RE: What are we

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girl4you2 -> RE: What are we (12/28/2005 2:28:32 AM)
edited: quote: ORIGINAL: DesertRat Head....hurting....must...stop....thinking..... Bob i think that your thoughts are quite valid and backed up with data, so hopefully after your head stops hurting, you'll return with more excellent contributory thoughts. need something for that headache? : )

NakedOnMyChain -> RE: What are we (12/30/2005 10:05:39 AM)
I believe that when it comes down to it we are just another animal, just another life form. Not necessarily the highest, but equally sharing this planet. If we've overrun it that doesn't prove that we are the highest form of life, it simply proves that we're a bit parasitic. After all we are the only species that destroys the earth at such a phenomenal rate that we couldn't possibly replenish what we've used. I also believe that you can't segregate people into set classes of barbarian and civilized. There are so many people in between. People are both barbarians and "civilized" beings at the same time, it's just a matter of which face you display to the world. So many people labeled as barbaric or uncouth could have the kindest hearts, while an upper class pinnacle of civilization just might smile as he's stabbing you in the back. Classification of this kind is merely labeling. Sure, one may appear more one way than another, but there are still tendencies both ways. As for me I'm perfectly fine with being my heathen self.

Lonesoul -> RE: What are we (12/30/2005 11:02:16 PM)
I think you misunderstand what i am trying to find out. I am not wanting to label anyone just wondering how people would classify our society. I was wondering if we were barbarians acting civilized or if we are a society of civilized people with some barbarians in it. I pointed out some recent acts of barbarisms in our society and asked what people thought of them selves as. I am at heart a barbarian. I am not saying that we all are or asking people to tell me what they are but to just thinks about what they are. We put forward in the news that we are a civilized society. But you don't have to look that far into our past as a people or a government to see that we are really barbarians. A lot of people in our society condemn others for their "backward ways" because they don't think and act like we do. Yet when you get down to it that is just another form of barbarism. (don't know if that is a word or not but it fits what I am saying here) I see some of the cruel things we do as a society and wounder where we get the gaul to call ourselves civilized. If you are wondering if I have made up my mind on weather we are barbarians or civilized the answer is give me my ax I have some heads to chop off. That doesn't mean that everyone else has to get there Axe also. Thanks for every-ones input. lonesoul

NakedOnMyChain -> RE: What are we (12/31/2005 8:28:08 AM)
Nope, I don't think I misunderstood at all. At some point we have to label ourselves, if only with the most convenient descriptive terms. It's not necessarily a bad thing. I was simply raising the point that the tendencies for both sides of the coin exist in every human in greater or lesser quantities. I was attempting to express that our culture is neither civilized nor barbaric, it is both entwined. (As is every other culture to varying degrees.) quote: We put forward in the news that we are a civilized society. But you don't have to look that far into our past as a people or a government to see that we are really barbarians. A lot of people in our society condemn others for their "backward ways" because they don't think and act like we do. Yet when you get down to it that is just another form of barbarism. (don't know if that is a word or not but it fits what I am saying here) I see some of the cruel things we do as a society and wounder where we get the gaul to call ourselves civilized. There you hit the nail on the head. I agree nearly 100%. However, it supports my argument. I think that most people would have to admit that to some extent we are civilized. We have (ambiguous though these steps in progress can be) modern medicine and technology, elaborate housing, a many multi-tiered social structure, intricate personal religions, and a functioning (at some level, whether we like it or not) government. However, most people would have to admit that we are barbaric too, as you said so well above. So many people aren't truly far above the impulse to murder, rape and plunder. The urge to be civilized and the urge to be feral exist in all people. It's not that easy to classify this nation, though it would be more efficient if it was.

DesertRat -> RE: What are we (12/31/2005 9:47:54 AM)
I think people have been answering your question all along but are using definitions that differ from yours. It is all a matter of definitions, after all. The bogusiosity of this questions extends beyond definitions applied to groups of people; it can also be applied to their actions and to their material culture. Are cars civilized or barbaric? What about TV? I'm wondering: Did barbarians refer to themselves as such? Did the Goths and other folks who, at various times, sacked Rome say "Hey, fellow barbarians, let's go mess with those civilized pansies down in Italy"? It's an externally applied definition. Bob

Focus50 -> RE: What are we (12/31/2005 2:25:56 PM)
To borrow from more intelligent people than myself, I recall watching a documentary years ago (no idea of the name) that said man is the only creature that lives by reason when compared to all other creatures that live by instinct. But man still has primal instincts (which we tap into when utilising a D/s dynamic). It's reason that allows "civilised" society to form, grow and prosper for the theoretical benefit of all but when it breaks down in extreme circumstances, Katrina for eg, we revert to instinct such as survival of the fittest. When you don't know what to do, you do what comes naturally to you - you survive and hope help arrives! That's why people arm themselves when faced with the breakdown of civilisation or just localised authority like New Orleans. But we don't actually see our individual selves as being the armed menace; we're just trying to survive "other" barbaric armed menaces.... All predators survive by perceived barbarity, especially pack animals, and we're a pack animal who's also the ultimate predator at this point of evolution. But reason also brings tolerance and we're mostly civilised for a greater good - until forced into survival mode.... To answer your original question, man is instinctively a barbaric predator but with the intelligence to form himself into a civilised society. But unlike a nest of ants for eg, we can still survive as individuals when that society breaks down. But it ain't pretty.... Focus.

krikket -> RE: What are we (12/31/2005 9:13:44 PM)
i think, too, that everyone has a little each inside them, which ever is needed is the "dominant" trait at that particular moment. Sometimes we need to civilized and at other times more the barbarian -- too many shades of gray, imho, to generalize about our own civilization. It might be best to leave that to the historians.... jimini quote: ORIGINAL: Lonesoul I have a question. It has nothing to do with bdsm or any kink relation. Are we a Barbaric society acting civilized or a Civilized society with barbarians in it? I have my own opinion on this that I will post at a later time. I want to get some feedback on what everyone else thinks first not discuss what I think. lonesoul

daredevil865 -> RE: What are we (12/31/2005 9:15:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lonesoul I have a question. It has nothing to do with bdsm or any kink relation. Are we a Barbaric society acting civilized or a Civilized society with barbarians in it? I have my own opinion on this that I will post at a later time. I want to get some feedback on what everyone else thinks first not discuss what I think. lonesoul Yes we are both.....and now what?? DareDevil

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