RE: Time out !!

RE: Time out !! (Full Version)

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DesFIP -> RE: Time out !! (5/11/2009 2:47:35 PM)
I'm not a great believer in meeting someone and saying "great, I'll enter into a tpe with you". No matter how long you've dated and played, living together and turning over control are a brand new box of worms. I am a great believer in slowly giving over more and more control over years until you feel totally safe. At which point you then look around and say "wow, so this is what a tpe is for me and I can do it". However once that total trust has been lost you are no longer in a tpe, you're back in a relationship with less than 100% control and you have to slowly rebuild the trust so you can slowly give back total control, 1 % at a time. My own belief is that a man who will not admit that by changing suddenly the parameters upon which your relationship was built has naturally enough left you feeling scared, and will not address the feelings of doubt he caused, is not someone I would be willing to ever give over full control to, if any. He tried some humiliation on me early on and I had a very bad emotional reaction. So bad that in order to feel safe I needed almost full control of myself again. He gave it to me and slowly rebuilt the trust so that at the end of six months we were almost where we were when we hit the snag. If he had refused to address the problem, had not given me what I needed to feel safe, I would never have been able to submit to him again. Now lots of other people have no problem with humiliation and they thrive on it. Good for them, but I'm not them so it doesn't matter what the issue is. What matters is that you don't feel safe anymore, you don't feel as if you can count on him keeping his word because he changed something he promised wouldn't change. And had he not given you that promise in the beginning, you probably wouldn't have entered into the relationship. Personally being a cynic of the worst order, I view such things as bait and switch. I don't know if you feel he suckered you into the relationship planning on going back on his word or if you've simply hit a roadblock where your core values diverge. Either way, without full trust you cannot have tpe.

ranja -> RE: Time out !! (5/12/2009 3:33:40 AM)
Adam and Eve had a good chance at being perfect together and yes...even the only two very first people managed to fuck things up Being in a relationship with another person means that at some point you will hit trouble because absolutely nobody is perfect... Now, for all you people who are still on honeymoon and believe that as soon as you doubt anything that then the relationship is over...you might aswell pack it in now because you will get to that point, realy realy trust me on that... And no, talking does not always help...sometimes you can talk till you are blue in the face and you could have made better use of your time and have a more favorable outcome if you go swimming instead. If you need a break to catch your breath and think things over...well that is better than chucking everything in the bin without thinking...thought eventually the result might be the same...it does not have to be. Relationships are not always fun and vacation like...it it wholly unrealistic to even presume they should be like that...for people who stick there will always be an amount of shit to shuffle at some point and indeed when it is hard work you are entitled a break good luck

barelynangel -> RE: Time out !! (5/12/2009 5:11:42 AM)
When you allow as a slave outside influences to effect YOUR relationship to me your focus is on the wrong place. You say your safety is in jeopardy -- is it? I mean seriously or are you simply using that as a concept of control because he isn't doing something you want him too? These questions aren't asked to be answered TO me or anyone but you and him. You also said you have a very strict (sorry can't remember the word you used) view of what slavery is -- well maybe its time as a slave you stop trying to determine your slavery and come to realize its your Master who does that. In trying to determine your slavery based on your view -- is a concept of maintaining control. Perhaps he is demanding you let go of the control of what YOU determine and allow HIM to make the determinations of what your slavery will be -- he being the Master and all. Finally, to me, if a slave has to run from her Master to figure things out on what seems to be a stay or go situation instead of TO him -- that is very telling. To me, this is exactly what you are doing -- wanting to run. Maybe you need to run to him instead of away from him. angel

CreativeDominant -> RE: Time out !! (5/12/2009 8:03:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: missturbation quote: ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth Master finds the concept reprehensible. this slave wouldn't call it a relationship worth having if she needed time away from it in order to function well...or in order to solve issues. we try every way we can to avoid situations that necessitate us being physically separated. we work out and process issues together---it matters not if they are issues brought about by folks in our lives other than us, if it is an issue only for one of us, or if it is an issue we have with each other. To a certain degree i agree with you. I hate that i have had to do this and that i have been put in this position. I have to say I agree with Ravenmuse and Mercnbeth and LaT. I've read your posts on various threads with great interest, misst. Sometimes I've agreed with you and sometimes not. Your views on slavery and what it meant to be in service to one, especially when there was little to no emotion involved, were pretty clear. I've watched with chagrin as you chided others for not adhering to the "slave" principle that the Master is the one in command and that a slave's main purpose was to satisfy his wants and needs and desires and to roll with the punches. Yet... The threads over the last month have shown a strong independance of spirit that seemed a bit contradictory to the "slave" principles you have espoused. There've been times when it did seem as if your wants and desires were as important in terms of being served as your Sir's. If your safety has been compromised, then that is indeed a trust issue. But trust issues...in my opinion...need to be dealt with while they are occurring, not after a break. I admit, I am not much of one for a "break" from a relationship. I've yet to see a time when the final outcome was NOT a complete break and the biggest reason I can see is when someone begins to question the relationship and/or dynamic to the extent that they needed time away, the relationship/dynamic is altered and not usually in a manner for the best.

missturbation -> RE: Time out !! (5/12/2009 10:51:52 AM)
quote: I have to say I agree with Ravenmuse and Mercnbeth and LaT. Hindsight is a wonderful thing lol and with it i would have to agree now. If i had listened to Sir when we spoke, really listened i would not have even asked for the time out. In actual fact i realise now what i asked for wasn't a time out from the relationship but a time out from the conversation. I was still sending my daily texts, i was still having some communication with Sir, just not about the 'issue'. However i still at the time considered it a time out from the relationship and no matter what, for me that was unacceptable not to be repeated behaviour.

CreativeDominant -> RE: Time out !! (5/12/2009 11:38:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ranja Adam and Eve had a good chance at being perfect together and yes...even the only two very first people managed to fuck things up Being in a relationship with another person means that at some point you will hit trouble because absolutely nobody is perfect... Now, for all you people who are still on honeymoon and believe that as soon as you doubt anything that then the relationship is over...you might aswell pack it in now because you will get to that point, realy realy trust me on that... And no, talking does not always help...sometimes you can talk till you are blue in the face and you could have made better use of your time and have a more favorable outcome if you go swimming instead. If you need a break to catch your breath and think things over...well that is better than chucking everything in the bin without thinking...thought eventually the result might be the same...it does not have to be. Relationships are not always fun and vacation like...it it wholly unrealistic to even presume they should be like that...for people who stick there will always be an amount of shit to shuffle at some point and indeed when it is hard work you are entitled a break good luck I guess this is something I am going to have to get used to disagreeing with certain people on. Yeah, sometimes there is shit to shuffle and problems to solve and that takes work. But in my mind, you don't that break in the middle of the work. Going off to work things out in your own mind removes you from the relationship altogether and this expectation that the other person should wait...and wait...and wait while you work out a twosome problem as a "onesome" is a "non-starter" in my book. What I find ironic is the withdrawal of the submission while still expecting the dominance to go on. Though that has not been brought up in this thread, it is certainly related. If you are taking a break from the dynamic and expecting the dominant to "understand" that you are withdrawing from his sphere and removing your submission to him while expecting him to be patient and understanding and kind, then aren't you expecting him to display those traits that you consider to be necessary of a good dominant while not living up to the submission you agreed to?

CreativeDominant -> RE: Time out !! (5/12/2009 11:45:27 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesFIP I'm not a great believer in meeting someone and saying "great, I'll enter into a tpe with you". No matter how long you've dated and played, living together and turning over control are a brand new box of worms. I am a great believer in slowly giving over more and more control over years until you feel totally safe. At which point you then look around and say "wow, so this is what a tpe is for me and I can do it". However once that total trust has been lost you are no longer in a tpe, you're back in a relationship with less than 100% control and you have to slowly rebuild the trust so you can slowly give back total control, 1 % at a time. My own belief is that a man who will not admit that by changing suddenly the parameters upon which your relationship was built has naturally enough left you feeling scared, and will not address the feelings of doubt he caused, is not someone I would be willing to ever give over full control to, if any. He tried some humiliation on me early on and I had a very bad emotional reaction. So bad that in order to feel safe I needed almost full control of myself again. He gave it to me and slowly rebuilt the trust so that at the end of six months we were almost where we were when we hit the snag. If he had refused to address the problem, had not given me what I needed to feel safe, I would never have been able to submit to him again. Now lots of other people have no problem with humiliation and they thrive on it. Good for them, but I'm not them so it doesn't matter what the issue is. What matters is that you don't feel safe anymore, you don't feel as if you can count on him keeping his word because he changed something he promised wouldn't change. And had he not given you that promise in the beginning, you probably wouldn't have entered into the relationship. Personally being a cynic of the worst order, I view such things as bait and switch. I don't know if you feel he suckered you into the relationship planning on going back on his word or if you've simply hit a roadblock where your core values diverge. Either way, without full trust you cannot have tpe. Hmmmmmm...amazing sometimes what being on different sides of the coin can do to perspective. Personally, I would not enter into a D/s dynamic without what is expected being spelled out fairly clearly so that I would know in the beginning that, to use the example you gave, humiliation is not expected/wanted/desired and is in fact a hard limit, therefore I would be disappointed if, in having run into a snag with something that was not revealed to be a hard limit, the submissive withdrew her trust and/or her submission and took back her control until she felt she could "give it back" to me. That alters the dynamic to the extent that she is controlling it and that's not what I sign up for. As I've said before, trust is one thing and breaking trust is a serious issue. Pushing a submissive in a way that she has agreed to but possibly did not consider happening such as what might occur in a Master/slave dynamic in which all control was given over or a Dominant/submissive dynamic in which most control has been given over is another.

DesFIP -> RE: Time out !! (5/16/2009 8:09:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant Hmmmmmm...amazing sometimes what being on different sides of the coin can do to perspective. Personally, I would not enter into a D/s dynamic without what is expected being spelled out fairly clearly so that I would know in the beginning that, to use the example you gave, humiliation is not expected/wanted/desired and is in fact a hard limit, therefore I would be disappointed if, in having run into a snag with something that was not revealed to be a hard limit, the submissive withdrew her trust and/or her submission and took back her control until she felt she could "give it back" to me. You're assuming I had been in a d/s or even kinky relationship before and knew about this. I hadn't. This is my first such relationship so there's all kinds of things I cannot tell how I will react to since I've never tried them. I had always thought spreader bars were incredibly hot until he tried them on me. In reality I just find them uncomfortable. I'm much happier with rope. But telling him that the idea of them was incredibly exciting does not mean that I was lying, just that the fantasy does not live up to the reality. I love bondage but discovered that only if my head isn't bound. If it is I have panic attacks. I have no idea why. But this wasn't a lie of any kind since I had never tried it before. If instead of referring to it as taking back control, I had said I needed huge amounts of reassurance for months on hand and very light control, would that make more sense to you? In either case it took me six months before I didn't start panicking at all kinds of things I had previously done easily. In any case re misst's explanation that she needed a break not from the relationship but from discussing the issue. Hell yes I've needed this. He prefers to stay up and hash things out all night long if necessary. I just get more and more unhappy and unpleasant if not allowed to sleep and when it's emotional exhaustion then I need to crash a lot earlier. Most of the time nowadays all I need is to go to bed with him and be held by him. Somehow the skin to skin contact allows me to rest more easily and I can think much clearer in the morning and by some point that next day I have gotten to a point where not only can I think clearly but I'm also able to express it. However in the beginning of the relationship when we didn't live together I needed a lot longer in the cessation of discussion to be able to come to a clearer understanding of my feelings.

IronBear -> RE: Time out !! (5/17/2009 6:46:54 AM)
Reading the replies I realised I had of course responded to the thread heading and not completely read the OP. If one of mine wanted time out to process things in our relationship, I'd be happy to allow it and have a stop watch in my hand to count off the two minutes I'd allow. If she had issues, questions or problems, doubts etc about our dynamic, I expect her to come to me or if needs be to go the Neets first and then me. We had a situation the other night when something happened and the girl dropped to her knees trembling at which time both Neets and I moved from our sadistic mode to one of care and consern to allow her to process things and recopver sufficiently to explain that had happened and what caused it (past abuse baggage with wooden spoons, plastic rods and such).. Irrespective of being a fast developing sadistic evil bastard, I am both very laid back and easily approachable chap. Or so I am told.... Old age or karma must be catching up,with me.

ranja -> RE: Time out !! (5/27/2009 5:03:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant What I find ironic is the withdrawal of the submission while still expecting the dominance to go on. Though that has not been brought up in this thread, it is certainly related. If you are taking a break from the dynamic and expecting the dominant to "understand" that you are withdrawing from his sphere and removing your submission to him while expecting him to be patient and understanding and kind, then aren't you expecting him to display those traits that you consider to be necessary of a good dominant while not living up to the submission you agreed to? I would not withdraw my submission...i would not ask for divorce but for a mere break... if He would deny me i would stay put and both of us would remain in an awful place...at logger heads but quiet, me done talking and Him not a talker in the first place, nothing would be resolved. On the few occasions that i have removed myself...to give Him space as much as breathe myself...i did not expect Him to Dominate me from afar, i know what He expects from me and i can behave myself very well on my own. Sometimes space is what calms the mind and gives me new inspiration to carry on, to make things better. Maybe the trouble might be not lack of submission or lack of Dominance, maybe the reason for a break is because He does not understand and is not patient and so not considered very kind, some people just get stuck at times, their 'dynamic' might be stuck, one is no better than the other; just different. Some time might be needed to adjust for both. Dominants can just take a break anytime they want (or can they?)...indeed like IB go fishing or such...unfortunately a submissive generally has to ask permission which makes it more of an issue. It seems to me that you assume the Dominant is always right... ...and of course He always is...it is just that sometimes some time is needed to 'accept' that.

kiwisub12 -> RE: Time out !! (5/27/2009 1:51:56 PM)
If there is something of a serious, confrontive nature going on in a serious relationship with me, the other individual better be prepared to let me have some time to formulate arguements/responses/defenses. I was in a marriage with a man who delighted in verbal arguements - me? - not so much. I don't think well on the fly, and have a hard time expressing myself when emotions run high. If agreement is to be equinimiable then a short break from the heat is needed for me to think, and not just react. I would not want a break from the relationship - i'd be worried that it wouldn't be there when i came back - but an hour or two would be enough for me to cool down and think logically. And i have to say - if i ever got to the point of worrying about my safety with Sir, then there would be a good chance that our relationship is damaged beyond repair. On the other hand, i wouldn't ever worry about my safety based on how he plays with other subs. He has scened many subs with me watching and he uses them all differently- according to their responses. I also think if the other two participants are comfortable with what they do, then maybe its time to look away.

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