sale of the F-22 Raptor to Israel [who has more than once passed our technology to China] and to Japan) But the fact is there have been many worse Presidents who get credit for things they had nothing to do with, and who's faults are overlooked.  Bush isn't the best, but he is certainly not as bad as he is being made out to be.

A few years ago we demanded change, so we elected a Democrat Congress.  Now we have it.
Democrats state that Republicans and Conservatives dont' care about anything but Big Business.  Yet it is the Democrat Congress that is pushing bailouts that are exceeding our yearly GDP.  It was the Democrat bailouts that allowed banks to buy up one another, and send CEO's on luxury trips.  Not what the bailouts were meant for, the Repubs didn't give this wasted money to the big evil corporations, the Dems did. 

Bush is a man who's been handed nearly impossible problems, maligned, harrassed, and hindered at every turn, time and time again.  Its quite amazing he hasn't folded under the strain.  Equally amazing is that his abysmal approval rating is considerably higher than that of Congress.

Better stop now before I begin to rant.

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RE: They Won't Give Him Credit - 12/5/2008 3:08:30 PM   
Sanity


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As Obama confronts the reality of assuming the office of president, he is sounding more and more like President Bush every day. No to an immediate withdrawal from Iraq, no to increasing taxes on "the rich", and so on.

Anyone else noticing that, other than me?



quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

At some point perhaps you might even consider refering to "Dear Leader by his name and or tittle....I mean if you are going to start a thread discussing giving Bush his "due"...you might want to look in the mirror and give "Dear Leader" his due...you know being elected President and all.


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