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Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 1:04:13 PM   
Jack45


Posts: 220
Joined: 12/20/2006
Status: offline 		Ship of Fools
quote:

I have been reporting for years that American university graduates have had to take jobs as waitresses and bartenders. As over-indebted American consumers lose their jobs, they will visit restaurants and bars less frequently. Consequently, Americans with university degrees will not even have jobs waiting on tables and mixing drinks.

US policymakers have ignored the fact that consumer demand in the 21st century has been driven, not by increases in real income, but by increased consumer indebtedness. This fact makes it pointless to try to stimulate the economy by bailing out banks so that they can lend more to consumers. The American consumers have no more capacity to borrow.

With the decline in the values of their principal assets--their homes--with the destruction of half of their pension assets, and with joblessness facing them, Americans cannot and will not spend.

Why bail out GM and Citibank when the firms are moving as many operations offshore as they possibly can?

Much of US infrastructure is in poor shape and needs renewing. However, infrastructure jobs do not produce goods and services that can be sold abroad. The massive commitment to infrastructure does nothing to help the US reduce its massive trade deficit, the financing of which is becoming a major problem. Moreover, when the infrastructure projects are completed, so are the jobs.

At best, assuming Mexicans do not get most of the construction jobs, all Obama’s stimulus program can do is to reduce the number of unemployed temporarily.

Unless US corporations can be required to use American labor to produce the goods and services that they sell in American markets, there is no hope for the US economy. No one in the Obama administration has the wits to address this problem. Thus, the economy will continue to implode.

Paul Craig Roberts was Assistant Secretary of the Treasury during President Reagan’s first term.  He was Associate Editor of the Wall Street Journal.  He has held numerous academic appointments, including the William E. Simon Chair, Center for Strategic and International Studies, Georgetown University, and Senior Research Fellow, Hoover Institution, Stanford University. He was awarded the Legion of Honor by French President Francois Mitterrand.
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 1:21:51 PM   
Lynnxz


Posts: 4813
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Atlanta
Status: offline 		Just taking a snip out of this....

quote:

At best, assuming Mexicans do not get most of the construction jobs,




O noes! The Mexicans are taking the jobs!! 

Well, if the white people would quit being offended and take the job, then perhaps there'd be a better mix. As it is, they don't, and immigrants are given most of the jobs. Meh. When we hired (past tense, it's hella slow in the construction buisiness right now) employees, it just naturally happened that almost all of our employees were immigrants, mexican, puerto rican, or otherwise.

If people are too damn lazy to take a job, don't cry about it when someone else does.

Ok, back to your regularly scheduled obama rants.


_____________________________

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RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 1:33:35 PM   
housesub4you


Posts: 1879
Joined: 4/2/2008
Status: offline 		Unless US corporations can be required to use American labor to produce the goods and services that they sell in American markets, there is no hope for the US economy. No one in the Obama administration has the wits to address this problem.


I think this can be said about every president going back to Carter, it is not like we just starting shipping jobs overseas since Jan 20th 2009

(in reply to Lynnxz)
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RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 1:52:09 PM   
awmslave


Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

I have been reporting for years that American university graduates have had to take jobs as waitresses and bartenders.


What is wrong with having well educated waitresses?

quote:

US policymakers have ignored the fact that consumer demand in the 21st century has been driven, not by increases in real income, but by increased consumer indebtedness.

Follow the money: corporate profits have been (until recently) record high. Increased consumer debt translates into increased profits for banks and corporations. The last is good for policymakers; this is where their personal wealth comes from.

quote:

Much of US infrastructure is in poor shape and needs renewing

Would you borrow money for house remodeling if you are suffocating under mountain of debt? No, unless there is an upside. Jobs? I doubt it. The most important benefit is that $800b extra debt goes directly to the banks for profit and this is the bottom line what your government cares about.

quote:

Unless US corporations can be required to use American labor to produce the goods and services that they sell in American markets, there is no hope for the US economy.

It is not true. As long as there  is a buyer it works. Command economy does not work. There are other ways to improve business climate in the US.

(in reply to Jack45)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 2:31:46 PM   
aravain


Posts: 1211
Joined: 8/26/2008
Status: offline 		~FR~

*sigh* I completely agree with this. I know a few people it's happened to (getting an advanced degree and then having to wait tables just to get by). It's just going to get worse.

I'm lucky, unless there's a federal movement to take music and arts out of schools, I'll have a job (or at least several part-time jobs) in the future... most of my other friends... not so much.

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 3:03:24 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		I've been saying this for years and I don't have anywhere near the credentials or letters behind my name as Mr. Roberts.
It's just common sense that if working people make less each year they'll be able to afford to buy less each year. Everytime cos. ship 100,000 blue collar jobs overseas to "save money" we're also losing 30-40,000 white collar jobs as well and the "support" jobs that go with them!
This "global economy" crap *DOES NOT WORK*.
Until we get rid of all those suicidal "free-trade" deals things will *continue to get worse!* We simply cannot continue to allow "big business" to run our government!
Who's better off, the waitress with a "degree" and a $600 nut to pay off over the next 20 years every month on a $120k outstanding student loan or the waitress who can take that $600 per month and invest it over the next 20 years?
Colleges and Universities are training people for "jobs" that aren't or won't be there when they graduate.
I read somewhere where some high schools are graduating 60% of their senior classes who'll be going on to college or uni!
We simply do not need that many people running around with "degrees" in this country.
Politicians are fond of saying that kids will be "graduating for the jobs of the future" or some such nonsense. What jobs? Fifteen bucks an hour jobs in the "service sector?" (If you ask them point blank what jobs they can't tell you!) Sure, some "degrees" are worth persuing like in medicine.
And in other specialised areas.
But, until we get Manufacturing back in this country it's going to be a long slow slide.
The mark of intelligence is to know when something doesn't work and change your course.

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 2/13/2009 3:05:54 PM >

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RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 3:15:48 PM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline 		We live in a global economy....It is actually working pretty much like it should.

Why is anyone surprised?   I really don't understand.  You expected to be able to live a life of luxury while so many others will work and get by on less?  Not going to happen.

Why is anyone even talking about this?   If your work skills, abilities and work ethic can easily be replaced by some person in a third world nation....You have nothing to complain about. 


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RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 3:24:35 PM   
aravain


Posts: 1211
Joined: 8/26/2008
Status: offline 		I don't know if the problem is (necessarily) that there are too many people getting degrees, but that there are too many people getting degrees that are EITHER *TOO* narrow, or *TOO* wide! Degrees that are, essentially, useless in a society that doesn't have a need for it, has laws against it, or has shipped all the jobs offshores to another country with people who, while not *as* highly qualified, are willing to work for less.

I have a friend that's graduating after this semester with a degree in Creative Writing. If she doesn't go on for MORE education, then her degree is completely useless (when it comes to finding a job).

(in reply to popeye1250)
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RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 4:32:36 PM   
awmslave


Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

I have a friend that's graduating after this semester with a degree in Creative Writing. If she doesn't go on for MORE education, then her degree is completely useless (when it comes to finding a job).


It is not useless if she really can write (not be able to despite the degree is quite common). Also, there is a shortage of teachers in many areas. For example; allegedly Detroit has only 50% literacy.

(in reply to aravain)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 5:06:02 PM   
SilverMark


Posts: 3457
Joined: 5/9/2007
Status: offline 		First and foremost not all degrees are career related to the thinking of many.I had a 22 year old working in one of my warehouses with a degree in philosophy...very bright man with no ambition and not much of a desire to pursue further degrees.He'd rather have a relatively easy on the brain, hard on the brawn job so that he can sit around and play music in his mom's basement and smoke dope. I can remember a day when a B.A. in anything could get you a generic middle mgmnt. job at Procter and Gamble or Pitney Bowes etc.
We are graduating some unbelievable number of Business Admin. degrees with no where to put those graduates and it is not anyone's fault but the ones who have decided to pursue those degrees with no plans as to a career path. If someone chooses to pursue a course of study without a plan that is not the global economy at work, it is piss poor planning on the student's part. Of course coming from a guy who has an MS in Public administration and owns retail stores, I have a lot of room to talk. I was once young and idealistic enough to think I could be me and pursue a career in public service and make a real living and if I had been patient I could have but, patience is not one of those traits people would say I am long on. There are many uses for an education and more mis-uses and most of those who mis-use an education pay the price when they are young and get past it afterwards and find that they really can use what they know but, perhaps not as they had originally thought.



_____________________________

If you have sex with a siamese twin, is it considered a threesome?

The trouble with ignorance is that it picks up confidence as it goes along.
- Arnold H. Glasow

It may be your sole purpose in life to simply serve as a warning to others!

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RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 5:29:57 PM   
corysub


Posts: 1492
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: awmslave

quote:

I have a friend that's graduating after this semester with a degree in Creative Writing. If she doesn't go on for MORE education, then her degree is completely useless (when it comes to finding a job).


It is not useless if she really can write (not be able to despite the degree is quite common). Also, there is a shortage of teachers in many areas. For example; allegedly Detroit has only 50% literacy.



I think the example of your friend graduating with a degree in "creative writing" brings focus to the problem facing this country.  How many college/post graduate students are studying mechanical engineering, chemical engineering, Biology, Electrical Engineering, Architecture, Civil  engineering..and on and on.  Where is the next generation of inventors going to come from..the polysci majors...geology, astronomy, French classic writings, ..and on and on with majors where there are NO jobs...and if you get a job it might more often than not be as an intern.  Rather, we are getting our talent from overseas, graduates from India in particular, as well as Koreans that I see populating the drug belt of New Jersey. 

As far as medicine, if you have a kid going to med school they might consider going to a trade school and learn plumbing.  The so called "Stimulus Bill" has planted the seeds to turn medicine into an assembly line of technicians performing standardized tests and treatments for less and less money.


Your friend might consider writing a book..."How I made my first million writing a book about why Creative writing courses don't lead to jobs".

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 8:14:02 PM   
thornhappy


Posts: 8596
Joined: 12/16/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: corysub
How many college/post graduate students are studying mechanical engineering, chemical engineering, Biology, Electrical Engineering, Architecture, Civil  engineering..and on and on. 


What's your beef with geology?  That's where oil/gas recovery folks come from.  Along with the folks from soils analysis (good for your infrastructure stuff.)

Now, as to ME/EE...you can have a master's in that and find yourself outsourced.  Many large firms have design centers in China and Russia (Intel comes to mind) - and no US engineer can compete with those wages.  Shit, no one in the US can compete at simple manufacturing and I'm not talking union wages, I'm talking any wages.

thornhappy

(in reply to corysub)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 8:29:31 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

I've been saying this for years and I don't have anywhere near the credentials or letters behind my name as Mr. Roberts.
It's just common sense that if working people make less each year they'll be able to afford to buy less each year. Everytime cos. ship 100,000 blue collar jobs overseas to "save money" we're also losing 30-40,000 white collar jobs as well and the "support" jobs that go with them!
This "global economy" crap *DOES NOT WORK*.
Until we get rid of all those suicidal "free-trade" deals things will *continue to get worse!* We simply cannot continue to allow "big business" to run our government!
Who's better off, the waitress with a "degree" and a $600 nut to pay off over the next 20 years every month on a $120k outstanding student loan or the waitress who can take that $600 per month and invest it over the next 20 years?
Colleges and Universities are training people for "jobs" that aren't or won't be there when they graduate.
I read somewhere where some high schools are graduating 60% of their senior classes who'll be going on to college or uni!
We simply do not need that many people running around with "degrees" in this country.
Politicians are fond of saying that kids will be "graduating for the jobs of the future" or some such nonsense. What jobs? Fifteen bucks an hour jobs in the "service sector?" (If you ask them point blank what jobs they can't tell you!) Sure, some "degrees" are worth persuing like in medicine.
And in other specialised areas.
But, until we get Manufacturing back in this country it's going to be a long slow slide.
The mark of intelligence is to know when something doesn't work and change your course.


Say it a million times, sailor!
I never get tired of hearing it!
One of the  reasons we are up the damn creek now, is because we outsourced so many of
our jobs, especially manufacturing jobs.
Like someone in Detroit said, "We are a service economy, what are
we going to do now?, serve each other tea?"


< Message edited by MzMia -- 2/13/2009 8:30:36 PM >

_____________________________

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"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

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RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 11:09:44 PM   
awmslave


Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

Rather, we are getting our talent from overseas, graduates from India in particular, as well as Koreans that I see populating the drug belt of New Jersey.


It is true but the great majority of them are graduates of US universities. They work for less money and this is the bottom line. They also populate graduate student pool because US students do not want these positions (lot of work, no income) or in many cases professors prefer Koreans, Japanese, Chinese or other nations because professors themselves are recent immigrants from these countries. Most of them jump through the hoops, feed big money into fat immigration lawyers pockets, and become residents eventually. In compared to very low education latino immigration from South America we are talking about only small number of people though and it should not worry Americans too much.

(in reply to MzMia)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/13/2009 11:43:37 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jack45

Ship of Fools
quote:

I have been reporting for years that American university graduates have had to take jobs as waitresses and bartenders. As over-indebted American consumers lose their jobs, they will visit restaurants and bars less frequently. Consequently, Americans with university degrees will not even have jobs waiting on tables and mixing drinks.

US policymakers have ignored the fact that consumer demand in the 21st century has been driven, not by increases in real income, but by increased consumer indebtedness. This fact makes it pointless to try to stimulate the economy by bailing out banks so that they can lend more to consumers. The American consumers have no more capacity to borrow.

With the decline in the values of their principal assets--their homes--with the destruction of half of their pension assets, and with joblessness facing them, Americans cannot and will not spend.

Why bail out GM and Citibank when the firms are moving as many operations offshore as they possibly can?

Much of US infrastructure is in poor shape and needs renewing. However, infrastructure jobs do not produce goods and services that can be sold abroad. The massive commitment to infrastructure does nothing to help the US reduce its massive trade deficit, the financing of which is becoming a major problem. Moreover, when the infrastructure projects are completed, so are the jobs.

At best, assuming Mexicans do not get most of the construction jobs, all Obama’s stimulus program can do is to reduce the number of unemployed temporarily.

Unless US corporations can be required to use American labor to produce the goods and services that they sell in American markets, there is no hope for the US economy. No one in the Obama administration has the wits to address this problem. Thus, the economy will continue to implode.

Paul Craig Roberts was Assistant Secretary of the Treasury during President Reagan’s first term.  He was Associate Editor of the Wall Street Journal.  He has held numerous academic appointments, including the William E. Simon Chair, Center for Strategic and International Studies, Georgetown University, and Senior Research Fellow, Hoover Institution, Stanford University. He was awarded the Legion of Honor by French President Francois Mitterrand.

I am hoping this man because he was in the Reagan admin. for only one term, might not be yet another Johnnny-come-lately with a now convenient change in economic policy. Never read in the WSJ about this yet I have been telling this same story from about the same time. 1/3 of Americans have been and are getting poorer everyday, 1/3 have stayed much the same taking on debt while some are dropping out of the middle class with the top 1/3 shrinking as many drop into the middle class while the rest get richer.

Our economy has been going along on debt at all levels for those 30 years with the refinancing of personal assests like housing and state and local debt. During Reagan's 8 years, states took on an additional $150 billion in debt. Productivity in the last 20 years since 1988 has risen over 30% while wages...3%.

The recession under Reagan did get us to 10% unemployement and quadrupling of the federal debt but Mr. Roberts left between terms so don't know where he stood at the time. It is painfully obvious that Americans as much as others, must manufacture something for export and much of our own products or we are economically doomed.

Adam Smith was a protectionist. He maintained England should never sell it ports and habors amd must protect its industrial base. American corps forced to do anything is a laugh.

(in reply to Jack45)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/14/2009 12:24:51 AM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		Paul Craig Roberts Phd. also writes a column for the AFP known as "On The Mark". In an article punlished Feb. 09, 2009 the title was "Secomd Phase of Real Estate Crash to Hit Any Time". In it writes that this one won't be any prettier. That even with complete recovey into a spending bliss, in the meantime companies that own and rent commerical space to establishments, are next in line.

Think about it, many of them have debt service, so what happens when (not if) their renters either decline to renew or actually default. That will result in their default. Now just what will be the result of that ? Now you will have real estate holders in place of bankers in line, like they have had on smaller scales in parts of Texas, Ohio and so forth.

And now that I mentioned it, I don't remember a bailout for them by the govt. I guess some failed and went through the default process, and went on under new management, while others may have somehow secured more "friendly" financing.

But none so friendly as a bailout.

I think the Man has something under his hat, or between the ears if you prefer. I belive he used to write for the Wall Street Journal, maybe they should've kept him around.

People just about got me torn in half over this. One day I read something that makes sense, need the bailouuts, next day I read something else then I have to reevaluate. There are two sides to everyrthing at least.

I got a pretty good idea what wil happen if the keep this up, and I realize that it won't be pleasant if they don't. Either way We The People seem to lose.

[Note that this is my interpretation of the article, not a quote in any way. I can get the article but it will probably be a scan of it.]

T

(in reply to MrRodgers)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/14/2009 2:41:04 AM   
corysub


Posts: 1492
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thornhappy

quote:

ORIGINAL: corysub
How many college/post graduate students are studying mechanical engineering, chemical engineering, Biology, Electrical Engineering, Architecture, Civil  engineering..and on and on. 


What's your beef with geology?  That's where oil/gas recovery folks come from.  Along with the folks from soils analysis (good for your infrastructure stuff.)

Now, as to ME/EE...you can have a master's in that and find yourself outsourced.  Many large firms have design centers in China and Russia (Intel comes to mind) - and no US engineer can compete with those wages.  Shit, no one in the US can compete at simple manufacturing and I'm not talking union wages, I'm talking any wages.

thornhappy



Show me the jobs for geologists!  We have a government taken over by the biggest scam artists the world has ever known in terms of economic impact...the "Greenies".  The hell with geology..we have direction from the top away from fossil fuels..ie coal gas oil...and towards "windmills".  Anyone taking geology these days should switch majors to climatology, a profession now considered like "priests"...no..the "Pope" who speaks Ex cathedra.

With respect to China, so you would give up?  Not focus on math and technical development in students at an early age to than go on to advance studies because of a fear their jobs will be outsourced?  America has been the leader in inovation...the world is running importantly on American technology, or technology stolen from Americans.  We are a very creative people when not put down by polliticians who forecast the end of the world as we know it if a piece of junk legislation is not enacted.  The United States is a leader in biotech, in pharmaceuticals that today are saving lives on this planet...and we need more young people going into this field.  That also leads to agriculture, again  where we are a leader with companies like Monsanto dominating seed and fertilizers...

Yea..we cant compete on an hourly wage basis with people in other countries working for $1.60/HR like China.
However, I am talking about Professions...where creativity and innovation are where the winners live..not assembly line soldering an electical connection on a TV.

At some time we have to have politicans who will also be statesman and work out treaties with other countries to level the playing field..not with wages...that will never change.. but American companies can't compete with the world when other countries are not worring about environmental concerns, for example, while our corporations may soon be facing a carbon tax to save the planet.  Washington is more of a problem for our workers than China or India...and I would throw in out of control unions like the UAW into the pot as well..  Our auto companies are bankrupt and our poltical leadership is focused on "green" for the planet instead of "green" on the balance sheet.
We will lose even more of whatever competitive edge we still have on the path we are now be led.

(in reply to thornhappy)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/14/2009 3:02:49 AM   
SilverMark


Posts: 3457
Joined: 5/9/2007
Status: offline 		Darn cory.....never knew you were a nuclear physicist.....chemical engineer....phd in mechanical engineering.....

Keep preaching...I am sure America is just waiting for you to lead by example......

_____________________________

If you have sex with a siamese twin, is it considered a threesome?

The trouble with ignorance is that it picks up confidence as it goes along.
- Arnold H. Glasow

It may be your sole purpose in life to simply serve as a warning to others!

(in reply to corysub)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/14/2009 3:30:22 AM   
StrangerThan


Posts: 1515
Joined: 4/25/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

I've been saying this for years and I don't have anywhere near the credentials or letters behind my name as Mr. Roberts.
It's just common sense that if working people make less each year they'll be able to afford to buy less each year. Everytime cos. ship 100,000 blue collar jobs overseas to "save money" we're also losing 30-40,000 white collar jobs as well and the "support" jobs that go with them!
This "global economy" crap *DOES NOT WORK*.
Until we get rid of all those suicidal "free-trade" deals things will *continue to get worse!* We simply cannot continue to allow "big business" to run our government!
Who's better off, the waitress with a "degree" and a $600 nut to pay off over the next 20 years every month on a $120k outstanding student loan or the waitress who can take that $600 per month and invest it over the next 20 years?
Colleges and Universities are training people for "jobs" that aren't or won't be there when they graduate.
I read somewhere where some high schools are graduating 60% of their senior classes who'll be going on to college or uni!
We simply do not need that many people running around with "degrees" in this country.
Politicians are fond of saying that kids will be "graduating for the jobs of the future" or some such nonsense. What jobs? Fifteen bucks an hour jobs in the "service sector?" (If you ask them point blank what jobs they can't tell you!) Sure, some "degrees" are worth persuing like in medicine.
And in other specialised areas.
But, until we get Manufacturing back in this country it's going to be a long slow slide.
The mark of intelligence is to know when something doesn't work and change your course.


I always viewed free trade agreements in comparable terms to setting a glass almost full of water next to one that was almost empty and connecting a tube between them at the bottom. The effect is to drain water from the first into the second until a point of equilibrium is reached. To put it in more tangible terms, while some in rich countries will benefit and make massive amounts of money, the relative wealth of those countries will drop, while the relative wealth of poor countries will rise. That process of reaching equilibrium translates into a lot of pain in richer countries as business relocates to cheaper work forces, fewer environmental regulations, fewer taxes.

Lost jobs can be replaced, but the real problem isn't just finding another job, it is finding comparable employment. The US has lost a lot of manufacturing jobs and gained a lot of service industry jobs. The two are not equal and never be will beyond the fact that both are jobs. Some professions thrive and will continue to do so. The base however, does not. I don't understand how anyone who is gung-ho for free trade couldn't expect economic troubles in what were richer countries. I don't care how wonderful a product you make, being competitive with a company who produces similar items - even of lesser quality, but at a fraction of the cost is never going to be easy and your share of the pie will shrink over time. It almost has to as that wealth is drained from point A to point B. Face it. As wealth migrates, it shrinks. A $50,000 job here becomes a $10,000 job somewhere else. The relative wealth of the person on the other end rises, but the only way the relative wealth of the person at the origin can even remain static is if that person finds comparable employement and does so in an area where the number of workers is rising while the numbers of comparable jobs is decreasing. Both sides often end up somewhere in between and both are going to be more inclined to buy the knock off at a cheaper price than buy the wonderfully engineered product you're trying to produce.

I'm not an economist and I don't have any golden answers. But the playing field in a global economy is so uneven that weath will naturally gravitate towards the lower end. That's good news for some, not so good news for others. The US has had a high standard of living for decades now. That standard is going to adjust. That adjustment is going to be, and has already been painful for a lot of people. The area where I grew up has lost virtually all of its manufacturing and while I like the sight of plants sprawled across the countryside probably less than most, what is left are a lot of service industry jobs that pay a fraction compared to the jobs that were lost. The professions that do well are health, technology, legal and a few others.

Shrug.

< Message edited by StrangerThan -- 2/14/2009 3:31:23 AM >

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Ship of Fools - 2/14/2009 4:39:35 AM   
corysub


Posts: 1492
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SilverMark

Darn cory.....never knew you were a nuclear physicist.....chemical engineer....phd in mechanical engineering.....

Keep preaching...I am sure America is just waiting for you to lead by example......


Nah.. I'm not that smart.  My job was making grass skirts but it was outsourced to Bali.
Should have studied that dern calculus thingy instead of playing "Hi Bob" in school, but I'm doing ok now as a producer for the Keith Olbemann show.  Thanks..

It sure would be nice, however, if the younger generation was tought more important things, like reading, riting and rithmetic....instead of  "children, make believe this pickle is a penis, now girls, this is..yadayadayada.."  ...We have school curiculum that causes our kids to waste hours of what could be productive school time to advance social agenda's.  I wonder how much time they spend on sex education in China, for example.  This is the one area that Obama CAN actually have an impact if he and Michelle actually do something to purge the Department of Education of the waste and dead wood..and focus on really educating children instead of providing pensions to administrators in an office building in D.C. and the capitals of our States.

(in reply to SilverMark)
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