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Kind of a collar question?? - 8/24/2004 6:35:15 PM   
smilezz


Posts: 2156
Joined: 6/18/2004
Status: offline 		I am a collared slave....am also doing some re-search for my own personal journal and i have come across a question with a few others that i thought i would pose here.
You have been collared, for whatever reason that trust within your relationship was broken at some point...(both parties are working through this) you are working hard to come to terms with not only with the trust issue...but with putting that collar back on your neck. Does that collar mean the same thing to you given what had happened? Do you wear that collar with just as much pride as you did before, given the fact that the relationship is not 'broken' it just needs time and healing? Do you wear the given collar anyway because that's what He wants even though you may not have the same feeling of "that particular" collar?

Curious...

~smilezz~

_____________________________

=It's not my fault that when I was a baby I was dropped in a box of Glitter & I have been shinin' ever since=

�*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,-:* �
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/24/2004 7:08:24 PM   
cheeba0228


Posts: 230
Joined: 7/27/2004
From: Detroit
Status: offline 		Do you throw out a child because it has misbehaved? Do you run away from home because you didnt like being grounded? If all it needs are time and healing I'd say proceed in normal fashion. If you are collared by him, i would continue wearing the collar. Time heals all thing. Some just take more time than others.

_____________________________

LIFE'S JOURNEY IS NOT TO ARRIVE AT THE GRAVE SAFELY IN A WELL PRESERVED
BODY, BUT RATHER TO SKID IN SIDEWAYS, TOTALLY WORN OUT, SHOUTING "HOLY
SHIT......WHAT A RIDE!


(in reply to smilezz)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/24/2004 7:35:55 PM   
stormiKnightBEAR


Posts: 306
Joined: 3/14/2004
Status: offline 		Unless you are finished with the relationship, why would you take the collar off?

For this girl... and goodness knows many here think stormi is dumb as a rock...
stormi's ko'lar is to stormi the same commitment that stormi put into nearly 25 yrs of
marriage to one man. stormi is committed to Master Bear.

stormi does things not intentionally but just the same that disappoints Master, atleast
from stormi's view she's disappointed Him. Master has done things that stormi wanted
done differently, but stormi's role in life is to serve Master, while free per Master to offer
her thoughts she is not the final decision maker. Master is. When stormi feels she's let Master
down, Master will often remind stormi there is a 40 yr. contract between them, and He will
not allow her to break it. It's His way of telling stormi that everyone stumbles, but that our
relationship is worth the work and commitment.

Trust is hard. Trust in question is even harder. But the bottom line is do you try to overcome the
problem or do you turn your back and walk away. Only you can answer that and only you can
ask for release from a collar that you feel was betrayed. The choice is yours.

Good Luck in your path,
stormi
property of Master Bear

< Message edited by stormiKnightBEAR -- 8/24/2004 7:36:30 PM >

_____________________________

owned white silk slave of TEMJI aka Master Bear

PROUD TO BE TEXAN AND AMERICAN BY BIRTH~
GOD BLESS TEXAS AND THE U.S.A !!!!

(in reply to smilezz)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/25/2004 9:00:09 AM   
smilezz


Posts: 2156
Joined: 6/18/2004
Status: offline 		Thank you both for the posts...i still have my own views on this, but it's nice to know that i can get others also...which is the reason for the post in the first place.

Hope y'all have a great day...

~smilezz~

_____________________________

=It's not my fault that when I was a baby I was dropped in a box of Glitter & I have been shinin' ever since=

�*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,-:* �

(in reply to smilezz)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/25/2004 9:20:11 AM   
kiki blue


Posts: 315
Joined: 1/16/2004
From: Brisbane, Australia
Status: offline 		It's really up to those involved as to whether the collar means the same or not. Having had my trust broken quite badly by my ex, I wanted the relationship to work, and kept wearing the collar because I believed in us, that we could work things out. While we didn't ultimately (for other reasons), I think rebuilding the trust and foundations are far more important than the collar itself.

_____________________________

Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional.

(in reply to smilezz)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/25/2004 9:21:40 AM   
WzDom


Posts: 2
Joined: 7/14/2004
Status: offline 		i am known as obedient-1 submissive to WzDom... we have been living a 24/7 M/s relationship for the last 2 years... in may of this year, a situation arrose and my Master removed my collar and i am now a 'free submissive' there have been times when we have gone to play parties or BDSM events where a collar completes the outfit, and it has done such a mind fuck to me to feel that leather around my neck, at times sending me to tears that its not "the same collar' the meaning is completely different, and my desire to completely submit isn't the same as it was before the trust was broken. i have negotiated with Him that at times where a collar is proper, that we wear one of the other collars i had been given and not "His" collar. it still messes with me because when my collar was removed i felt so lost, so confused, as if with out a purpose.... and yet i long to feel that security of having a collar around my neck again. This is just another subbies input (: wishing A/all a wonderful week. hugs, tam

(in reply to smilezz)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/26/2004 6:01:31 AM   
stormiKnightBEAR


Posts: 306
Joined: 3/14/2004
Status: offline 		kiki and obedient-1

very good points. stormi did not mean to imply that the collar/ko'lar are the most
important thing. However stormi does believe that the collar/ko'lar offers a sense
of security, committment, or maybe just comfort. The comfort that comes from
all those wonderful feelings when it was first locked around your neck.

stormi has removed a leather collar in the past. It was very hard. But the anger
and hurt from the betrayal was enough to open this girl's eyes and say "girl just
what the hell are you doing here?????" So... stormi took the collar off and went for
a 4 hour horse back ride and came back refreshed and completely at ease.

obedient-1.....stormi's heart goes out to you. Like you stormi has several ko'lars
that she wears one that is put on every night by Master when He gets home, one
that is for events, the 'family' claddaugh which is not supposed to come off except
for cleaning, the claddaugh ring that the family wears, and then.... there is the ko'lar
that Master placed on stormi's neck on June 13, 2004 during the ceremony. It never
comes off. We did take it off one time for the events ko'lar... but it was like.... being
left to die... when stormi expressed it to Master, even tho the events ko'lar is a wide
leather waterfall ko'lar, Master's heart ko'lar never comes off.

If there were some words that could offer you the comfort for those times, stormi would
offer them to you. Unfortunately all stormi can do is offer her understanding.
This girl wishes you and your Master a path of discovery and hapiness.

kiki... btw, this girl owes you a Thank You... for the reference you said of stormi being
good at 3rd person speech. stormi does try.. but thank goodness there is backspacing and
delete.... LOL

Have a good week and thank all of you for giving this girl many reasons to realize sometimes
just how lucky she is.


In Service,
stormi
property of Master Bear

_____________________________

owned white silk slave of TEMJI aka Master Bear

PROUD TO BE TEXAN AND AMERICAN BY BIRTH~
GOD BLESS TEXAS AND THE U.S.A !!!!

(in reply to WzDom)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/26/2004 8:28:04 AM   
kiki blue


Posts: 315
Joined: 1/16/2004
From: Brisbane, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: stormiKnightBEAR
kiki... btw, this girl owes you a Thank You... for the reference you said of stormi being
good at 3rd person speech. stormi does try.. but thank goodness there is backspacing and
delete.... LOL


That is indeed one of the good things about online interaction The backspace and delete keys are our friends! I see no reason not to use them lol.

But back to 3rd person, it's something I tried, and while it's certainly easier online, I think it's one of those things that don't 'fit' everyone. Some people slip into and wear it easily, others wear it like it's a spandex suit two sizes too small. I was the latter, if you couldn't guess .

_____________________________

Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional.

(in reply to stormiKnightBEAR)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/26/2004 8:31:24 AM   
proudsub


Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
Status: offline
quote:

But back to 3rd person, it's something I tried, and while it's certainly easier online


What is the purpose of 3d person speech--is it supposed to make you feel like less of a person? or is it a Gor thing? or just humbling? or what?

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to kiki blue)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/26/2004 9:32:14 AM   
Destinysskeins


Posts: 267
Joined: 7/1/2004
Status: offline 		Greetings,

smilezz - Personally, i would continue to wear the collar even though the connotations were not exactly the same to me as they were when the relationship first began. A couple of reasons for this: first, relationships are fluid and everchanging so to some extent this is inevitable and secondly, because the simple act of continuing to wear this collar may lend reassurance to your Master that you are both striving to do all that you can to regain your former luster in this relationship.

proudsub - Though i don't engage in the third person speech i think i understand (at least a little) why it is used. If i'm wrong i'm sure someone will correct me! It is used very often in Gor but also in other M/s situations where the slave is property and is owned. Speaking in first person has connotations of taking ownership of ones' self (i.e. my, her, i, etc) and since they do not own themselves it is considered improper and disrespectful of one's true Owner.

Well Wishes

_____________________________

Wilted petals fall from a rose like bitters tears wrung from a heart whose dreams have shattered. What hope for the future can be seen by eyes that are darkened with sorrow neverending?

i'm not manic-depressive, i just have an elliptical personality

(in reply to proudsub)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/26/2004 9:36:42 AM   
proudsub


Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
Status: offline
quote:

proudsub - Though i don't engage in the third person speech i think i understand (at least a little) why it is used. If i'm wrong i'm sure someone will correct me! It is used very often in Gor but also in other M/s situations where the slave is property and is owned. Speaking in first person has connotations of taking ownership of ones' self (i.e. my, her, i, etc) and since they do not own themselves it is considered improper and disrespectful of one's true Owner.


Thanks Destiny, that's kinda what i figured.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to Destinysskeins)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/26/2004 10:46:23 AM   
stormiKnightBEAR


Posts: 306
Joined: 3/14/2004
Status: offline 		Destinysskeins and proudsub,

You are pretty much on the right track.

From the Gor stand point it is the whole slaves are property aspect.

For Master and this girl, The effort made to speak in 3rd person pleases
Master. Master has never actually said that stormi must do so. But, stormi
knows from conversations in Gor settings that Master liked the idea. When
stormi first started, Master was probably the most surprised. It truly is a very
big step for someone to change their thought train like that.

Add to the mix that in daily life stormi does use terms like "Master, i did such
and such today or may i do so and so...." But always in private. It is not something
that stormi would ever consider doing especailly in Gorean settings.

Truth be known < and stormi is sure some will need heart doctors after reading this>
stormi most likely has not said more than 200 words in the year that she has gone to
Gor events. Why?.... Because unless spoken to by Master or given permission by Master
to speak, stormi sits quietly at His side. That's just the way it is.

In leather scenes, stormi never leaves Master side without permission nor does she hug or
allow anyone to touch her without permission. It's just the way Master's protocol and stormi's
beliefs blend.

Thanks for the question.

Serving always,
stormi
property of Master Bear

_____________________________

owned white silk slave of TEMJI aka Master Bear

PROUD TO BE TEXAN AND AMERICAN BY BIRTH~
GOD BLESS TEXAS AND THE U.S.A !!!!

(in reply to Destinysskeins)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/26/2004 10:56:49 AM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
Interesting question proud...(hope your feeling better now...hugzzz)

Angel speaks in both 1st & 3rd... Its a switch between the two... online and realtime. I do not have a Gorean Master, nor do I consider myself slave and my husband does not desire me to do either one or the other but I am allowed to speak as I feel comfortable. But have thought about it, and find that when Angel is expressing her thoughts, she speaks third person... when she is responding and interacting with others, then it is a mixture of both. Yikes, mebbe Angels just all mixed up...lol... I have studied English quite deeply, and various languages (latin/older english/french/ 13th 17th cent' /cornish/etc)... I love where language comes from - even if my spelling sux... *giggles*.. and I do think that has something to do with it. One speaks in third person more with sisters and a Dominant one respects... but I would not say I do so because I fear disrespecting anyone... but one finds it sounds quite beautiful(Imo)


_____________________________
.dark.



...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to proudsub)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/26/2004 11:47:47 AM   
proudsub


Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
Status: offline
quote:

Interesting question proud...(hope your feeling better now...hugzzz)


Thank you angel. Yes much better, just coughing a little now, but am back on the golf course so am happy.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to darkinshadows)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 8/27/2004 4:52:52 AM   
smilezz


Posts: 2156
Joined: 6/18/2004
Status: offline 		After reading all the posts, i guess i need to clear a few things up. I am on a few sites that i post on.....i get ideas from them...from things that i have written..people that i speak with online and in r/t. The most recent was on collars and what i posted...hence me bringing it to this forum as a question. My collar is not going anwywhere...i proudly wear it around my neck and heart...i worship the very ground that Man walks on and always will *grinz*
Thank you all for taking the time to post what you did.

~smilezz~

_____________________________

=It's not my fault that when I was a baby I was dropped in a box of Glitter & I have been shinin' ever since=

�*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,-:* �

(in reply to smilezz)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 10/3/2004 12:04:36 PM   
kajari


Posts: 7
Joined: 10/2/2004
Status: offline 		You are a captured slave owned by Master and obedience to Master is the only option to a real or true slave.

(in reply to smilezz)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 10/3/2004 9:01:03 PM   
Laura


Posts: 573
Joined: 6/22/2004
From: Ontario, Canada
Status: offline 		How can someone else answer this for you? A collar is a very personal committment and has deep meaning for the two people involved (or should). If the relationship has been broken it can heal if you work at it. The collar should not become an accessory though. When you feel healed or ready to forgive you should let him know you will accept the collar again. Then it will be his time to decide if he has healed and forgiven himself enough to collar you again.

Without knowing the situation I can't give much advice. I'm not asking for the details. A collar is a very personal thing, just as a relationship is. It's easy for a stranger to tell you to accept the collar because you're still with him. If it doesn't feel right to you I don't think you should do it. No one outside of your relationship can really tell you what you should feel or what you should do.

Take your time and in the end be true to yourself.

_____________________________

Bait & Switch - Adult column

(in reply to kajari)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 10/7/2004 1:16:00 AM   
Suleiman


Posts: 1127
Joined: 9/9/2004
Status: offline 		The first few times my trust was broken? Of course the collar meant just as much to me. It still does, ten years after the fact. The symbolic value of the collar was as much a part of me as it was a relationship between myself and my owner. Eventually, the problems proved to be too much, and when, during yet another argument, my mistress declaired (again) that she was "finished" and removed my collar (again) I was finally ready to agree with her. The collar never got put back on. I wore my collar with pride. I wear my current (occasional) collar with just as much pride. I am a submissive, and to be owned is, to my mind, a form of personal, emotional, and spiritual completion. I serve for my own sake as much as for the pleasure of the person I serve.

< Message edited by Suleiman -- 10/7/2004 1:20:49 AM >

_____________________________

Think of my verbosity as a sort of litmus test for our relationship. I write in a manner identical to how I speak and how I think. If you can not cope with what I have written here, it is probably for the best if we go our separate ways.

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Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 10/7/2004 4:01:48 AM   
Suleiman


Posts: 1127
Joined: 9/9/2004
Status: offline 		Okay, I'm probably gonna get flamed for this, but what the heck...

quote:

ORIGINAL: kajari

You are a captured slave owned by Master and obedience to Master is the only option to a real or true slave.


This might be a good time for you to cash in that reality check, darling. We all of us here are real people with real lives - yourself included. That means we think, we feel, we want, and we decide. We have the option of deciding to serve, but that is a decision. From your statement I'd either be seriously insulted at your implication that I am insufficiently submissive because I think for myself, or else I would be very worried that you thought the fantasy you roleplay with your lovers is real and you actually have been carried off somewhere in chains without hope of rescue. Fantasy is a lovely thing - I spend an awful lot of my time in my own home-made happy place - but it is only a fantasy. Some times, reality just dosen't measure up, especially in relationships.

_____________________________

Think of my verbosity as a sort of litmus test for our relationship. I write in a manner identical to how I speak and how I think. If you can not cope with what I have written here, it is probably for the best if we go our separate ways.

(in reply to kajari)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Kind of a collar question?? - 10/7/2004 4:57:29 AM   
smilezz


Posts: 2156
Joined: 6/18/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kajari

You are a captured slave owned by Master and obedience to Master is the only option to a real or true slave.



Please elaborate on this more.....

Does this mean in your eyes that you are only a 'real/true' slave if you are owned/captured by Him/Her.....as you say? am confused by your statement. I have views of my own here too....but am curious as to what you mean by this?

~smilezz~

_____________________________

=It's not my fault that when I was a baby I was dropped in a box of Glitter & I have been shinin' ever since=

�*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,-:* �

(in reply to kajari)
Profile   Post #: 20
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