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RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/11/2004 11:48:29 AM

MistressDREAD

Posts: 2943
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

hmmmm now that sounds
like sumthing I could put
together....... the hokey, the pokey
and sum thorns.... a little music
yes yes I can vision it allready......

Hhahahaha yes a Table just might work both ways.. HAHAHAHA!

Ill say it again...read the title of this post....
quote:

When subs become stalkers
were You screaming wolf then?? It doesent say IF* subs become, it say WHEN subs become hence a reality allready in Your mind facing hence My comments I will stand behind.
FYI One does not negotiate with stalkers....................sorry.

quote:

Im not hearing You being concensual in the others actions nor safe iin thinking in one breath a stalker and the next breath Hey I can handle this. Ive seen such situations quickly get out of control and a bad end result. JMO

(in reply to afmvdp)

Post #: 21

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/11/2004 12:13:35 PM

kirameaMW

Posts: 18
Joined: 4/30/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: afmvdp

Anyone else ever have any problems when you run into one of these people that after a single session or a few conversations seem to think that they are unavoidably bound to your ankles? It's cute at first but when they won't let you be and start infringing on your personal space when does it go from minor irritation to time to get the restraining order.

As I'm currently in process of taking on a new submissive to start training with and this one doesn't seem to want to accept that it's not going to be her. She's already showed up at my doorstep in the middle of the night, just don't want to see what's going to happen when she sees me with the new trainee.

I've had some minor issues from time to time with people who had actually lived under me for a while having separation issues, but after time they realize that I never leave their lives and am always there for them. But these one day wonder types that think that you are their soul mate after a night sort of freak me out. Any tips or red flags I should look out for?

i just had that happen to me, but mine was a "Dom". Luckily, he hasn't shown up on my doorstep, but i was getting way too many emails/IM's and phone calls. When i asked Him to slow down, he accused me of not only being paranoid but also a drama queen. Master got on the IM and tried to explain it to the guy, but it only got him more agitated. i finally told this guy that i had nothing to give him and blocked him from contacting me.

One of the things that i would suggest You do in the future is get to know them VERY well online through emails and IM's. If You do decide to talk to them on the phone, either get a cell phone or call them using *69 to keep Your phone number from showing up (until You're confident they're not nuts).

i do know that if anyone came knocking on my door at 3am will be the last time i will have contact with them. The same goes for phone calls at that hour; you better have a damn good reason to be calling/coming over at that time (meaning you better be dying or something to that effect).

(in reply to afmvdp)

Post #: 22

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/11/2004 1:47:40 PM

afmvdp

Posts: 494
Joined: 7/10/2004
Status: offline

Dread, I wouldn't consider it "crying wolf" I would consider it a hyperbole. It was more of a question of "in the case of" and also quite honestly after being very direct with her she was able to understand and to my relief handled things better than I had feared, thus my lack of worry. Her initial actions though did throw me a bit off guard. I would consider her actions taken at first to be of a stalker-esque nature her followup was not.

(in reply to MistressDREAD)

Post #: 23

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/11/2004 1:51:47 PM

afmvdp

Posts: 494
Joined: 7/10/2004
Status: offline

I normally have no relation of any type with anyone who I do not know rather well first. This was just an off chance person I happened to meet unexpectedly while out clubbing. I violated my own personal code, which I have stated previously and in return I got a glaring example of exactly why I have my code in the first place. There will always be crazy people in the world...I just prefer to have as few as possible in my life.

(in reply to kirameaMW)

Post #: 24

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/11/2004 3:47:23 PM

MistressDREAD

Posts: 2943
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

allright afmvdp

I hope Your right.

My better mind

in reading Your

words even now

gives Me pause.

(in reply to afmvdp)

Post #: 25

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/11/2004 4:02:09 PM

afmvdp

Posts: 494
Joined: 7/10/2004
Status: offline

Well I appreciate the concern regardless.

(in reply to MistressDREAD)

Post #: 26

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/11/2004 6:06:11 PM

MizSuz

Posts: 1881
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: afmvdp

I don't think it has anything to do with being Macho...just make it a rule of thumb not to involve others that don't need to be involved. Things look like they are working the way they need to so that is all that matters.

I'm glad it's looking like things are working out.

Yes, I've experienced it. From subs, from dominants, from people not even in the scene. I've experienced it online and r/t, and a combination of the two. Borderline Personality Disorder tends to predispose people to go from idealizing someone to reviling them, often in very short jumps.

I'm with Estring. Diplomacy be damned. I don't recall you saying you signed on to be her baby sitter or therapist. You're not responsible for her not being able to accept something (unless you're sending mixed messages). Tact is only a bad thing when it's to the detriment of the message.

Someone recently wrote me to tell me that they were obsessed with me, asking "What should I do?" My reply was to point out that their refusal to accept what is (I'm not looking) has created their conundrum, and asked why they think I would have the answer to the puzzle they created themself. I reminded them that their answers live inside themself. I then stopped answering further correspondence.

If she shows up at your door again, after having told her not to, you might consider making a phone call to have her removed by uniformed escort. Often your willingness to do this can be a good deterent to future episodes.

_____________________________

“The more you love, the more you can love—and the more intensely you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are decent and just.”
- Robert Heinlein

(in reply to afmvdp)

Post #: 27

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/13/2004 3:19:14 PM

LadyAngelika

Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: afmvdp
just make it a rule of thumb not to involve others that don't need to be involved. Things look like they are working the way they need to so that is all that matters.

It’s interesting that you are all relating issues that happen at the beginning of a relationship or even before one can take place. I believe you can only tell if someone is a nut job when something goes wrong and they are put to the test. Sure there are signs, but then again, hindsight is 20/20…

After breaking up with a man I dated for over a year, he stalked me, then he called me at 3am as well as at work. There were the hateful emails and even live journal entries about me and the bitch that I was. At first I reacted but very quickly I was given the advice to ignore. Then when he didn’t get the reactions from me, came the suicide attempt on his part.

It has been over 2 years since he has last contacted me. I did get my cousin who is a lawyer involved, but like afmvdp, I don’t like getting a whole bunch of people involved. It was already embarrassing enough.

I'm glad things are looking better afmvdp.

- LA

< Message edited by LadyAngelika -- 8/13/2004 3:20:55 PM >

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to afmvdp)

Post #: 28

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/13/2004 10:14:12 PM

ShesMissySassy

Posts: 6
Joined: 4/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

Aftercare for a week? Maybe if they are hit with a table.

You're a riot ... <giggle>

Thanks for the smile.

Sassy. xoxox

quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring

We don't owe a crazy person anything. If they are going to fall in love with you after a session, that is their problem. If they can't understand when you tell them " I am not interested ", that is their problem. We are not children, we are adults. If some choose to act childish and irrational, that is not my problem.
Aftercare for a week? Maybe if they are hit with a table.

(in reply to Estring)

Post #: 29

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/23/2004 3:27:59 PM

Krow

Posts: 6
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

You know I wish I had the answer to judge between those that are normal and those that would potentially boil a rabit in your pot. But alas I have no answers in that area except make sure you have a security system or a good healthy pistol.
How ever I would advise to look back and see where maybe there where some words that got misunderstood by either you or that other.
play safe,
Krow

(in reply to afmvdp)

Post #: 30

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/25/2004 7:50:17 AM

LadyShoshin

Posts: 492
Joined: 7/19/2004
From: Burlington, Ontario
Status: offline

Sometimes being kind and gentle doesn't work, it can send mixed messages. I tried the kind and gentle on the ego approach, when that didn't work, I was honest and blunt. Seems to have worked, I believe he has found someone else. I am happy for him if it works, but don't see how it can until he gets professional help to deal with his issues.

_____________________________

PHLOX: “It’s unethical for a doctor to cause harm...I can inflict as much pain as I like.”

(in reply to sorriah)

Post #: 31

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/25/2004 8:15:33 AM

stormiKnightBEAR

Posts: 306
Joined: 3/14/2004
Status: offline

This thread blew this girl's mind.

Yesterday a good friend informed this girl that his job was in jeopardy.
Seems he was speaking with a girl from California that came to the conclusion,
that after chatting for a couple of weeks as friends, she was in love with him.

When he reminded her that he is still legally bound to another, and that the
only thing they had in common was being online friends. That he was not looking for
phone sex or a new wife just for someone to talk to about daily life and the such.
She took it up on herself to contact his employer.

Now, this is an attorney, have known him for many years and yes actually
got to chatting with him thru bdsm channels. He has an interest but has never
been off line with this desire according to him. He's employeed by a major city.

He's now waiting to see if emails from a lunatic woman who thinks she's in love with
him will cost his job. He now knows how it is to be stalked. In two days His life is in ruins.

Having his phone changed and trying to explain that after the same number for 30 yrs.
It's a mess...

This girl wishes you the very best with your problem.

Be safe,
stormi
property of Master Bear

_____________________________

owned white silk slave of TEMJI aka Master Bear

PROUD TO BE TEXAN AND AMERICAN BY BIRTH~
GOD BLESS TEXAS AND THE U.S.A !!!!

(in reply to afmvdp)

Post #: 32

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/25/2004 9:00:47 AM

LadyShoshin

Posts: 492
Joined: 7/19/2004
From: Burlington, Ontario
Status: offline

I am sorry that your friend is going through this hell. I would hope that he would go to his employer, sit down and explain that he was talking to this woman via the internet, that he believes she is unstable and is about to apply for a restraining order. If the topic of lifestyle is brought up, I am sure being a lawyer, he can sidestep it and leave the employer with the impression that all of this exists in the woman's mind & was misconstrued. Unless of course he was playing with her online and she has sent logs to the employer, in which case it is better to come clean and explain that it is a fantasy online roleplay that has no impact on his ability to do his job.

_____________________________

PHLOX: “It’s unethical for a doctor to cause harm...I can inflict as much pain as I like.”

(in reply to stormiKnightBEAR)

Post #: 33

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/25/2004 9:13:50 AM

sub4hire

Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

This sort of thing happens all the time. On and off the net. Vanilla or lifestyle relationships. On the net it is just a bit tougher to know if they are a nut job.

This is why we need to set up our own limits about when we give out any sort of personal info. Whether Dominant or submissive does not matter. I always said to prospectives before submission we went by my rules. Don't push me...or else I'd walk away. Let me go at my own pace.

Of course this has no bearing to you. People tend to think Dominants are never stalked. Well, everyone is stalked at some time or place. I was once stalked by an african diplomats son. Talk about scary and diplomatic immunity. However, I'm still here. He was deported. It was a mess but we somehow make it through.

Just try to be more careful in the future. I don't know what else to say to you. There is nothing that can be said to make things right.

(in reply to afmvdp)

Post #: 34

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/25/2004 1:48:13 PM

stormiKnightBEAR

Posts: 306
Joined: 3/14/2004
Status: offline

Thank You for your reply Lady Shoshin.

That is basically what this girl advised him to do as well.
Only thing that is different is that he has a moral clause on
his contract. This girl advised him to just play plain dumb.
"I met her on a internet chat room.. <which is true> as I
have made many friends from all over."

This girl truly believes that it is what he is saying as in the
3 or 4 yrs she has known him, she's never known him to lie.
(Yes we met face to face) He's even offered legal advice a time
or two.

The thing that stormi reminded him of if infact the girl does try to
send logs is that logs can be doctored. It is so easy to doctor them,
reload them, then make them look the same as the original.

This girl hates that anyone has to go thru this. But having been the
victim of a stalker in my late teens into my early twenties, stormi
completely understands the ...... horror, the embarrassment, the
complete heart stopping fear that sometimes grabs you. This girl
would not even wish it on her worst enemy.

Be Well and Thank You again Ma'am.

stormi
property of Master Bear

_____________________________

owned white silk slave of TEMJI aka Master Bear

PROUD TO BE TEXAN AND AMERICAN BY BIRTH~
GOD BLESS TEXAS AND THE U.S.A !!!!

(in reply to LadyShoshin)

Post #: 35

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/25/2004 5:19:07 PM

LadyShoshin

Posts: 492
Joined: 7/19/2004
From: Burlington, Ontario
Status: offline

Excellent advice, I am sure that if he is called into his boss's office and presented with logs of conversations, he can point out that anyone with minimal experience could doctor innocent logs to say whatever they wanted them to say. I am sure he will be under the microscope for a bit, but if he keeps his cool and does the best job he can, they will pass the stalker off as just another nut job. It would hold more water if he filed for a restraining order before he gets called on the carpet.

_____________________________

PHLOX: “It’s unethical for a doctor to cause harm...I can inflict as much pain as I like.”

(in reply to stormiKnightBEAR)

Post #: 36

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/25/2004 5:37:22 PM

afmvdp

Posts: 494
Joined: 7/10/2004
Status: offline

Coming from somone who has lost a job due to a relationship fallout, it is a really devestating thing and even though you can fight the grounds for dismissal and likely keep your job you can never erase a persons memories or judgements.

(in reply to LadyShoshin)

Post #: 37

RE: When subs become stalkers - 8/26/2004 1:47:30 PM

Enki

Posts: 6
Joined: 8/26/2004
From: Boston, MA
Status: offline

I won't repeat the good that's already been said so I'll just add two points.

First, on some of the stories about Doms becoming the stalkers. If you run across a Dom that is making overly with the phone calls, following you, etc... That person is not a Dom. That is a poorly adjusted human being with control issues. The -most- important aspect of being a Dom is being responsible for yourself and your actions, and being able to rise above neediness.

Enter point two: Accountability. Having a sub become a stalker is a real drag, yes. I'm sure it has happened in varying degrees to a majority. However.. Make sure you're not partially responsible for it happening. A lot of Doms, particularly those whose primary interest is cultivating trust and intense power exchange, up to the idea of ownership, employ really heavy duty psychological techniques. If you take a mental gimlet to a sub, and -make them yours-, if you at some point later are done with that arrangement for whatever reason you have a responsibility to take your hooks out. If you don't understand that or, or how to do it, you should figure it out before you even consider enforcing your will on someone to that degree. Dropping a sub that you've trained is as important a decision and as involved a matter as training them. Maybe more, because being trained is something they -want- and getting dropped is probably something they -don't- want.

(in reply to afmvdp)

Post #: 38

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