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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/12/2008 12:05:44 PM   
came4U


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Thanks Tigress, your mindset is very interesting, clear and concise. (btw?? are you bisexual? lesbian?)

and yes, age (the ever creeping 40's) does make a difference.  The tolerance and patience level goes up, and I as I call it 'my shock-awareness' level is on minimum now and every type of personality (male or female) has been seen or done before.

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/13/2008 3:55:06 AM   
LaTigresse


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Lesbian, bisexual? That would depend upon who you ask. At this point in life, and especially for this site, I really do consider myself a lesbian. I've no interest in any sort of sexual relationship with a man. If I should change my mind, I've got one available, that is more than willing.

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/13/2008 12:24:23 PM   
came4U


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Ah I see Tigress, well, I guess then it is individual, and no more or less intimidation felt by women of any orientation in regards to men.

thanks for replies

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/13/2008 2:42:50 PM   
atropa7


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Picking KD Lang as representing all lesbians in one music video is vastly over generalizing. Lesbians are not all clones of the same man-hating gyno-fearing women you make them out to be. They are not a monolith and to treat them as such is absurd. The whole premise of this post is disappointing (but not unexpected) and reductionist. Ridiculous, even.


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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/13/2008 3:29:11 PM   
came4U


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I think you didn't read at all. Especially post 11. I never implied lesbian women are man haters.  KD (the vid) is an example of how I have known some who do mock men (see machismo). Also, I never claimed to think lesbians are gyno-fearing.  I actually discovered that it depends on the person yet, I do find fewer lesbians do fear being behind the sheet so to speak. If my question that the possibility of lesbians being less intimidated by men is ridiculous to you and you read into it that they all hate men, I question your own reasoning, but I discount it (not my business). I got quite a few more satisfactory answers here and elsewhere to understand.

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/13/2008 3:43:18 PM   
Daddysredhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: came4U

OOOOOk, so I was listening and actually analyzing K.D.Lang's video of her song 'Constant Craving', and wondered....


This is my favorite song to sing at kareoke.  I have never analyzed the video the way you just did.  I'm happy that I can just enjoy the music and not over-think it.  I didn't get any of what you spoke of from this song or video.

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/13/2008 8:01:38 PM   
came4U


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quote:

I didn't get any of what you spoke of from this song or video.


is ok, very few do lol.


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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/13/2008 8:29:05 PM   
popeye1250


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K.D. Lang, ooooooooouuuuu!
I can just see her in red high heels, long black stockings and a black leather garterbelt!

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/13/2008 8:47:27 PM   
stella41b


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quote:

ORIGINAL: came4U

Lesbianosis: NOT a medical term. Some might think of it as a delibitating (change delibitating to delabiatating lol) disease that makes some women prone to not want cock or even sexual contact with the male species. Most men are probably allergic to it. Many other 'straight' women are llikely to think it is hereditary if you want to hang out with them. Also known as (latin) Leslabiaosis Intolerant.



I'm going to come in here and perhaps complicate matters somewhat.

One thing which never ceases to surprise me is the fixation in the minds of (mainly) heterosexuals on someone's genitalia. Seriously, this sort of thing fascinates me no end, especially that mental process which makes them unable to deal with another person until they have worked out what genitalia the other person has and their assumptions which come afterwards.

I'm a transgendered female, I identify myself as a lesbian but I am such because I prefer intimacy and relationships with a woman as a whole, i.e. a complete woman, not just for the fact that she's got a pussy between her legs. My preference has got nothing to do with genitalia, but more with emotional signals they give off. Intimacy to me isn't lying naked in bed next to someone, but being able to correctly give out and interpret emotional signals and be completely open and emotionally transparent with each other.

I'm transgendered, not because I'm a male trying to be a female, but because I'm a female born with a penis and primary male physical characteristics and secondary female physical characteristcs but inside me, the mindset, emotions, genes, erogenous zones and increasing the hormones that run through my bloodstream are female.

The only way of knowing previously was gender dysphoria - unhappiness with my gender. This is a mental condition, not an illness which is controlled by hormones, my own mindset, but also by the way other people treat me. This is why I suffer from depression, particularly anxiety based depression. Gender dysphoria is nothing more than an inner conflict - tension, stress, anxiety - which is exacerbated every time I am perceived as male by someone else, wherein I know and see myself as female.

This has got as much to do with other people as it has with me. There is a marked difference, which is reliable in 95% of all cases, over the way people treat me and perceive me in knowing whether I am pre-op or post-op. Most people really do want to know what I have in my underwear, even if there's no possibility of me sleeping with them.

Human nature I guess.

However what very few people even stop to consider or even think about when they discover that I am pre-op and do have a penis is my relationship with that piece of my anatomy. This is where the crux of the matter though really lies. A male is psychologically very attached to their penis, I am not. To me it's not a penis, it's a birth defect, a scar, it's prevented me having children, experiencing even the most basic aspects of womanhood, and denies me physical intimacy with a partner - something which is just as important for them as it would be for me.
It's cost me a lot of misery, emotional pain, heartache, and disappointment. I look forward to the day when I wake up and it isn't there and I'm prepared to go through all the pain and discomfort for that day.

I chose the phrase human nature carefully, because I can reverse the OP and describe perhaps with a little more accuracy that mental condition known as penis fixation which affects quite a number of men and a number of women too. Part of this is the assumption that a woman, irrespective of her preferences and who she is, needs vaginal penetration in order to feel fulfilled simply because she has a vagina.

This is I guess behind what a lot of people think, or assume, in that once I have my SRS gender reassignment surgery I'm going to want to have a relationship with a man because I will have acquired a vagina and I will need a penis inside me to feel fulfilled. First thing is I'm not changing my gender, but merely removing all what prevents me being me and my own gender - female. Secondly this process has got nothing to do with my sexual orientation.

It's important also to remember that I am consensually accepted by lesbians as one of them, and not universally. I meet the criteria but I am not always compatible with another lesbian, for through my own socialization and conditioning I give off both male and female emotional signals. However many lesbians are, at least in a social context, transgender-friendly, but there are some lesbians who aren't at all trans-friendly, just as there are lesbians who aren't really lesbians but having a pussy makes them think they are.

It really is all down to preferences with whom each and every one of us choose to share ourselves and our bedspace with.

To me there's no such thing as lesbianosis, only a fixation with plugs and sockets, or with genitals, which comes from having a mindset fixated on cultural stereotypes based on stereotypical binary gender based role models.

People are people, everyone is an individual, and release from mental enslavement is always so liberating.

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/13/2008 9:13:39 PM   
Aszhrae


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quote:

ORIGINAL: stella41b

quote:

ORIGINAL: came4U

Lesbianosis: NOT a medical term. Some might think of it as a delibitating (change delibitating to delabiatating lol) disease that makes some women prone to not want cock or even sexual contact with the male species. Most men are probably allergic to it. Many other 'straight' women are llikely to think it is hereditary if you want to hang out with them. Also known as (latin) Leslabiaosis Intolerant.



I'm going to come in here and perhaps complicate matters somewhat.

One thing which never ceases to surprise me is the fixation in the minds of (mainly) heterosexuals on someone's genitalia. Seriously, this sort of thing fascinates me no end, especially that mental process which makes them unable to deal with another person until they have worked out what genitalia the other person has and their assumptions which come afterwards.

I'm a transgendered female, I identify myself as a lesbian but I am such because I prefer intimacy and relationships with a woman as a whole, i.e. a complete woman, not just for the fact that she's got a pussy between her legs. My preference has got nothing to do with genitalia, but more with emotional signals they give off. Intimacy to me isn't lying naked in bed next to someone, but being able to correctly give out and interpret emotional signals and be completely open and emotionally transparent with each other.

I'm transgendered, not because I'm a male trying to be a female, but because I'm a female born with a penis and primary male physical characteristics and secondary female physical characteristcs but inside me, the mindset, emotions, genes, erogenous zones and increasing the hormones that run through my bloodstream are female.

The only way of knowing previously was gender dysphoria - unhappiness with my gender. This is a mental condition, not an illness which is controlled by hormones, my own mindset, but also by the way other people treat me. This is why I suffer from depression, particularly anxiety based depression. Gender dysphoria is nothing more than an inner conflict - tension, stress, anxiety - which is exacerbated every time I am perceived as male by someone else, wherein I know and see myself as female.

This has got as much to do with other people as it has with me. There is a marked difference, which is reliable in 95% of all cases, over the way people treat me and perceive me in knowing whether I am pre-op or post-op. Most people really do want to know what I have in my underwear, even if there's no possibility of me sleeping with them.

Human nature I guess.

However what very few people even stop to consider or even think about when they discover that I am pre-op and do have a penis is my relationship with that piece of my anatomy. This is where the crux of the matter though really lies. A male is psychologically very attached to their penis, I am not. To me it's not a penis, it's a birth defect, a scar, it's prevented me having children, experiencing even the most basic aspects of womanhood, and denies me physical intimacy with a partner - something which is just as important for them as it would be for me.
It's cost me a lot of misery, emotional pain, heartache, and disappointment. I look forward to the day when I wake up and it isn't there and I'm prepared to go through all the pain and discomfort for that day.

I chose the phrase human nature carefully, because I can reverse the OP and describe perhaps with a little more accuracy that mental condition known as penis fixation which affects quite a number of men and a number of women too. Part of this is the assumption that a woman, irrespective of her preferences and who she is, needs vaginal penetration in order to feel fulfilled simply because she has a vagina.

This is I guess behind what a lot of people think, or assume, in that once I have my SRS gender reassignment surgery I'm going to want to have a relationship with a man because I will have acquired a vagina and I will need a penis inside me to feel fulfilled. First thing is I'm not changing my gender, but merely removing all what prevents me being me and my own gender - female. Secondly this process has got nothing to do with my sexual orientation.

It's important also to remember that I am consensually accepted by lesbians as one of them, and not universally. I meet the criteria but I am not always compatible with another lesbian, for through my own socialization and conditioning I give off both male and female emotional signals. However many lesbians are, at least in a social context, transgender-friendly, but there are some lesbians who aren't at all trans-friendly, just as there are lesbians who aren't really lesbians but having a pussy makes them think they are.

It really is all down to preferences with whom each and every one of us choose to share ourselves and our bedspace with.

To me there's no such thing as lesbianosis, only a fixation with plugs and sockets, or with genitals, which comes from having a mindset fixated on cultural stereotypes based on stereotypical binary gender based role models.

People are people, everyone is an individual, and release from mental enslavement is always so liberating.



Yes, finally.
Thank you so very much stella.        
For me, personally, girl just finds the whole thought of intimacy with a guy revolting and girl does not trust them at all beyond being social.

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/13/2008 11:04:42 PM   
came4U


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quote:

This is I guess behind what a lot of people think, or assume, in that once I have my SRS gender reassignment surgery I'm going to want to have a relationship with a man because I will have acquired a vagina and I will need a penis inside me to feel fulfilled.


VERY interesting Stella.

so, is that what this type of macho man assumes, that because we have a vagina that we NEED a penis to comfort or the as the only means of satisfaction?

quote:

The only way of knowing previously was gender dysphoria - unhappiness with my gender. This is a mental condition, not an illness which is controlled by hormones, my own mindset, but also by the way other people treat me.  


I believe KD went through this stage several times in her life and  she is now quite comfortable in men's clothes (in public).  Be damned with them she claims. 

I wonder if her use of wearing a striped shirt in the vid represents her 'imprisonment' in her female flesh and all the heartache that comes with that ownership hmm? 

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/14/2008 2:50:34 AM   
ResidentSadist


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My only questions is does anyone think there is symbolism rooted in the fact she sits in the back seat of 60s Citroen?  . . . other than it is one of the nicer cars ever made. 

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/14/2008 7:05:00 AM   
TNstepsout


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I'm not quite sure what you're asking here, but I'll answer as best I can. I am bisexual. I don't hate men, but I find many men to be clueless and irritating. I'm not intimidated by men, not those who try, or any other man. ( I can't say it's always been that way, but it is now) That doesn't mean I try to intimidate them back or feel I have something to prove. If he messes with me, I mess back, if he doesn't, I leave him alone. To each his own. I don't like arrogance so I don't find any arrogant man attractive. It's just a buzzkill for me. Arrogant men will have their own interpretation of that. I don't care.

My attraction to women is not about the parts they don't have and has everything to do with the parts they do have. Women are sexy!

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/14/2008 7:57:27 AM   
colouredin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TNstepsout

I don't hate men, but I find many men to be clueless and irritating.


I find women can be clueless and irritating too :P

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/14/2008 8:16:32 AM   
DesFIP


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Didn't watch the whole video but it appears very Great Depression influenced. More political than sexual.

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/14/2008 1:13:19 PM   
came4U


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quote:

My only questions is does anyone think there is symbolism rooted in the fact she sits in the back seat of 60s Citroen?  . . . other than it is one of the nicer cars ever made. 


After a few mins research..I discovered

in the Abbriviation Database (www.acronymfinder.com)

CCC = Citroen Car Club
and
CCC= Classic Closet Case (gay/lesbian/bisexual slang; aka triple C)

Also, according to gaywheels.com and autoblognews the Citroen is classified as being in the top homosexual-friendly manufacturer of cars.

it could mean anything, or could mean she just likes older model cars or has a good budget to rent for the vid.

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/14/2008 3:25:35 PM   
popeye1250


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What?
KD Lang is a lesbian?
There goes all my fantasies!
Next thing you know people will be telling me that Hugh Grant is a male!

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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/14/2008 3:28:07 PM   
BKSir


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

What?
KD Lang is a lesbian?
There goes all my fantasies!
Next thing you know people will be telling me that Hugh Grant is a male!


I don't know if I'd go that far...


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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/15/2008 10:48:16 AM   
MissEnchanted


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came4,

From what I've heard: Most of the time what happens in music videos comes from the Director's brain and not the artist.




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RE: I think I understand it: Lesbianosis - 12/15/2008 12:00:35 PM   
came4U


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Miss Enchanted...awesome idea and thank you.

I checked, it is Director Mark Romanek (also claim to fame for vids by Johnny Cash, Jaggar, Red Hot Chili Peppers etc, filmography for the movie One Hour Photo, Robin Williams)

"
The music video is in black-and-white. It presents a fanciful recreation of the premiere of Samuel Beckett's play Waiting for Godot in Paris, 1953. Here, she is depicted singing backstage while the actors perform. The director, Mark Romanek, says the song's lyrics of desperation and waiting fit well with the themes of Beckett's play.[1]
The Rolling Stones later unwittingly used a refrain very similar to "Constant Craving"'s in their 1997 single "Anybody Seen My Baby?". After discovering this, they gave writing credits on that song to k.d. lang and Mink, shared with the original authors Mick Jagger and Keith Richards."

re: Waiting for Godot: Homoerotic Interpretations:
The play calls on only male actors, with scarcely a reference to women, has caused some to look upon Vladimir and Estragon's relationship as quasi-marital: "they bicker, they embrace each other, they depend upon each other [.... T]hey might be thought of as a married couple."[81]
Certainly, the pair has a long history — "Who am I to tell my private nightmares to if I can't tell them to you?" asks Gogo of Didi in the opening act[82] — and frequently displays intimacy, although none of it overtly homosexual.

"This interpretation also explains why only male characters are used: females are often seen as mother figures, symbolising compassion, and would obscure the play's fundamental interpretation in the hearts of any audience of any gender. 

Freudian Interpretation:  "who is more instinctual and irrational — is seen as the backward id or subversion of the rational principle. Godot fulfils the function of the superego or moral standards. Pozzo and Lucky are just re-iterations of the main protagonists. Dukore finally sees Beckett's play as a metaphor for the futility of man's existence when salvation is expected from an external entity, and the self is denied introspection."

Jungian Interpretation: "The four archetypal personalities or the four aspects of the soul are grouped in two pairs: the ego and the shadow, the persona and the soul's image (animus or anima). The shadow is the container of all our despised emotions repressed by the ego. Lucky, the shadow serves as the polar opposite of the egocentric Pozzo, prototype of prosperous mediocrity, who incessantly controls and persecutes his subordinate, thus symbolising the oppression of the unconscious shadow by the despotic ego.

This explains a lot more than you would belive..thanks again Miss.
 


 
 




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