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Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/19/2006 9:55:01 AM

SoulBelow

Posts: 30
Joined: 11/8/2005
Status: offline

I know a master who has a long distance slave. He has known her 5 years but has only been in her company for 5 weeks out of those 5 years. On the phone to him she is the perfect slave but the times he has met her he has had problems. They felt awkward around eachother to some degree because of not physically being together enough, she questioned him, she would freak out and say she didn't think she knew how to be a slave anymore, would feel jealousy towards masters other slave, would say she was okay with things but would then freak out if he decided he wanted to make her sleep in the closet. She had a way of manipulating him which gives her the power. Would disobey him when he told her to calm down and do as she was told etc etc... However on the phone she tells him things like " I want to be locked in a cupboard for a week when I next see you" things like that. Then says that when they eventually live together she wants to be kept in a basement and only brought out when he wants to play with her etc.

What confuses me is the way she behaves and the things she says don't match up. He is planning to bring her to England to live with him, even though she has never been outside of the USA. I am thinking that when she gets here she won't be all the things she has told him she can be. That she is just telling him what he wants to hear. I know she is very lonely and maybe just wants some security. I am worried about the master as he is a dear friend of mine and I don't want him to end up having a hard time with her. I'm not sure what to make of her to be honest. Anyone know of similar situations and how they worked out. I am very curious to know.

Post #: 1

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/19/2006 10:09:38 AM

RavenMuse

Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline

Unfortunatly some people are in love with the fantasy but can't handle the reality. Either I'd have found a way around that behaviour in the first meeting or two or there wouldn't have been any more such meetings and I'd have brought things to an end. The decision has to be his but personaly I wouldn't touch her with a bargepole, let alone bring her to another country, that behaviour, if it is as you suggest raises far too many red flags for me.

< Message edited by RavenMuse -- 2/19/2006 10:10:02 AM >

(in reply to SoulBelow)

Post #: 2

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/19/2006 10:16:55 AM

SoulBelow

Posts: 30
Joined: 11/8/2005
Status: offline

This is what worries me. That and the fact that he has never had to be a master to someone in the flesh. It's easy to feel in control of someone when you only ever have contact with them by phone. To tell them to go away and do something and then the next time you talk to them they tell you they have done just that, is easy. Actually seeing someone do these things is a whole other thing. She even told him once that he didn't feel like a master to her and that he should seek advice from a more experienced Dom. To be honest I don't think he really knows what he's getting himself into and I know that he feels a sense of responsibility to her because she has had a really rough life and looks to him as her saviour or something. It just all stinks of rotten fish to me. It doesn't seem right and her behaviour does not seem like the behaviour of a slave. Also he hasn't found a way to control this either.

(in reply to RavenMuse)

Post #: 3

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/19/2006 11:26:32 AM

RealDeal1963

Posts: 13
Joined: 1/6/2006
Status: offline

You are a true friend to this Master to be concerned and you should be. From what you said it will very likely end in huge dissapointment and probably pretty quickly.

I doubt there's much you can do to help except be there when things fall apart and remind him that the problem was mostly with her and not him.

There is a huge difference between being a little feisty and playful and the behavior you described. I agree with Raven that the step between long distance and reality is big and one or both of these two really don't seem ready and may never be.

About the only thing I can think of to suggest to your friend is that he have a very long talk about this behavior before she gets there. I would suggest that he lay down a grid iron rule right from the outset that for at least a small period of time she must agree to behave herself completely. Give her (for instance) three days of total and complete obedience from the beginning and not one single instance of misbehavior. During that time he likewise agrees not to push her too hard and just spend that time getting the feel of things. I'd make her sign a contract stating such in very plain language that can't be mistaken or twisted around in any way.

I'd also suggest he buy a round trip ticket to England and staple it to that contract as a reminder that he means business.

This is the fundamental idea behind "training". Getting both Master and slave on the same page right from the get go so they have a solid foundation to build on later. Some people like to take training to an extreme and it can even be a constant ongoing part of their relationship, others don't. It can be playful or serious, dark or light. In your friends case, I suggest it be serious and light.

(in reply to SoulBelow)

Post #: 4

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/19/2006 11:40:55 AM

fastlane

Posts: 2159
Joined: 5/26/2005
Status: offline

They have to be together...to truly know, each other. Perhaps she is insecure and leading him on? Perhaps not? A five year relationship, despite the limited time they have had physical contact...speaks volumes.

LDR..suck....I know!

However, in the long run....we all hope we find "the one!"

Kevin

_____________________________

Just because it hurts, doesn't necessarily make it a bad thing.

(in reply to RealDeal1963)

Post #: 5

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/19/2006 12:14:53 PM

Misstoyou

Posts: 1149
Joined: 9/4/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SoulBelow

This is what worries me. That and the fact that he has never had to be a master to someone in the flesh.

So he has only "mastered" someone for five weeks in five years (the sum total of the slave's experience), and it didn't go perfectly. Yet they have stayed together, and are trying to take it to real time. The problem comes from the distance, not the intent.

No doubt both will find that they can't take their online scenarios, and drop them seamlessly in real life, even when they have longer than a week to adjust. She *does* need a round trip ticket, for her own security, not just as a threat from the Dom.

If they both understand that in spite of the online relationship, they both still are newbies and will learn from each other, they may do fine. So support in him getting more realitic expectations for himself and his slave. For example, how cold in a basement would it get in the UK? lol

_____________________________

~ Miss Marie

a.k.a. "mean Lady"

(in reply to SoulBelow)

Post #: 6

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/19/2006 12:53:35 PM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

I have a Gorean mate living in London who had for several years a slave living in the US. They had an idylic relationship on line. She started to panic as the time drew near for her to visit him so he had her cancell the one way ticket she had bought and he purchased for her an open ended return ticket to the UK. After two weeks, she returned after an amicable release. They have remained firm friends but the reality of the thought of moving to another country was just too much for her.

It's all in the game and how you play it.............

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to Misstoyou)

Post #: 7

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/19/2006 4:57:36 PM

theRose4U

Posts: 3403
Joined: 8/22/2005
Status: offline

quote:

On the phone to him she is the perfect slave but the times he has met her he has had problems. They felt awkward around eachother to some degree because of not physically being together enough, she questioned him, she would freak out and say she didn't think she knew how to be a slave anymore, would feel jealousy towards masters other slave, would say she was okay with things but would then freak out if he decided he wanted to make her sleep in the closet. She had a way of manipulating him which gives her the power. Would disobey him when he told her to calm down and do as she was told etc etc... However on the phone she tells him things like " I want to be locked in a cupboard for a week when I next see you" things like that. Then says that when they eventually live together she wants to be kept in a basement and only brought out when he wants to play with her etc.

Multiple things in this are raising red flag for me:
#1- there appears to be an Alpha to consider...what does she think about all this?
#2-Long distance domination...too easy to SAY "oh yes master I did x,y & z" and few ways to prove things. Master hears that they were feeding orphans, following their diet and went to the gym...in reality they had the forbidden Big Mac, stopped by the bar for happy hour and did 12oz curls for 3 hours. Too much independence and opportunities for lies in those that are not sincere.
#3- She SAYS that she wants to be the slave in the basement but freaks when punished the least bit...accident waiting to happen. Sounds like a lot of do-me fantasies without much actual practice with obedience.

Honestly the way you put it sounds like she's a few fries short of a happy meal but what do I know I'm only readin the cliff notes.

(in reply to SoulBelow)

Post #: 8

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/19/2006 7:14:18 PM

ownedgirlie

Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline

Sounds like their intent is there but he needs to work with her. All too often a fantasy about something one may really think she wants, turns into terror when actually occuring. my advice is he needs to get into her head, and work her through these ideas. Okay so she wants to be locked in a cupboard for a week. Even though she has no idea that one hour in there could have her clawing through the wood. i have worked through many situations by writing about them. For example, i was intrigued with Master's knife so i wrote a fantasy about hin using it on me. i put myself there, step by step through my fantasy. By doing that, i could begin to discover what triggered my fears, and what triggered my turn-ons. When Master reads these, he knows what is in my head and uses it, which is always a good thing.

Having said that, living through something is not even close to fantasy. But it is a way to explore an idea.

The other thing which was always drilled into me was to be honest with my feelings. Do not tell him simply what i think he needs to hear. How can he Master me that way, if he thinks i am going down one path when instead i'm miles from it. That in itself is a recipe for failure. Many submissives will do this, because they want to always be pleasing, and because it is so damn painful when they are unhappy with our thoughts. Master does not always like what i am thinking, but he needs to know it, so he can correct or fix it if necessary. Only then can we both be on the same page, and happy.

On a positive note, i have seen a move like this done before. i had a friend in Australia who moved to be with her Master in Florida (they were online only, for five months), having never met him in person. That was five years ago and they are now a happily married Master/slave couple. It can work. It just TAKES work.

i wish the best to your friend.

(in reply to theRose4U)

Post #: 9

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/20/2006 3:23:22 AM

Focus50

Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SoulBelow

I know a master who has a long distance slave. He has known her 5 years but has only been in her company for 5 weeks out of those 5 years. On the phone to him she is the perfect slave but the times he has met her he has had problems. They felt awkward around eachother to some degree because of not physically being together enough, she questioned him, she would freak out and say she didn't think she knew how to be a slave anymore, would feel jealousy towards masters other slave, would say she was okay with things but would then freak out if he decided he wanted to make her sleep in the closet. She had a way of manipulating him which gives her the power. Would disobey him when he told her to calm down and do as she was told etc etc... However on the phone she tells him things like " I want to be locked in a cupboard for a week when I next see you" things like that. Then says that when they eventually live together she wants to be kept in a basement and only brought out when he wants to play with her etc.

What confuses me is the way she behaves and the things she says don't match up. He is planning to bring her to England to live with him, even though she has never been outside of the USA. I am thinking that when she gets here she won't be all the things she has told him she can be. That she is just telling him what he wants to hear. I know she is very lonely and maybe just wants some security. I am worried about the master as he is a dear friend of mine and I don't want him to end up having a hard time with her. I'm not sure what to make of her to be honest. Anyone know of similar situations and how they worked out. I am very curious to know.

Looking at a smaller picture, I think the real problem comes from the 5 weeks in 5 years - that's 2 miserable percent of r/l over an extended period of time....

Personally, I don't see that there's necessarily anything wrong with her based on the information here. If a sub/slave can manipulate her Dom/Master, that'd be his fault. And I don't think being a sub means she should just kneel and obey because it's expected of her role; submission needs to be earned by the Dom and he doesn't sound as though he's put in the time and effort, hence her seemingly eratic behaviour. While both are responsible for the painfully drawn out nature of their particular relationship, ultimately the sub looks to the Dom for leadership and guidance and that also falls on his shoulders, not hers!

Fact is, I think in five years they still don't know each other. To me, she wants to believe in him but her obvious doubts are manifesting in negative actions.

Looking at a bigger picture, you say here that he has another slave yet in your second post you say he's never been a Master to someone in the flesh??? All due respect to your friend but if I were to apportion blame here, he's the one who gets in over his head and is not handling the consequences - that he's the one living the BDSM fantasy! Being Master comes with great responsibilities and it's naive to think any sub will just serve and obey freely without him demonstrating he deserves what's on offer. You're too close to see it but it's time to ask what's wrong with your friend! Doms lead by word and deed; start there....

Focus.

(in reply to SoulBelow)

Post #: 10

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/20/2006 4:27:28 AM

Jasmyn

Posts: 1234
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: New Zealand
Status: offline

If you want to be a supportive friend you can't second guess their actions until their actions are happening before you. Ok, so the few times, and I say few, because that is all you have to judge them on, haven't been to your liking, or even his, but people are prone to sussing each other out and being cautious... if this is his path that he wishes to try and nothing else comes to light before her big move, then you are no one, with no place to say anything, but support this decision.

If I didn't know better, and I don't, I'd hazard a guess your envy comes not out of concern for him but concern for yourself.

_____________________________

quote:

"To learn the art of submission a slave must first give up the desires that drew him to submission in the first place." Mistress Jasmyn Jan 2005.

Visit My Website

(in reply to SoulBelow)

Post #: 11

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/20/2006 10:44:20 AM

slavejali

Posts: 2918
Status: offline

quote:

If a sub/slave can manipulate her Dom/Master, that'd be his fault. And I don't think being a sub means she should just kneel and obey because it's expected of her role; submission needs to be earned by the Dom and he doesn't sound as though he's put in the time and effort, hence her seemingly eratic behaviour.

(I really liked that. It could be a topic in itself.)

In regards to the topic in question, mind, heart and hand is quite a skill to have working in unison. (Weird I'm writing that again, I just emailed someone using that.)

You could take the internet for example, there is a whole world of people online exploring bdsm D/s etc in their minds, even in their hearts, but who will never actually put into action.

i hope everything works out for them, if not, hope the lessons are learned.

(in reply to Jasmyn)

Post #: 12

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/20/2006 10:45:29 AM

SoulBelow

Posts: 30
Joined: 11/8/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jasmyn

If you want to be a supportive friend you can't second guess their actions until their actions are happening before you. Ok, so the few times, and I say few, because that is all you have to judge them on, haven't been to your liking, or even his, but people are prone to sussing each other out and being cautious... if this is his path that he wishes to try and nothing else comes to light before her big move, then you are no one, with no place to say anything, but support this decision.

If I didn't know better, and I don't, I'd hazard a guess your envy comes not out of concern for him but concern for yourself.

I see your point and I agree and I most certainly will support him in his decision. I am by no means trying to talk him out of it. I am just getting some opinions from the people on here who have maybe been through it so I can offer advice and help him whenever he needs someone to talk to about things.
I most certainly am not envious, I wish him all the luck in the world and I want it to go well for him. I will not be interfering in anyway. Just would like to be able to offer him some advice if/when he feels he may need it.

(in reply to Jasmyn)

Post #: 13

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/20/2006 6:01:09 PM

PenelopePitstop

Posts: 254
Joined: 4/22/2005
From: UK
Status: offline

...What immediately comes to mind is that there needs to be some kind of get-out clause...

_____________________________

Wickedness is a myth created by good people to account for the curious attractiveness of others ~ Oscar Wilde

"You had me at Goodbye"

(in reply to SoulBelow)

Post #: 14

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/21/2006 9:17:13 PM

Gideon147

Posts: 25
Joined: 1/7/2005
Status: offline

I have been in an LDR before. What I did was consider that first meeting just that...our first meeting. Most of what was said and done on the phone and the internet no longer applied because before I had Mastered her imagination. Now I needed to Master her all. We took things slowly, step by step during our first meeting. One lesson at a time. I needed to be confident that what she had dreamed she wanted was, in fact, what she wanted.

It is too easy for some to get caught up in the fantasy of the lifestyle. In reality, swats can sting like a sum-b*tch. In reality, feelings can be so much more acute because you're right there, the problems are right there, and everything you thought you could deal with is staring at you face-to-face. What people "think" they can deal with and what they really can is often two completely different things.

If they are trying to work through this then that can be a good thing. Simply a stumbling-stone towards something wonderful. But I'm with the other posters here, if he's been with her 5 weeks out of 5 years, then he has only truly had the ability to be her Dom for 5 weeks. Like any relationship, it can take some time to develop the bonds for a lasting relationship.

Gideon

P.S. And I am all for a Plan B or exit strategy as those before me have posted. It's always good to have a back-up plan in case things aren't as good as what they had intended.

(in reply to PenelopePitstop)

Post #: 15

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/21/2006 9:29:52 PM

Laura

Posts: 573
Joined: 6/22/2004
From: Ontario, Canada
Status: offline

I married an American and things did not work out. All the government/ Immigration stuff did not help the situation. We ended up divorced less than 2 years after we married. Then I had to trek home. Couldn't bring everything back with me plus no car, no job, all my money used up in moving. Anyway, I rebuilt my life back here again. That was almost 4 years ago.

I would NEVER EVER EVER EVER do it again. Not for anyone.

I'm Canadian, I think the farther distance would be worse. I could still drive across the border, they won't have that option when it's US/ UK.

Good luck to them cause even when you are sure, have been friends for a very long time, things change once you are together with all his family and friends and none of your own.

(in reply to Gideon147)

Post #: 16

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/22/2006 7:27:35 AM

Webmaster60

Posts: 396
Joined: 9/10/2005
Status: offline

quote:

That and the fact that he has never had to be a master to someone in the flesh.

Thats probably the point. Cyber an dphone are easy. There is no investment and there is no reality. Many Masters have the "mind" for it, but simply don't have the "Juice". She must FEEL him.

quote:

She even told him once that he didn't feel like a master to her and that he should seek advice from a more experienced Dom.

See above.
and its not something he can be taught. He's got THAT part on the phone. Ahhh but the flesh.. He either is, or isn't.

quote:

It doesn't seem right and her behaviour does not seem like the behaviour of a slave. Also he hasn't found a way to control this either.

She must be held securely in her bondage. If she IS a slave, and not held in bondage. The fault does not lie with her. See they have not had to live with the negative aspects of the others personality. All they deal with is the positive. If it gets negative.. hang up the phone. No investment there.

_____________________________

Master Michael
~~~~~~~~~~
"To sin in silence when he should
speak makes cowards of men"

(in reply to SoulBelow)

Post #: 17

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/23/2006 10:36:50 PM

windchymes

Posts: 9410
Joined: 4/18/2005
Status: offline

Sounds to me like they're both heading for disaster. Unfortunately, most of us have to learn our lessons the hard way.

(in reply to Webmaster60)

Post #: 18

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/23/2006 10:58:39 PM

Evanesce

Posts: 2325
Joined: 9/14/2005
Status: offline

It sounds to me like this girl has a rich fantasy life, but when the reality of what she's asking for hits, she can't handle it. I've a feeling this relationship is doomed to failure, but, if he's determined to see it through, perhaps he'd do well to arrange a one-month trial first, rather than just moving her in.

_____________________________

Denise

Give a slave what he truly needs, and he will do what you want.

"There's never a hero in a battle of ego." - Big & Rich

(in reply to SoulBelow)

Post #: 19

RE: Slave behaviour confusion. - 2/23/2006 11:34:30 PM

ayasha

Posts: 149
Joined: 12/10/2005
Status: offline

Maybe she should come over and spend a month or two before permanently moving? That would seem to be the safest, most sane decision for both of them.

(in reply to SoulBelow)

Post #: 20

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