getting over vanilla 'stuff'

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dallassubmissive -> getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/28/2006 9:22:27 PM)
I all, I have been reading posts for a couple weeks now and just recently joined. I am pretty much brand spanking new and have not had a D/s relationship yet. There are many things taught/learned growing up that conflict with my desires. ie: feminism. I know that is probably as clear as mud, but am trying to figure it all out myself. For example, I have always naturally catered to the men I have dated, but parts of my mind tells me this is wrong - the whole learned women don't need men, blah, blah, blah. I was raised in a very 'leave it to beaver' type of family, where my mom catered to my dad. My issue is how do you deal and let go of that? thanks, kerry

veronicaofML -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/28/2006 9:37:21 PM)
some cannot some manage to it's up to YOU make up YOUR mind. i am TOLD............"your parents told you many things, but it is up to you to keep what you want and disavow the rest" best wishes

daredevil865 -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/28/2006 10:34:23 PM)
1st...learn to know yourself.. 2nd..do not try to fit what you want into the things you saw growing up for what worked for your parents may not work for you 3rd....once you have learned about yourself ...accept yourself If only it was that easy to do Vs say

veronicaofML -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/28/2006 10:39:25 PM)
If only it was that easy to do Vs say ======= unfortunately? nothing worthwhile in this world SEEMS,......................to come easy, does it?/

Lordandmaster -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/28/2006 10:52:46 PM)
You have an opportunity that most women in the past did not: the opportunity to live the life that makes you happy. That's feminism. Honestly, I think anything else is bullshit.

perverseangelic -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/28/2006 11:27:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster You have an opportunity that most women in the past did not: the opportunity to live the life that makes you happy. That's feminism. Honestly, I think anything else is bullshit. I agree completely. I am a rabid, avid feminist who is an activist about many things. I am also someone's property. How do I resolve these two? Well, to me, there isn't a conflict. I believe that feminism is about giving women the same choices men have, and the same ability to excercise those choices. I couldn't choose to NOT be free if I weren't free to begin with. I believe that it is -critical- that women have the choice to be slaves, or to be housewives, or to be stay at home moms or to be corporate lawyers or teachers or doctors. The point is that we have the choice, not what choice we make.

ayasha -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 12:09:16 AM)
As others have said - this one thinks that the feminist movement was good in that it allowed women to have choices. one did not really realize how important that was till one worked in the corporate world for 10 years, climbing the ladder - miserable as heck. It was not till one learned about submission and slavery, and became a slave, that one was happy. That helps this one to resolve the conflict - because one did work outside the home and was successful, yet struggled in all of her personal relationships. Now..............one works outside the home, but knows that she does not find her happiness in this. one finds her happiness in serving her Master - and is so comfortable with that, so at peace with that fact, that it resolved itself. one can let others live their life how it makes them happy, and one will live her life how it makes her happy.

subiekitty -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 2:38:51 AM)
i admit i am rephrasing what has already been said, but different people understand things in different ways, so what one says and the other hears is not always the same. With that in mind here is my contribution. Any act or movement or situation that provides you a choice to do something, also leaves the choice to not do it. You get a drivers liscense you then have the right to drive, not the obligation to drive. Feminism and equality support the right of a woman to have the same choices as men, many women get lost dealing with submissive feelings because they forget you also have the right to not make those choices.

champagnewishes -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 3:40:58 AM)
quote: I have always naturally catered to the men I have dated, but parts of my mind tells me this is wrong I ran this particular scenario through my head for years. At one point, I convinced myself that I was being selfish by catering to my man for I was only doing it for the pleasure I received by such actions. I later developed feelings of resentment and felt I was being taken advantage of time and time again. One day I finally realized I was failing to see the forest through the trees. I was applying everything I was feeling and thinking into a vanilla marriage and as a result, everything was conflicting. Once I removed myself from that relationship and became involved instead in a D/s relationship, everything fell into place and the conflict was no longer.

DelRey -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 8:06:28 AM)
This may set off a fire storm but is my OPINION. Feminism (wanting to be equal) may work in the corporate world or in the work force or even in traffic, but the moment that part of life is shelved so is feminism. There is no room for it in my life. Now to your question: I don't know how or if you can deal with wearing two hats. I have heard all my life and in all situations it seems to apply, "You can't serve 2 masters effectively". Get over it and enjoy being the server. Something to ponder. Del Rey

KatyLied -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 11:32:37 AM)
Why do you have to "let go" of it? If it gives you pleasure, you should find a way to be comfortable with it. I enjoy that type of service...fetching snacks, fixing the coffee, etc, there is nothing demeaning about catering to a man.

Misstoyou -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 1:26:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster You have an opportunity that most women in the past did not: the opportunity to live the life that makes you happy. That's feminism. Honestly, I think anything else is bullshit. What he said. I do, as a Domme. A submissive's choice is just as valid. The key word remains "choice," even if that choice is to serve another, or give your ability to choose to another. One of my proudest moments with my sub was when he swallowed the ending of "You shouldn't have" with regard to something I did. Smart boy! As a Domme, and a feminist, I can be as nurturing as I damn well please. lol

classykindasassy -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 5:59:36 PM)
I'm not clear that you need to let go of anything right away. You are new, and you come to BDSM with all you've learned up till this point. Now, you will be presented with new paradigms and new ways of thought. You will meet people who combine the ideas you were raised with, with stuff you have yet to be exposed to. Life is full of choices. Just locate your thinking in the woman that you are right now. Look at things as they are presented and be with the questions for a while - let the questions that life puts in your lap work on you a bit. Decide when it's time, after you've had a chance to look at things from all sides. All this takes some feeling out and getting used to. You need not accept any party lines. You get to decide it all for yourself - just give things consideration. That's the joy of being an adult.

Sensualips -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 6:01:52 PM)
I remind myself that submission is not gender specific. That is not always easy for me. I also remind myself that feminism supports a woman's right to make choices for herself - including the right to embrace her own submissive nature.

windy135 -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 6:25:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: perverseangelic quote: ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster You have an opportunity that most women in the past did not: the opportunity to live the life that makes you happy. That's feminism. Honestly, I think anything else is bullshit. I agree completely. I am a rabid, avid feminist who is an activist about many things. I am also someone's property. How do I resolve these two? Well, to me, there isn't a conflict. I believe that feminism is about giving women the same choices men have, and the same ability to excercise those choices. I couldn't choose to NOT be free if I weren't free to begin with. I believe that it is -critical- that women have the choice to be slaves, or to be housewives, or to be stay at home moms or to be corporate lawyers or teachers or doctors. The point is that we have the choice, not what choice we make. Wow nicely said. I wondered this too. You have made it clear as day. Thank you!

KittenWithaTwist -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 10:42:12 PM)
I created a livejournal community about this concept. Basically, I feel that the point of feminism is that women are free to and capable of making their own decisions, regarding their career, their lifestyle choices, and their sexuality. So, no matter how you choose to express yourself, the point is, you are choosing to do it, and women didn't have that opportunity before the feminist movement.

KittenWithaTwist -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 10:50:06 PM)
Ah, to be a white man in a "free" country. One can definitely be a feminist and a submissive, slave, bottom, or whatever else she might desire. Feminism is not a "master" nor is it a hat that one puts on and takes off. Your submissive chooses to submit to you. While she may not choose to be submissive or have submissive feelings, it is her choice to submit to you. She is able to make or not make that choice because we live in a world where women have choices. Not all women are submissive. It used to be that if you had a vagina, you were stuck being subservient. Whether or not you wanted to hold a job, or find a husband, or attend college (for anything other than home economics), you only had one acceptable option. Feminism gives women options. Whether or not they choose to act upon those options is irrelevant. Should they ever choose to explore anything, they have that possibility open to them. As that great saying goes: "We've come a long way, baby."

perverseangelic -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/29/2006 11:21:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: KittenWithaTwist I created a livejournal community about this concept. Basically, I feel that the point of feminism is that women are free to and capable of making their own decisions, regarding their career, their lifestyle choices, and their sexuality. So, no matter how you choose to express yourself, the point is, you are choosing to do it, and women didn't have that opportunity before the feminist movement. ..wait, you created feminist submissive or whatever it's called?! Nifty! I joined that community at its inception. Granted, I'm not active, now, but still. Go you!

fiddlegirl -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/30/2006 7:59:53 AM)
quote from Pat Califia, who is, among other things, a writer of lesbian SM erotica: "I am a feminist, albeit the fun kind."

PenelopePitstop -> RE: getting over vanilla 'stuff' (1/31/2006 11:09:05 AM)
Hi, dallasub, I've been where you are. Thought about it loads, still do. The way i look at it is, society makes these rules up to enable everyone to be the best they can be, but we are all individuals and we all know that generalisations are only guidelines. As an individual, whats good for one is not good for the other, its like food, we all have different tastes. We all aspire to be happy inside, and we all have the right to be happy inside. For reasons I don't completely understand, Submission makes me happy inside. In such a destructive world It doesn't destroy anyone being this way. I suppose it's a matter of perspective really. In terms of getting over the Vanilla stuff, I don't suppose I ever did. I'm prone to feeling guilty still but meeting people of the same tendencies really helps. I mean, my mum found out by accident - which was my worst nightmare- and she was fine with it, which made me think, perhaps it's not as big a deal as I had made it in my own head. I think guilt and inner conflict about this lifestyle is the flipside of being an all-round nice person. You have a conception of morals and society and so many people don't. Are you happier being submissive? yes. Whose life is it? Yours. And how many lives do we get to find happiness? Only one. think you know what I'm saying.

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