Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

Artificial intelligence


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> Artificial intelligence Page: [1] 2   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Artificial intelligence - 1/26/2009 2:28:34 PM   
KaineD


Posts: 497
Joined: 2/14/2006
Status: offline 		I'm fascinated by the topic of artifical intelligence and whether or not it will one day be possible to create a machine that is aware of its own existence and aware of the world around it.  Consciousness in a machine.

Occasionally I'll surf the net for any information regarding the topic.  One interesting thing that people do is build computers to try and pass the turing test.  Basically what the turing test is, judges will use a chat program to chat with humans and computers, and if they are fooled and think the computer is a human, then the computer passes the test.  This used to be the standard for judging if a computer achieved AI, but now it seems the turing test is no longer adequate.  Give a program enough coding and phrases and responses, and it will fool a judge - but it doesn't mean the program isn't intelligent.

One thing I have come across though that looks promising, is a group of researchers that are trying to "reverse engineer" the human brain.  Sounds kinda kooky, but they're actually making good progress.  Using a program called BOINC, they have thousands of volunteers linked through the internet to lend the researches their collective computing power.  So what they're doing, is they've got a neural network simulator, and they've already been able to simulate over 100 billion neurons.

http://www.intelligencerealm.com/aisystem/system.php

So you can download BOINC if you want and lend these guys a little bit of computing power.  I think its pretty cool.  It seems like the most promising project for achieving artificial intelligence anyway.
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/26/2009 2:31:09 PM   
JustDarkness


Posts: 1461
Joined: 7/25/2008
Status: offline 		can we make a BOINC CM clan ;)

btw..is their a clients that uses nvidia cards through CUDA for this?
mmm yes it is the same I already run..for other projects

http://boinc.berkeley.edu/cuda.php

quote:

Two projects currently have GPU-enabled applications: GPUgrid.net and SETI@home. If your computer has a recent NVIDIA GPU, you can compute 2X to 10X faster than with your CPU alone


< Message edited by JustDarkness -- 1/26/2009 2:32:47 PM >

(in reply to KaineD)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/26/2009 3:52:49 PM   
awmslave


Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

group of researchers that are trying to "reverse engineer" the human brain

Do they know how brain works? If not, how do they reverse-engineer? To my knowledge nobody really knows how brain works.

(in reply to KaineD)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/26/2009 3:58:44 PM   
philosophy


Posts: 5284
Joined: 2/15/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: awmslave

quote:

group of researchers that are trying to "reverse engineer" the human brain

Do they know how brain works? If not, how do they reverse-engineer? To my knowledge nobody really knows how brain works.



Do we know precisely how the brain works? No.
Do we have a working knowledge of how large portin work? Yes. How do you think brain surgery or some pharmaceuticals work?

Of course we can reverse engineer those portions we understand, and we can learn from that process how other parts work better. Knowledge is not black and white, it is incremental...knowing how the brain works is one thing we have been working on for quite some time, so we have made progress.

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/26/2009 4:36:27 PM   
awmslave


Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

Do we have a working knowledge of how large portion work? Yes. How do you think brain surgery or some pharmaceuticals work?


To my knowledge brain surgery and pharmaceuticals are mostly based on trial and error method. Brain surgery just takes advantage of the known flexibility of brain (brain can restore function using left over parts). Narcotics have been around thousands years. As much as I know  we can measure brain activity and we have lot of knowledge about electrical and chemical impulses and neuron connections. I have not seen the model how brain stores and processes information. Maybe somebody has a good link to help me out. For example how exactly long- and short-term memories are stored, accessed and what type of algorithms are used?
To my understanding the "artificial intelligence" project you refer to is basically extended parallel processing project using existing computer hardware and principles well known.


(in reply to philosophy)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/26/2009 4:43:08 PM   
samboct


Posts: 1817
Joined: 1/17/2007
Status: offline 		I dunno about artificial intelligence, but we've been very successful at creating artificial stupidity.  I don't know why, the natural stuff isn't in short supply....

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/26/2009 7:55:34 PM   
philosophy


Posts: 5284
Joined: 2/15/2004
Status: offline 		..for your edification....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_brain

.....a certain amount of what we know about the brain came from trial and error, but many things have now been worked out. i seriously doubt modern brain surgeons could get away with advocating brain surgery so they can stick a scalpel in and wiggle it about to see what happens. You  may have read too many Glen Larson cartoons, which i thought impossible.

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/26/2009 10:13:01 PM   
Vendaval


Posts: 10297
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline 		If AI does not exist then why do I waste so much time sweet-talking old machinery and cursing at tech support?  

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE


http://KinkMeet.co.uk

(in reply to KaineD)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 6:20:52 AM   
corysub


Posts: 1492
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		I don't think you will ever be able to create a program that does anymore than solve complex problems.  We can put many things on automatic pilot, have robots that can build an increasing percentage of a car structure, fill bottles, and turn on the coffee in the morning.  Those are things we could figure out with a slide ruler if given enough time...but a computer can never be taught to "think creatively", out of the box, and invent, in my opinon. 

(in reply to KaineD)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 6:27:28 AM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: corysub
a computer can never be taught to "think creatively", out of the box, and invent, in my opinon. 


You'd be surprised. The time of the machines will come.

_____________________________



(in reply to corysub)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 6:34:42 AM   
CatdeMedici


Posts: 2257
Joined: 10/20/2008
Status: offline 		Artificial intelligence is designed and programmed by humans and will always fall short of perfection--it will only be as good as the best human working on it.  IMHO.

_____________________________

I am the Cat, holder of the whip and chair.

"Let's see-whips, dips, chains, chips, yep sounds like a party to Me!"

(in reply to KaineD)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 6:46:05 AM   
KaineD


Posts: 497
Joined: 2/14/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CatdeMedici

Artificial intelligence is designed and programmed by humans and will always fall short of perfection--it will only be as good as the best human working on it.  IMHO.


Not if it has the capacity to learn and grow.

(in reply to CatdeMedici)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 11:35:43 AM   
FRSguy


Posts: 653
Joined: 9/4/2007
Status: offline 		Use to work on A.I.. as a kid.  Its really pretty easy for the most part especially with text conversing.  Its vision and audio that can be a real bitch. As far as a machine that is self aware thats been around since the 60's and is very easy to do.  I did it when I was kid by creating two programs... when the A.I. program searched for an enviromental answer the second program would kick in and invent an answer for it.  So lets say you asked it... what does the wallpaper in your living room look like?  The second program would kick in and add the detail to a simulated enviroment and log it in.... although its fake the A.I. would believe that things were allways a certain way.  All the programs I wrote would melt down at some point however... but mood swings ect. was pretty easy by using bio-rythem software against a sentence scoring system that would score sentences for emotional impact. Its only when you try to get your software to truly look and listen to the outside world that things get difficult.

(in reply to KaineD)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 11:54:40 AM   
philosophy


Posts: 5284
Joined: 2/15/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: corysub
a computer can never be taught to "think creatively", out of the box, and invent, in my opinon. 


You'd be surprised. The time of the machines will come.


...current computer technology is, as we all know, based on a binary paradigm. The circuit is either on or off, and we have become adept at creating mechanisms where '0's and '1's become more complex things. However, if we ever get quantum computing to work, we'll be switching to (if my memory serves) 32 possible states. The resulting complexity and its attendent rise in the possibility of emergent behaviour makes AI a much more likely prospect.

...heres an article on the subject which i can barely understand....lol
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_computer

(in reply to kittinSol)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 12:07:35 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: corysub

I don't think you will ever be able to create a program that does anymore than solve complex problems.  We can put many things on automatic pilot, have robots that can build an increasing percentage of a car structure, fill bottles, and turn on the coffee in the morning.  Those are things we could figure out with a slide ruler if given enough time...but a computer can never be taught to "think creatively", out of the box, and invent, in my opinon.

This is simply wrong. AI software already invents.

Investigate genetic algorithms 

< Message edited by DomKen -- 1/27/2009 12:08:44 PM >

(in reply to corysub)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 12:18:29 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy


...current computer technology is, as we all know, based on a binary paradigm. The circuit is either on or off, and we have become adept at creating mechanisms where '0's and '1's become more complex things. However, if we ever get quantum computing to work, we'll be switching to (if my memory serves) 32 possible states. The resulting complexity and its attendent rise in the possibility of emergent behaviour makes AI a much more likely prospect.

...heres an article on the subject which i can barely understand....lol
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_computer

The advantage in quantum computing isn't in the range of numeric value of each stored bit, if a 0 to 31 value is desired a computer could easily be designed to operate on 5 bit groups which quit eobviously allows for the same 32 values. Quantum computings theoretical advantages lay in the fact that a group of quantum bits can be in a number of different states, values, simultaneously. There are additional ramifications of using quantum states as storage that I don't fully understand.

(in reply to philosophy)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 1:20:48 PM   
awmslave


Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

i seriously doubt modern brain surgeons could get away with advocating brain surgery so they can stick a scalpel in and wiggle it about to see what happens. You may have read too many Glen Larson cartoons, which i thought impossible.


Believe it or not but this is what they do. A patient is awake during the surgery and the communication with a patient tells a surgeon how to proceed.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 1:20:48 PM   
philosophy


Posts: 5284
Joined: 2/15/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

There are additional ramifications of using quantum states as storage that I don't fully understand.


...glad it's not just me then. lol. However, i think the main point is that this new technology promises to be able to do things that the old one couldn't. AI is probably one of them.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 1:22:07 PM   
philosophy


Posts: 5284
Joined: 2/15/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: awmslave

quote:

i seriously doubt modern brain surgeons could get away with advocating brain surgery so they can stick a scalpel in and wiggle it about to see what happens. You may have read too many Glen Larson cartoons, which i thought impossible.


Believe it or not but this is what they do. A patient is awake during the surgery and the communication with a patient tells a surgeon how to proceed.



...only for some procedures. Not for all of them. And even then, the surgeon does know the general area to fiddle with. So, your thesis that we know nada about the brain is clearly claptrap.

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Artificial intelligence - 1/27/2009 1:34:41 PM   
awmslave


Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

So, your thesis that we know nada about the brain is clearly claptrap.


It is not what I think. We know a lot. I just am unable to find much information how brain actually processes  information. Wiki article tells nothing about it. How and where short and long term memories are stored are accessed for example?

(in reply to philosophy)
Profile   Post #: 20
Page:   [1] 2   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> Artificial intelligence Page: [1] 2   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.125