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Scary thought - 2/13/2009 11:03:45 PM   
came4U


Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline 		http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0P-Q0vvCM0&eurl=http://www.infowars.com/is-fema-dhs-preparing-for-mass-graves-and-martial-law-near-chicago/

An Indiana county municipal official in the vicinity of Chicago reveals the contents of his meetings with FEMA and the Department of Homeland Security. The initial requests seem reasonable enough when FEMA asks the county officials to prepare a Hazard Mitigation Plan to deal with flooding, fires, high winds and tornadoes.
But as the required meetings and calls with FEMA and DHS continue over a two year period their request become more unusual, raising suspicions of county officials

“We want to know every important thing in this county. We want to know where police departments are. Where weapons are stored. Hazardous material. Where can we land a helicopter. Where are the airports. How big a plane can you land at the airport. Where are all the bridges. Where are all the power stations. Where are all the generating stations.Where are all the substations. They literally wanted to know where everything was. I’m sitting there thinking man if there was ever martial law. This kind of information is exactly the kind of stuff they are going to want. We’re just laying it all out for them right there.”
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 12:45:08 AM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		I'd bet any significant non-compliance would result in charges of corruption being sought.

Wouldn't be the first time local governments refused to cooperate with the Feds. There are quite a few cities and towns across this country that have local laws on the books which prohibit the "enforcement" of the PATRIOT act.

Some states actually usurp the US Constitution by invoking a "home rule" law.

So all is not quiet on the western front. Now we have state legilastors looking at acts that border on seccesion from the union. I guess they just don't remember what happened last time. While such actions generally lead to nowhere, the fact remains that "they" all don't agree on everything. In fact, in true fashoin, the Feds will try to use purse strings to get their way. But Nevada, notably told them to stick their money "where it wouldn't get a sunburn" and did not adhere to the "national" 55 MPH speed limit. Remember that ?

T

(in reply to came4U)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 2:14:53 AM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline 		Why is it a "scary thought" for FEMA to be wanting information that would be needed in an EMERGENCY?  It's the Black Helicopter crowd with more paranoid fantasies of UN troops coming to enslave the populace. 

Every thing listed in this quote:
quote:

“We want to know every important thing in this county. We want to know where police departments are. Where weapons are stored. Hazardous material. Where can we land a helicopter. Where are the airports. How big a plane can you land at the airport. Where are all the bridges. Where are all the power stations. Where are all the generating stations.Where are all the substations. They literally wanted to know where everything was. I’m sitting there thinking man if there was ever martial law. This kind of information is exactly the kind of stuff they are going to want. We’re just laying it all out for them right there.” 


would be information needed in a widespread natural disaster, civil disturbance, terrorist attack, disease outbreak, etc.  Nothing scary about it. 

(in reply to came4U)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 2:52:51 AM   
corysub


Posts: 1492
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		The government already has most that information, much of it being in the public domain via permits, licenses, environmental impact studies, government aid programs, interactions with comparable federal agencies, etc.
 
They are just so dysfunctional that they want the local governments to pull it all together.

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 8:45:46 AM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		fr

For one, looking at enough of the federal government's actions it would be foolish to trust them. I have heard some not so good things about FEMA. People who have lost trust in the government view it as being locked in a cage with a tiger, do you trust the tiger or grab the chair and whip ? (or the gun)

I would not call the OP a lunatic or anything like that. This may be a coincidence, but that is exactly the information an enemy would want.

And, as mentioned, they already have probably 99% of this info, so why make extra work for the locals recompliling it ? Possibly to detect those who would not comply ? It would not be the first time.

If a person violates your trust you are reluctant to trust them again, so why should it be any different with the government ?

For example I was one of those priveledged individuals to get the "long form" cencus questionaire last time. It was ridiculous, what time do I go to work and all that. I waited until they came and made them stand there and take my answers, some of which were quite vague. (the answers that is) I complied, but with certain refusals, like when my house would be empty, how much money I make, things like that. I also don't participate in marketing polls, because I don't trust the ones running it.

In a very old book :

Knowledge is power,
Knowledge shared is power lost.

Conspiracy theorists are nothing but theorists who have taken facts and added them up in a different way. The fact is that sometimes they are right. Just putting the word 'conspiracy' in front of it does not make their conclusions any less valid.

Ever take a psych test ? If you know the way they do it, they ask the same question but aboiut three different ways, with different scenarios. If it's not something like that, go ahead and give them all the info you want because they must be flushing it all down the toilet. I find that a bit hard to believe.

I also find it hard to believe that the gov has more info on foreign countries regarding these matters than what is right here at home.

So I am not buying any theories at this time, but I simply see this as another piece of information to be considered.

Might also note that they were asking county officials, who are notorious for going against the feds, and upholding state law instead. They could be looking for such targets. I am not asserting that as fact, just that it is possible. So am I a nut now ?

The fact is I just don't trust "them". Even to the staunchest conspiracy "nuts", this is not the news of the decade anyway.

T

(in reply to corysub)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 9:12:57 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		I agree with slaveboyforyou...sounds like someone is doing their job not a secret plan to take over local government.

corysub I don't think it's dysfunctional to ask local government to supply this information. Who would know better..and it would be too expensive to employ enough people to gather that amount of information in every City, county, and state in the country.

Butch

(in reply to Termyn8or)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 9:30:58 AM   
feydeplume


Posts: 935
Joined: 12/24/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

Why is it a "scary thought" for FEMA to be wanting information that would be needed in an EMERGENCY?  It's the Black Helicopter crowd with more paranoid fantasies of UN troops coming to enslave the populace. 


Because FEMA is practically useless and the information that they gather has yet to be used in any meaningful way in any relief effort for the actual people. FEMA seems to be more interested in saving infrastructure than in saving people, and sadly, they don't seem to be much good at that either.


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(in reply to slaveboyforyou)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 9:37:15 AM   
came4U


Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline 		Yes, go ahead and trust these people:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/10/25/AR2007102502488.html

How soon you forget Rex 84 and tribulations of the hearings of Oliver North.

If anything comes your way in terms of 'weather disaster' why the big secrecy?  Why hide the very plan or disguise it in any shape or form?  Wouldn't it be an actual PLAN if the general public knew what to do in such an emergency?  Where to go? 

If any governement can organize voting to run smoothly with just one day of voting to get there in, surely they can notify high risk disaster areas how to get somewhere elsewhere safely and without panic if there is a PLAN and not sheer panic because you don't know where to go.

yeah, ok, you can trust who you want but honestly, who would trust people who have the plan to round you up like cattle while you are dazed and disoriented. 

Don't forget to check your weapons at the door..ya won't be a needin those anymore.  They will 'take care' of you. lol

No, I'm not nuts.  If I was nuts I'd rely on my government to save my ass when shit hits the fan.

quote:

  Might also note that they were asking county officials, who are notorious for going against the feds, and upholding state law instead. They could be looking for such targets. I am not asserting that as fact, just that it is possible. So am I a nut now ?


On that note, good.  I don't believe there would be any geds vs state on that level.  For some creepy reason I see it as trojan.  For the first time ever in history (as far as I know??) I see this as foreign troop tradeoff.  aka, drop off Chinese/Russian troops here, our troops there, let them do all the dirty work of killing strangers/non-similar race then rid of them (being the lesser of population and under govt. payroll is easy to do).  Morbid, but in an actual carried out plan it would go perfectly.  Why? 1. soldiers are given information on sensitive areas 2. soldiers have no actual pity for those they invade vs if our own soldiers were asked to injure their own populus neighbors 3. hundreds of thousands of soldiers are easier to control than hundreds of millions of civilians.

First and only way to get the ball rolling?  Another 'shock and awe' event.


< Message edited by came4U -- 2/14/2009 9:49:25 AM >

(in reply to kdsub)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 3:17:35 PM   
Irishknight


Posts: 2016
Joined: 9/30/2007
Status: offline 		Having just lived through a weather disaster, I am shocked at the idiocy of the "FEMA's gonna get us" crowd.  FEMA provided us with the tools to save 1000s of lives throughout Arkansas, Kansas, Missourri and Kentucky.  They did exactly what they were supposed to do and enabled us to help ourselves.  We had to go around our versions of useless NOLA Mayor Ray Nagin (in our case a useless county judge) to get things done but we did it. 
A small town mayor and a volunteer fire department took care of most of our county with the assistance of FEMA.  There were no black helicopters stealing babies in the night.  There were trucks with relief supplies that came in as soon as the roads were cleared for them..... something that WE did rather than waiting for someone else to do it and then blaming others for not doing.  Waiting for your government to do FOR you is being a leech.  Letting them work WITH you is what its supposed to be all about.

(in reply to came4U)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 7:33:32 PM   
came4U


Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline
quote:

They did exactly what they were supposed to do and enabled us to help ourselves. 


Of course they did.  They have a reputation to fix after the fiasco of Katrina.

quote:

There were no black helicopters stealing babies in the night. 


They would never do that.  Parents would volunteer to bring then to mile long lineups for vaccinations that are likely more harmful than any artificial or natural pandemic.

Besides, apparently the cocky protesting alert types get taken at 4am into a black van mere days before country-wide meltdown.

quote:

There were trucks with relief supplies that came in as soon as the roads were cleared for them


That can happen in any other country, Canada included and we don't even have any organization similar to the fund-sucking FEMA except for the Red Cross (which is privately and government subsidized).


(in reply to Irishknight)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 9:33:09 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline 		This looks to be simply a plan to have a comprehensive disaster response plan. These wild eyed paranoids who think a plot of the magnitude they always think is in the works never consider that such a plot could not have a single leak or a single person learn too much or simply have a crisis of conscience which is quite simply unbelievable.

(in reply to Irishknight)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 10:12:00 PM   
came4U


Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline
quote:

a plot of the magnitude they always think is in the works never consider that such a plot could not have a single leak or a single person learn too much or simply have a crisis of conscience which is quite simply unbelievable.

 
Do you mean like this?

“The individual is handicapped by coming face-to-face with a conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists” –J. Edgar Hoover

or is it because of 1. confidentiality contracts or 2. fear / threat of loss of limb, life or family?
 
"The great mass of people...will more easily fall victim to a big lie than to a small one.
Mein Kampf
 
"An evil exists that threatens every man, woman, and child of this great nation. We must take steps to ensure our domestic security and protect our homeland."

"It also gives us a very special, secret pleasure to see how unaware the people around us are of what is really happening to them." Proposals of Gestapo Nazi Germany.

"No matter how paranoid or conspiracy-minded you are, what the government is actually doing is worse than you imagine." J. Edgar Hoover
 
"The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it." Castilian Days II, 1872

"The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions, that I wish it to be always kept alive."
Thomas Jefferson

"Single acts of tyranny may be ascribed to the accidental opinion of the day, but a series of oppressions begun at a distinguished period and pursued unalterably through every change of ministers too plainly proves a deliberate, systematical plan of reducing us to slavery." Thomas Jefferson

"We should never forget that everything Adolf Hitler did in Germany was 'legal' and everything the Hungarian freedom fighters did in Hungary was 'illegal.'" Martin Luther King
"Letter from Birmingham Jail," Why We Can't Wait, 1963.

"Today, America would be outraged if UN troops entered Los Angeles to restore order. Tomorrow they will be grateful! This is especially true if they were told that there were an outside threat from beyond, whether real or promulgated, that threatened our very existence. It is then that all peoples of the world will plead to deliver them from this evil. The one thing every man fears is the unknown. When presented with this scenario individual rights will be willingly relinquished for the guarantee of their well-being granted to them by the World Government." Henry Kissinger

"If I were reincarnated I would wish to be returned to earth as a killer virus to lower human population levels."
Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh

anyhoo, there are better sites but I am tired:

U.S. Troops Asked If They Would Shoot American Citizens
Iraq vet exposes how he was trained to round up Americans in martial law exercise, asked if he would kill his own friends and family
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/february2008/020408_shoot_americans.htm


< Message edited by came4U -- 2/14/2009 10:30:17 PM >

(in reply to DomKen)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 10:22:43 PM   
TNstepsout


Posts: 1558
Joined: 8/3/2005
Status: offline 		Ok- maybe we don't want them to know where the guns are, you know, in case they break in and steal them so they can trade them for hostages, or something sinister like that. And I guess we don't want them to know where the hazardous materials in case they try to use them for chemical warfare, but why don't we want them to know where the bridges and airports are?  Are the cities hiding them? It's a big secret???  Soooo are we hiding maps from the Feds too?

(in reply to DomKen)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 10:28:39 PM   
Hippiekinkster


Posts: 5512
Joined: 11/20/2007
From: Liechtenstein
Status: offline 		Hey, here's another scary thought. I was reading about Vichysoisse (which I have made many times) and I ran across this in the entry in Wikipedia:
"^ "An Examination of FDA’s Recall Authority". Harvard Law School. http://leda.law.harvard.edu/leda/data/729/Curatolo05.html. Retrieved on 25 September 2007. "The incident did not take a toll only on the company, however. Bon Vivant did not have adequate records and controls of production lots and distribution in order to trace the products quickly. The company also did not have the finances or manpower necessary to run a successful recall program. As a result, the FDA had to seize all the Bon Vivant soup throughout the country, more than a million cans in all. FDA said the seizure occupied 125 man years of FDA time, enough for 2,000 ordinary factory inspections for preventive purposes. After some squabbling in the courts, where the owner of the company sought to recover the seized cans for resale under the company’s new name, “Moore & Co.,” the soup was eventually incinerated, at the cost of nearly $150,000 to the federal government. As for Moore & Co., it appears the resurrection of the company was short-lived.[160]"  "

The owner of the company tried to get the soup back so he could resell it, recoup his money, and maybe kill some more people.

125 Man-years of FDA time. And $150,000 to incinerate the soup just because one fuck was so morally bankrupt that he couldn't do the right thing.

Do you right-wingers seriously think businesspeople have the integrity and honesty to police themselves? I don't.  I think businesses need to be under microscopes. Time and time again they have shown themselves to be incapable of honesty and truthfulness. Doctors are the same. They will sell you a whole skelaton replacement, whether you need it or not, just for the money. Nowadays, I rank doctors right up there with used car salesmen.

< Message edited by Hippiekinkster -- 2/14/2009 10:44:41 PM >

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(in reply to came4U)
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RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 10:37:33 PM   
came4U


Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline
quote:

but why don't we want them to know where the bridges and airports are?  Are the cities hiding them? It's a big secret???  Soooo are we hiding maps from the Feds too?


Maps are likely not updated more than by the decade and construction (recent) or  info only a local would know (ie: bridge @ intersection such n such is out of commission and the alternative way out of town is via route such n such)  Topography usually only has info on hand from arial photog that may or may not be updated to recent.

No need to necessarily hide it, it is public information but it is the reasoning behind the questioning and the questions themselves (if you heard the origional recording).

quote:

Ok- maybe we don't want them to know where the guns are, you know, in case they break in and steal them so they can trade them for hostages, or something sinister like that. 


lol, likely you will be asked *coughs* (forced) to leave your home to go to a 'safety area' in which NO WEAPONS are permitted.  (Except for theirs of course).

msnbc: fema apologizes for fake 'news conference' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6z_aFh8Dew&feature=related

on keeping secrets on supposed 'disaster relief' :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rB996JwCPI
 
Here are just a few Executive Orders associated with FEMA that would suspend the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. These Executive Orders have been on record for nearly 30 years and could be enacted by the stroke of a Presidential pen:
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 10990 allows the government to take over all modes of transportation and control of highways and seaports.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 10995 allows the government to seize and control the communication media.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 10997 allows the government to take over all electrical power, gas, petroleum, fuels and minerals.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 10998 allows the government to take over all food resources and farms.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 11000 allows the government to mobilize civilians into work brigades under government supervision.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 11001 allows the government to take over all health, education and welfare functions.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 11002 designates the Postmaster General to operate a national registration of all persons.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 11003 allows the government to take over all airports and aircraft, including commercial aircraft.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 11004 allows the Housing and Finance Authority to relocate communities, build new housing with public funds, designate areas to be abandoned, and establish new locations for populations.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 11005 allows the government to take over railroads, inland waterways and public storage facilities.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 11051 specifies the responsibility of the Office of Emergency Planning and gives authorization to put all Executive Orders into effect in times of increased international tensions and economic or financial crisis.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 11310 grants authority to the Department of Justice to enforce the plans set out in Executive Orders, to institute industrial support, to establish judicial and legislative liaison, to control all aliens, to operate penal and correctional institutions, and to advise and assist the President.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 11049 assigns emergency preparedness function to federal departments and agencies, consolidating 21 operative Executive Orders issued over a fifteen year period.
  • EXECUTIVE ORDER 11921 allows the Federal Emergency Preparedness Agency to develop plans to establish control over the mechanisms of production and distribution, of energy sources, wages, salaries, credit and the flow of money in U.S. financial institution in any undefined national emergency. It also provides that when a state of emergency is declared by the President, Congress cannot review the action for six months.

Be prepared to be a slave.


< Message edited by came4U -- 2/14/2009 11:14:39 PM >

(in reply to TNstepsout)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 11:34:26 PM   
came4U


Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline 		One eyewitness to Katrina Fema Camp:

"I just got back from a FEMA Detainment Camp

I'm extremely depressed to report that things seem to only be getting sadder concerning the people so devastatingly affected by Katrina last week. Two car loads of us headed over to Falls Creek, a youth camp for Southern Baptist churches in Oklahoma that agreed to have its facilities used to house Louisiana refugees. I'm afraid the camp is not going to be used as the kind people of the churches who own the cabins believe it was going to be used.

Jesse Jackson was right when he said "refugees" was not the appropriate word for the poor souls dislocated due to Katrina. But he was wrong about why it is not appropriate. It's not appropriate because they are detainees, not refugees.

......"He then precedes to tell us that some churches had already enquired into whether they could send a van or bus on Sundays to pick up any occupants of their cabins who might be interested in attending church. FEMA will not allow this. The occupants of the camp cannot leave the camp for any reason. If they leave the camp they may never return. They will be issued FEMA identification cards and "a sum of money" and they will remain within the camp for the next 5 months.

My son looks at me and mumbles "Welcome to Krakow."


she asks: "Do you think I'm over-reacting to the idea of being bussed hundreds of miles from what I am familiar with to a place miles from civilization and from which I cannot leave?

or

do you think I'm over-reacting to the fact that federal agencies are treating people who have done nothing but lose all they ever owned to a natural disaster as if they are criminals waiting to make their next nefarious move?
 
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/fema.html

(in reply to TNstepsout)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Scary thought - 2/14/2009 11:39:38 PM   
ArizonaSunSwitch


Posts: 205
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: corysub

The government already has most that information, much of it being in the public domain via permits, licenses, environmental impact studies, government aid programs, interactions with comparable federal agencies, etc.
 
They are just so dysfunctional that they want the local governments to pull it all together.


Yeah, that is what I was thinking. Plus we're talking the Chicago area, they're probably wondering if the locals know themselves.

(in reply to corysub)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Scary thought - 2/15/2009 6:11:09 AM   
TNstepsout


Posts: 1558
Joined: 8/3/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: came4U

One eyewitness to Katrina Fema Camp:

"I just got back from a FEMA Detainment Camp

I'm extremely depressed to report that things seem to only be getting sadder concerning the people so devastatingly affected by Katrina last week. Two car loads of us headed over to Falls Creek, a youth camp for Southern Baptist churches in Oklahoma that agreed to have its facilities used to house Louisiana refugees. I'm afraid the camp is not going to be used as the kind people of the churches who own the cabins believe it was going to be used.

Jesse Jackson was right when he said "refugees" was not the appropriate word for the poor souls dislocated due to Katrina. But he was wrong about why it is not appropriate. It's not appropriate because they are detainees, not refugees.

......"He then precedes to tell us that some churches had already enquired into whether they could send a van or bus on Sundays to pick up any occupants of their cabins who might be interested in attending church. FEMA will not allow this. The occupants of the camp cannot leave the camp for any reason. If they leave the camp they may never return. They will be issued FEMA identification cards and "a sum of money" and they will remain within the camp for the next 5 months.

My son looks at me and mumbles "Welcome to Krakow."


she asks: "Do you think I'm over-reacting to the idea of being bussed hundreds of miles from what I am familiar with to a place miles from civilization and from which I cannot leave?

or

do you think I'm over-reacting to the fact that federal agencies are treating people who have done nothing but lose all they ever owned to a natural disaster as if they are criminals waiting to make their next nefarious move?
 
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/fema.html


Where's the part where there were guns put to their heads to force them to go to the FEMA camp?

(in reply to came4U)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Scary thought - 2/15/2009 6:22:01 AM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline
quote:

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/february2008/020408_shoot_americans.htm


quote:

......"He then precedes to tell us that some churches had already enquired into whether they could send a van or bus on Sundays to pick up any occupants of their cabins who might be interested in attending church. FEMA will not allow this. The occupants of the camp cannot leave the camp for any reason. If they leave the camp they may never return. They will be issued FEMA identification cards and "a sum of money" and they will remain within the camp for the next 5 months.

My son looks at me and mumbles "Welcome to Krakow."


she asks: "Do you think I'm over-reacting to the idea of being bussed hundreds of miles from what I am familiar with to a place miles from civilization and from which I cannot leave?

or

do you think I'm over-reacting to the fact that federal agencies are treating people who have done nothing but lose all they ever owned to a natural disaster as if they are criminals waiting to make their next nefarious move?
 
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/fema.html


prisonplanet.com and abovetopsecret.com forums.   

(in reply to came4U)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Scary thought - 2/15/2009 10:11:45 AM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: came4U

anyhoo, there are better sites but I am tired:

U.S. Troops Asked If They Would Shoot American Citizens
Iraq vet exposes how he was trained to round up Americans in martial law exercise, asked if he would kill his own friends and family
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/february2008/020408_shoot_americans.htm



Well I'm sure Scott is a great guy, even though he apparently was never given a last name, but what proof is there that "no last name" Scott didn't just have too many beers in him and was spinning a line of drunken nonsense?

(in reply to came4U)
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