Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble across the world

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble across the world

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble across the world

Page: [1] 2 next > >>

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble across t... - 12/21/2008 2:52:56 PM

celticlord2112

Posts: 5732
Status: offline

Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble across the world

The last paragraph is the most interesting.

quote:

The last great era of globalisation peaked just before 1914. You know the rest of the story.

So how will we repeat history?

_____________________________

Profile

Post #: 1

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/21/2008 6:08:16 PM

corysub

Posts: 1492
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

I see your point. Obama is not a free trade guy....already the winds of protectionism are starting to stir. Columbia, a friend of the United States, is being denied favored status by Pelosi...more to come in 2009.

(in reply to celticlord2112)

Profile

Post #: 2

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 12:19:36 AM

awmslave

Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline

I am for free trade with one condition: trade volumes must be approximately equal between countries. It is simple math the trade deficit US is running eventually will crash the system.

(in reply to celticlord2112)

Profile

Post #: 3

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 1:59:50 AM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: corysub

I see your point. Obama is not a free trade guy....already the winds of protectionism are starting to stir. Columbia, a friend of the United States, is being denied favored status by Pelosi...more to come in 2009.

Colombia is our "friend?"
Mexico claims to be our "friend" too.
With those two as "friends" who needs enemies?
As for "most favored nation status" I thought that was singular!
But, there's a bunch of them.
Only "Washington" could come up with shit like that.
"Nation" means "one."
Pick one!

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to corysub)

Profile

Post #: 4

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 3:43:39 AM

variation30

Posts: 1190
Joined: 12/1/2007
From: Alabama
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: awmslave

I am for free trade with one condition: trade volumes must be approximately equal between countries. It is simple math the trade deficit US is running eventually will crash the system.

I'm new to economics but I like it and I want to learn more.

what is a trade deficit?

_____________________________

all the good ones are collared or lesbians.

or old.

(in reply to awmslave)

Profile

Post #: 5

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 5:05:17 AM

MmeGigs

Posts: 706
Joined: 1/26/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: variation30
what is a trade deficit?

It's when we're buying more from other countries than we're selling to them. More money's going out than coming in.

(in reply to variation30)

Profile

Post #: 6

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 6:52:26 AM

Owner59

Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline

Fuck free trade!

That`s another way of saying ,sell our futures to the Chinese so that Walmart can meet it`s monthly earnings goals.

I`m for "fair trade". Sounds similar but the polar opposite in affect.

I`m for trade deals that benefit the middle class workers(who make the goods traded) ,not corporate America,who have basically sold the US down the river for a quick buck.The rats.

If a guy makes shoes for 50 cents a pair,with slave labor and no environmental controls,we`ll say fine,you can sell your shoes here with a 30 dollar tariff per pair(or what ever amount makes those shoes priced fairly compared to other shoes).

We`ve seen what "free trade" has brought us.Our jobs shipped out and poverty shiped in.

That`s going to change in less than 30 days.It couldn`t come sooner.

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 12/22/2008 7:04:05 AM >

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to MmeGigs)

Profile

Post #: 7

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 7:04:26 AM

celticlord2112

Posts: 5732
Status: offline

quote:

If a guy makes shoes for 50 cents a pair,with slave labor and no environmental controls,we`ll say fine,you can sell your shoes here with a 30 dollar tariff per pair(or what ever amount makes those shoes priced fairly compared to other shoes).

Smoot-Hawley 2.0?

So you WANT a return of the Great Depression......

_____________________________

(in reply to Owner59)

Profile

Post #: 8

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 7:09:53 AM

Owner59

Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline

Depression?

No that`s your gig, buddy.

We`re almost there,too.4 more years would have sinched it.Sorry to dash your plans.

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to celticlord2112)

Profile

Post #: 9

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 7:30:37 AM

MzMia

Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

Fuck free trade!

That`s another way of saying ,sell our futures to the Chinese so that Walmart can meet it`s monthly earnings goals.

I`m for "fair trade". Sounds similar but the polar opposite in affect.

I`m for trade deals that benefit the middle class workers(who make the goods traded) ,not corporate America,who have basically sold the US down the river for a quick buck.The rats.

If a guy makes shoes for 50 cents a pair,with slave labor and no environmental controls,we`ll say fine,you can sell your shoes here with a 30 dollar tariff per pair(or what ever amount makes those shoes priced fairly compared to other shoes).

We`ve seen what "free trade" has brought us.Our jobs shipped out and poverty shiped in.

That`s going to change in less than 30 days.It couldn`t come sooner.

What Owner said!
FUCK free trade!
Power to the people!

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain

What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to Owner59)

Profile

Post #: 10

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 7:36:09 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

If it were anything like free trade in the first place, African countries would still be in boom times right now and in their tenth year at least of such prosperity. There can be after all, no place in the world cheaper to make things for export.

As it is, free trade appears to be merely the replacement metaphor for imperialist trade, where the powers that be make the rules to suit their own ends and damn those who dont like it.

I wonder how many armed guards will be on duty at Canary Wharf and around the LSE tonight and next week that werent there previously?

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to MzMia)

Profile

Post #: 11

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 7:39:24 AM

slaveboyforyou

Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline

Yes, fuck free trade indeed. I really want to pay fifty bucks for a fucking toaster, 400 bucks for a microwave, or 200 bucks for a DVD player. Hey we can go back to the days when the Big 3 didn't have to compete with anyone; we can have great cars like the Pinto and the Edsel again. Man, that would rock!

(in reply to MzMia)

Profile

Post #: 12

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 7:46:54 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

But the point is, you would be earning according to the capacity of the economy which is selling toasters for fifty bucks?

Toasters are only 5 bucks because some guy in China is making them - and each outsourced well paying job being replaced with a low paid job means less money in the economy, necessitating a five buck toaster. Its a vicious spiral, a chase to the bottom that benefits few if any - and as we are seeing now, it isnt even going to benefit those few as the profits they made are evaporated.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)

Profile

Post #: 13

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 7:47:58 AM

Owner59

Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline

So a race to the bottom ,it is.Yes?

We can do better.

I would also make American companies who earn their money here,stay here and not off-shore themselves to avoid paying taxes.

I would jealously enforce that law,no matter who it pissed off.

The corporate free lunch souldn`t be payed for by you and me.

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 12/22/2008 7:53:14 AM >

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)

Profile

Post #: 14

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 7:48:41 AM

MzMia

Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

Yes, fuck free trade indeed. I really want to pay fifty bucks for a fucking toaster, 400 bucks for a microwave, or 200 bucks for a DVD player. Hey we can go back to the days when the Big 3 didn't have to compete with anyone; we can have great cars like the Pinto and the Edsel again. Man, that would rock!

lol, slaveboy you actually made a great point here.
I have considered starting a thread on how many of us would be willing to pay more for
goods and services made in America.
There has to be some middle ground, and for the sake of our country, "the global economy",
and "free trade" I hope we find it.

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain

What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)

Profile

Post #: 15

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 7:49:45 AM

bestbabync

Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
Status: offline

and if we pay more, then that means we all get pay raises, Lady Ellen?

< Message edited by bestbabync -- 12/22/2008 7:51:52 AM >

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)

Profile

Post #: 16

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 7:54:31 AM

MzMia

Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

If it were anything like free trade in the first place, African countries would still be in boom times right now and in their tenth year at least of such prosperity. There can be after all, no place in the world cheaper to make things for export.

As it is, free trade appears to be merely the replacement metaphor for imperialist trade, where the powers that be make the rules to suit their own ends and damn those who dont like it.

I wonder how many armed guards will be on duty at Canary Wharf and around the LSE tonight and next week that werent there previously?

E

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain

What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Profile

Post #: 17

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 8:02:09 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

and if we pay more, then that means we all get pay raises, Lady Ellen?

Yes, each according to the value of his work as relative to others - rather than according to the value of his work when done by a slave labourer in a sweatshop.

There is more money in the economy if the toaster man and millions like him are being paid well, as he can be when his work is fifty bucks a go at retail. After that it is up to the toaster guy and the rest to negotiate wages and in an economy where there are many well paid jobs, he can go elsewhere if he needs to.

The situation we are in has certainly proved the converse to be correct; lower numbers of well paid jobs has reduced the money in the economy so that it becomes necessary to buy in the toaster from China as no one can afford a domestic product.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to bestbabync)

Profile

Post #: 18

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 8:06:30 AM

MzMia

Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

and if we pay more, then that means we all get pay raises, Lady Ellen?

Yes, each according to the value of his work as relative to others - rather than according to the value of his work when done by a slave labourer in a sweatshop.

There is more money in the economy if the toaster man and millions like him are being paid well, as he can be when his work is fifty bucks a go at retail. After that it is up to the toaster guy and the rest to negotiate wages and in an economy where there are many well paid jobs, he can go elsewhere if he needs to.

The situation we are in has certainly proved the converse to be correct; lower numbers of well paid jobs has reduced the money in the economy so that it becomes necessary to buy in the toaster from China as no one can afford a domestic product.

E

Some of us get it {Myself, Lady E, Owner and others} and some don't.
Problem is, Lady E.....many have bought into this "free trade" bullshit and don't see
the bigger picture.
We would pay more for certain goods and services, but we would also make more.

Some rather buy cheap and work for peanuts.

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain

What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Profile

Post #: 19

RE: Protectionist dominoes are beginning to tumble acro... - 12/22/2008 8:24:07 AM

slaveboyforyou

Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline

No we wouldn't make more. The companies that do manufacture goods wouldn't be able to compete globally, and they would ultimately fail. Economic isolationism does not work; it's been done before. When you place tarriffs on goods, the countries you're penalizing will follow suit. Do you want us to do that with countries like China? We can go back to the good ol' days of them being isolated and impoverished. We can forget having a market of over a billion people to sell our own products to. If you want to see protectionism at it's worst in this country, look no further than agriculture. It's a big reason why fruits and vegetables are so expensive. I blame our country's obesity epidemic partly on agricultural subsidies. The consumer (the people as many of you like to call it) are the ones that lose in a protectionist economy.

(in reply to MzMia)

Profile

Post #: 20