Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101

Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion

Message

MzMia -> Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (6/30/2009 10:31:15 PM)
Okay, many of us don't really understand what all this "Cap and Trade" is about. I found this website from the EPA that has a section called Cap and Trade 101, I am finding it very informative. I have to admit, I will need to read more before I fully understand the ramifications of Cap and Trade. Cap and Trade 101 \| Cap and Trade \| US EPA Since, the bill has passed, how do you think this will affect us here in America?

DomKen -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (6/30/2009 11:17:16 PM)
Air pollution will decrease. Forward thinking utilities will make more profits. A lot of whining will be done by the coal industry.

DemonKia -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 1:12:33 AM)
FR, after read thru Kinda tangential to the topic, maybe, but I find it interesting how various businesses expect / are expected to be 'perpetual & unchanging' in a world of change. Like the Big 3 US automakers, a sense of entitlement to stasis & incredulity that things won't stay the same forever. Individuals can get tossed by the winds of change, but businesses have some kind of immunity? As to the OP: Short answer: cap & trade is the 'inferior' alternative to carbon taxes offered up by the business sector to step around carbon taxes. Carbon taxes were the preference of the enviros, but they're politically unpalatable, so industry came up with cap & trade. Or, at least, that's my sum up. I'm interested in seeing where this thread goes. [;)] I don't expect much change in the short run. & given our foot-dragging over moving into the future, I expect we may lose our head-of-the-pack thing when it comes to cutting edge tech . . .. ..

servantforuse -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 4:50:24 AM)
This bill has not yet passed. It hasn't gone to the Senate. I predict that it won't make it through there. That will be a good thing.

xBullx -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 5:10:17 AM)
It is the beginning of you being charged to breathing. We need less government, not more. I heard an interesting satistic, every ton of carbon not put up by US industry is two tons elsewhere. US industry will leave. That and you end up paying the extra anyway and Sam I am ends up with a larger budget to waste yet more of our money. A Contitutionalist says this. If you people want more government Europe is very lax on immigrations...

Sanity -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 5:28:12 AM)
If by coal industry you mean a lot of poor people who depend on coal for jobs and affordable power and manufactured goods, you may have a point. quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen Air pollution will decrease. Forward thinking utilities will make more profits. A lot of whining will be done by the coal industry.

rulemylife -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 6:41:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: xBullx It is the beginning of you being charged to breathing. I think that began a long time ago, if you take health care costs into consideration. America's Most Polluted Cities - Forbes.com The annual report--State of the Air 2009--found that six in 10 Americans live in counties where ozone or particle pollution has reached dangerous levels. Both types of pollution can be deadly and have been linked to worsening respiratory conditions like asthma, emphysema and bronchitis, and there is evidence that particle pollution increases risk of heart attacks and strokes.

Sanity -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 7:12:21 AM)
You misunderstand. By "breathe" he meant freedom, and I'm pretty sure Bull was once an avid Obama believer. This could mean trouble for the Democrat party...

rulemylife -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 7:23:32 AM)
I may have, but he'll have to elaborate on that if I did. It seems to me his argument was much the same as yours, that short-term economic benefits outweigh the long term effects to the environment and the subsequent economic costs those effects will have.

MzMia -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 7:30:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: servantforuse This bill has not yet passed. It hasn't gone to the Senate. I predict that it won't make it through there. That will be a good thing. I stand corrected then, I am not sure HOW I feel about this bill, not sure if I want it to pass or not. I am all for cleaner air, but how much will this really change things?

pahunkboy -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 8:30:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MzMia quote: ORIGINAL: servantforuse This bill has not yet passed. It hasn't gone to the Senate. I predict that it won't make it through there. That will be a good thing. I stand corrected then, I am not sure HOW I feel about this bill, not sure if I want it to pass or not. I am all for cleaner air, but how much will this really change things? Check out the movie end game. Cap and trade is a tool to extract money out of people. Nothing will be cleaner... just more expensive. It is a global tax on us, which wrecks our sovereignty. Cap and trades means EUGENICS. Some peoples life has value -and other lifes do not have value. ALOT of people are going to die before 2013. and it is presumptuous for YOU to conclude that you will be among those chosen to live. Everything they are doing- points to the massive human blood that will be spilled - to fertile the earth to give the rulers even MORE power. The point that the environment might be less polluted is a distraction. Life IS carbon. Carbon is now contraband- which renders life itself to be contraband.

mastrcmmdr -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 8:31:36 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MzMia Okay, many of us don't really understand what all this "Cap and Trade" is about. I found this website from the EPA that has a section called Cap and Trade 101, I am finding it very informative. I have to admit, I will need to read more before I fully understand the ramifications of Cap and Trade. Cap and Trade 101 \| Cap and Trade \| US EPA Since, the bill has passed, how do you think this will affect us here in America? Its very simple, you dont need EPA PR. Its a tax, nothing more, nothing less. A tax that will hit every single thing you buy. whether you make >250k or less than 25k.

MarsBonfire -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 8:57:57 AM)
We need lees government, Bull? Really? We need less regulation of the Wall Street, you think? So that the conniving brokers there can keep trading "ghost derivatives"? Do we need less in the way of emergency services? That way we can ignore the NEXT American city that faces disaster too? What utter bullshit that GOP catchphrase is!

pahunkboy -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 9:07:26 AM)
I agree with Bull. We need less government. The government is incompetent to solve any problem. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_7mPS6TzEA No one has killed more people over the course of history then governments!!! The outcome of government power- can only ever be- in the end- as a threat to any lesser group of people. The liberals did not "win", the liberals are merely a tool for the all seeing eye to grab all the power. Our government has done more death and suffering then many governments. It is NOT the government that makes a country great- it is the people themself. Obama IS George Bushes 3rd term. anyhow- start by reading these bills. I sure wont sign anything I haven't read.

Sanity -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 11:20:04 AM)
As has been pointed out on multiple occasions now, cap and tax will have a deleterious effect on the environment. One of the reasons I write that is Obama's cap and tax plan will push industry away from the relatively clean and tightly regulated United States and into countries like China and Mexico where they can literally burn tires or recycled computer parts to generate steam turbine power. Anything goes in many of those places... If you're really that concerned about the environment you may want to take a closer look at cap and tax. quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife I may have, but he'll have to elaborate on that if I did. It seems to me his argument was much the same as yours, that short-term economic benefits outweigh the long term effects to the environment and the subsequent economic costs those effects will have.

rfd1 -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 12:11:23 PM)
The easiest way to preserve the American ecological system is to IMMEDIATELY HALT ALL IMMIGRATION into our nation. Simple, effective, but they won't do it, they want it this way. It will be a Pyrrhic victory.

ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 12:30:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rfd1 The easiest way to preserve the American ecological system is to IMMEDIATELY HALT ALL IMMIGRATION into our nation. Simple, effective, but they won't do it, they want it this way. It will be a Pyrrhic victory. What does that have to do with the environment? You think they're throwing too many taco wrappers out the windows of their pickup trucks?

pahunkboy -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 12:33:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rfd1 The easiest way to preserve the American ecological system is to IMMEDIATELY HALT ALL IMMIGRATION into our nation. Simple, effective, but they won't do it, they want it this way. It will be a Pyrrhic victory. except for the migration is out of America, no longer to America. Recall that Mexico broke with Spain for some of the same reasons the America broke with England. Also- we were involved in making Mexico bad. They would have done fine with out us. Our banks get MX deep in debt- and the country was gutted in the 80s. So- the "them" and "us" only goes so far. (google Mexico 80s, default) US banks don't loan other countries money to be nice. Not any more then they loan us 29% credit cards... to be nice. However everything is planned for us by the elite. So of course, some will say close the borders.

popeye1250 -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/1/2009 10:56:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MarsBonfire We need lees government, Bull? Really? We need less regulation of the Wall Street, you think? So that the conniving brokers there can keep trading "ghost derivatives"? Do we need less in the way of emergency services? That way we can ignore the NEXT American city that faces disaster too? What utter bullshit that GOP catchphrase is! Gee Mars, "the govt" didn't do a very good job watching over Wall St or the bankers or the insurance companies, so far did they? They can't even secure our borders or enforce our immigration laws.

housesub4you -> RE: Cap and Trade for Dummies/ Cap and Trade 101 (7/2/2009 4:10:37 AM)
Actually religion has cause more deaths than governements

Page: [1] 2 next > >>

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.046875