how not to be pushy? (Full Version)

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oceanwinds -> how not to be pushy? (7/22/2009 5:10:43 PM)


I come for advice,. Being an aries it natural for me to be pushy at times. This is a problem Sir has told me has caused him to back away slightly. I feel like an child in regard to this, but how do you stop being pushy? Yes we talked, but would to hear from both s-types and doms how one can control it. In vanilla relationship was natural to make plans, sometimes I forget that this is not the same. At times i do interrupt as well. He suggested I wear a ball and gag to stop this annoying habit.
I am very interested in how others have over come these behaviors.

Thank you,

renee



CaringandReal -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/22/2009 5:33:28 PM)

Good question, and a tough one.  I don't have any real good answers, but in my experience a sub's personal level of  pushiness can increased or decreased by the partner they are with and how that person responds to them. How pushy a sub is arises from both people and how they interact, as the very same sub who is extremly pushy in one dom-sub situation can find herself extremely meek in another.
 
Some dominants encourage pushiness in their subs or do not mind it or they may even think that other more important things take priority and  make the pushiness the lesser of two evils. My former master was that way, and while he didn't mind it, I really minded how pushy I was around him. It made me feel very bad about myself.
 
Did you see the recent thread about fearing one's dominant? Fear outside of an erotic context can have some good effects, and one of those effects is that a sub who fears her master a bit will watch her actions and her mouth more closely and be less pushy than she might be with someone she holds no fear for. I am not describing a situation in which anyone is terrorized or brutally subjugated. I'm just talking a bout a litlte fear. For a pushy person who hates being pushy or agressive, I think such fear can be a godsend.  It gives them the little bit of assistance they need with keeping the mouthiness, the tendency to try to run things or organize or take over, in check.
 
I don't think such information helps you situation much, though. All I can do is ask the usual question: have you asked your dominant for his active help with curbing  this trait?  I saw where you said you "talked" but it's the "what" of the talk that is important, not the fact that you talked. It doesn't sound like, at least from what you've reported of his responses, he feels willing to confront or tackle your pushiness head on. That's not the best of situations, in fact, such an attitude can make things very difficult for a submissive, because if there's one thing most of us are lousy at, it's dominating ourselves.  While you can certainly assist, it's primarily his job to make you into the kind of submissive or slave he wants. If he wants this trait stopped in its tracks, then instead of backing off, instead of suggesting you wear a ball gag, he needs to actually do something about the situation. Like actually tie the ball gag in place, if it's relevant, and order you not to remove it. You are his to control. Withdrawing or making passive-agressive suggestions about something in you he doesn't approve of isn't very controlling, is it?



DesFIP -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/22/2009 5:44:19 PM)

If I'm talking too much he is certainly capable of putting his palm over my mouth for a minute. If I say I want to do x over the weekend, he is capable of saying he hasn't decided yet what we are doing. Hell he could even say that I need to say "Please oh great overlord, may this unworthy one see the new Star Trek movie with you on Saturday" or whatever he wants to hear.

But it's his job to teach me what to do that will please me. Just telling me, "this is wrong, fix it" won't work for me. Apparently it doesn't work for you either.



CaringandReal -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/22/2009 6:28:48 PM)

"Please oh great overlord, may this unworthy one see the new Star Trek movie with you on Saturday"
 
:D  Just curious, has he ever made  you say that?



littlewonder -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/22/2009 6:41:54 PM)

I have never had anyone tell me I'm pushy but there are times when I think I'm talking too much or trying to get my own way and I either shut up and just be quiet and let things just flow naturally or Master tells me to be quiet or that I'm being disobedient. I shut up and listen.

I had a teacher in grade school who always used to say "think before you speak". I learned a lot from that lesson and that's what I always do my best to remember..think before you speak.




Kalista07 -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/22/2009 6:55:07 PM)

Ocean.....
i'm going to just overlook everyone else's responses at this point... If i remember correctly haven't you recently posted that your Master is having some recent health issues or at the very least stress issues? On some level i can sort of comprehend where the others are coming from (dang it!!! I said i was going to over look those!) However, my experience is when a person reaches a certain level of stress they reach a point where they can no longer give to others... So, this might be one you need to address (at least primarily) on your own.  Have you ever worked on a group project? Have you ever worked as a team? Becoming *mindful* of one's self and one's surroundings  is such a necessary skill. i think the first step begins with becoming mindful of yourself..How much are you talking? How much are you domination the conversation? How much are you trying to get your own way? i hope this changes for you...i believe you can address this if you desire to.
Kali



oceanwinds -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/22/2009 8:14:38 PM)

I am going to try my best to address everyone's questions or points.
Kalista, yes we both our under a lot of pressure, and it is at least for myself taking a toll on me. Sir been very instrumental in helping me almost daily. I am dealing now with government agencies and trying to get thing organize. Things come through and they fall through with a day. He is understanding of that. I feel like I lost my touch in being submissive. I know it's here somewhee. I am grateful he brought up how he felt, and I spent a few hours tonight reviewing my actions.

Littlewonder i do need to begin to stop and think before i think. Thank you the suggestion.

Des. he is starting to let me know my boundaries again. We did take a break away from each for awhile.

i just wondering if i am losing my submissiveness or if it is all the other pressure pounding on me



vixenmoon -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/22/2009 9:29:10 PM)

Yoga has been helping me.  Basically, it's the form of meditation that I stick to the best, as well as a great workout.  :D  Mind you, not the yucky westernized workout yoga.  You want the meditative aspect.  It helps me to focus on observation.  Which quiets me down and helps me be at peace in general.  Those things will automatically lead to less pushiness, in my experience. 



gentlemanprince -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/22/2009 9:42:42 PM)

My lady and I have largely solved the problem, although it still bites us on occasion. I'm totally free to express my wants, although she doesn't have to indulge me. But where we got into trouble is when I would want to fix a situation for her. I've learned to ask, "What can I do to help or make it better?" That give her to option of telling me what she wants rather than having me go ahead and try to deal with the siutation on my own.



petmonkey -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/23/2009 12:07:46 AM)

i can speak about interruptions. 
Some people pause a lot--they choosing their words more carefully or simply naturally speak more slowly than others.  There might be a "tell" for when this is going on.  Watch his eyes and hands closely. Do His eyes look to a specific place between sentences, during pauses? He may look left, right, up, down, at your chest, doesn't matter here--more than likely it will be consistent.  Same with hands, there might be a particular gesture He has for when He's searching for the correct word.  i've seen some people use a "grasping the perfect word out of the air" motion or a palm slightly out as if the perfect word will fall into it.

People will sometimes slow down too, when they are conscious of being stressed or ill, they know they have to be more careful with words as they know their mind is distracted with background noise, whatever it may be.
Bravo to them for their awareness of the Now.

You can introduce an obivous "tell" too, for yourself when you wish to be heard.  Do it whenever you want to respond, if He prefers you be spoken too first.  He can choose it or you can choose it, but it must be consistent and something natural and unobtrusive to the flow of conversation.  i've used nodding vigorously, or pointing a finger as if i'm pointing at the comment, or pulling on an earlobe.  If you figure out your own physical tell, use it. Try to avoid things that make noise: quick intakes of breath, sniffing or throat clearing becomes A-noying, when i tried this once i ended up sounding like a rhino about to charge.
i read somewhere or other that only about 10% of conversation is in the words, the rest is body language and tone. Use that 90% to your advantage.

P.S. needing quiet time more often for Him, when it's come up, meant i needed to be allowed to indulge in quiet hobbies in His Presence.  There, but occupied with something non-kink related. Ask Him for appropriate suggestions. (as in: does the sound of clicking knitting neddles drive You bonkers? Not: So what the hay-now should i do instead?)

spellcheck-ified.



Mistressbinature -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/23/2009 3:40:36 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: oceanwinds


I come for advice,. Being an aries it natural for me to be pushy at times. This is a problem Sir has told me has caused him to back away slightly. I feel like an child in regard to this, but how do you stop being pushy? Yes we talked, but would to hear from both s-types and doms how one can control it. In vanilla relationship was natural to make plans, sometimes I forget that this is not the same. At times i do interrupt as well. He suggested I wear a ball and gag to stop this annoying habit.
I am very interested in how others have over come these behaviors.

Thank you,

renee


Guess it depends on what instances you are pushy, be it wanting something, trying to get a point across, Wearing a gag does not teach control, it merely stops you from continuing, I would assume he may be making a joke
Of course, chewing on a bar of soap may make you think twice before you step in it



oceanwinds -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/23/2009 5:06:13 AM)

thank you all
right now i need to step away from everything. I appreciate ur answers.

oceanwinds



olena -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/23/2009 9:30:41 AM)

For a long term happy relationship you have to be yourself and that includes your natural personality. To me reading this it would come down to not if sometimes you are pushy but how you take it when you do not get what you are pushing for and your Sir reacts in a natural way instead of being guarded or giving in out of fear of your reaction.

Both of you need to change your views on things. Your sir needs to stand strong and this will help you process and take a step back. I would guess in the long run your behavior will not continue to be so forceful or at least the context of your behavior will no longer will have any power over either of you like it now does.

I have a very strong personality and I have found that with a strong man that will not budge and stop me from crossing some line of disrespect that this actually helps greatly in doing better but still having a place to vent my natural emotions and personality.



sirsholly -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/23/2009 9:52:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: oceanwinds


I come for advice,. Being an aries it natural for me to be pushy at times. This is a problem Sir has told me has caused him to back away slightly. I feel like an child in regard to this, but how do you stop being pushy? Yes we talked, but would to hear from both s-types and doms how one can control it. In vanilla relationship was natural to make plans, sometimes I forget that this is not the same. At times i do interrupt as well. He suggested I wear a ball and gag to stop this annoying habit.
I am very interested in how others have over come these behaviors.

when it comes to being pushy, i can be a real pain in the ass.

It can be a good or bad thing, depending on your agenda. I pushed Jim to get an x-ray of his knee when it would not stop hurting. I was annoying the hell out of him but he finally saw a doctor (after i surprised him with an appointment) although i think he went just to shut me up. Yes...i was pushy, i was annoying, i ignored him when he asked me to back off, and i will do it again in a heartbeat should the need arise.



DesFIP -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/23/2009 3:23:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: CaringandReal

"Please oh great overlord, may this unworthy one see the new Star Trek movie with you on Saturday"
 
:D  Just curious, has he ever made  you say that?


Not at all, this was exaggeration. But lots of people do have speech restrictions. They have to say "If you please Master, may I?" or whatever.

The point is that if he feels saying anything that doesn't begin with "Please may I" is being pushy, then he needs to tell.



oceanwinds -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/23/2009 4:54:13 PM)

I walked away from my friend, Sir. I always will honor how he helped me but now it is an unhealthy relationship. I deserve more then what he is willing to give me.




Kalista07 -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/23/2009 5:05:58 PM)

Ocean,
You have cmail. i am sorry things had to end this way.

Kali



dreamerdreaming -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/23/2009 5:34:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: oceanwinds

I walked away from my friend, Sir. I always will honor how he helped me but now it is an unhealthy relationship. I deserve more then what he is willing to give me.




Wow, that sucks. [sm=frown.gif]


But its great that you have the good self-esteem that you need, to see that you deserve more. Everyone has a right to seek and find true fulfillment and self- actualization, or self-realization. (See Maslow's hierarchy of needs at:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Maslow%27s_hierarchy_of_needs.svg  ).

In our short lives, it is very important that we stick up for ourselves- for our right to work toward the goals we want to achieve, and for our right to have our needs and desires properly addressed, whether we are partnered or single.
 
Sounds like maybe he's a great guy, but just not the right fit for you. Congrats for bravely facing that reality so that you can begin to move on. I sooooo admire you!



oceanwinds -> RE: how not to be pushy? (7/23/2009 7:35:41 PM)

quote:

Sounds like maybe he's a great guy, but just not the right fit for you. Congrats for bravely facing that reality so that you can begin to move on. I sooooo admire you!


Thank you dreamerdreaming
Nothing about me to admire. I learned at a young age to rebuild from scratch. Never seems to get easier though. I built a life after hubby died, and now 4 years later I am losig a big chunk of it, home, health, friend who is a dom, and my self worth seems to be seeping but i dont mean to whine or complain. I just need to rebuild.

oceanwinds



FireandIceCpl -> RE: how not to be pushy? (9/6/2009 9:19:38 PM)

Yes being pushy can be a problem for any submissive. The ability for the submisive to learn when to talk or not to talk is on the dom. I also feel it can be trained in more ways then just a ball and gag or just a simple fix. You said you were an aries and that makes you pushy and your having a problem tranistioning from vanilla life to BDSM life. I feel it is effective if you think of all times with your Master as never vanilla and always hold back. It has to come from within you to be able to keep your self from being pushy. Your Master has to then bring it out of you with certain sessions and different ideas for when you are pushy. Like you said in your question you feel like a child. Maybe your Master should treat you as one. I mean if your not pushy get a reward and if you are pushy punish you with talking restictions or going out restrictions to teach you not to be pushy. To break your nature and retrain your mind for his desires.

FireandIcecpl



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