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Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 7:01:35 AM

TheHeretic

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This strikes me as something straight out of 1984, or from the reign of Stalin or Hitler, but it is very real and happening here. U.S. citizens are being encouraged to report "fishy" conversations to the White House by using a new email account that has been set up.

You can read about it here:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/Facts-Are-Stubborn-Things/
These rumors often travel just below the surface via chain emails or through casual conversation. Since we can’t keep track of all of them here at the White House, we’re asking for your help

I have a problem with this. I have a great big fucking problem with the idea that the White House wants to "keep track" of people who question what the President says. The government is asking us to report our friends, neighbors and co-workers.

I say "Oh, HELL no!"

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Post #: 1

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 7:11:10 AM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
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This isn't new. It's always been this way. You could do this with any president. It just wasn't announced.

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 2

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 7:21:50 AM

Louve00

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Joined: 2/1/2009
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I don't know. I find it kind of the opposite, really. I don't see it as the gov't wanting us to report anyone. Just to report the rumors we are hearing. I would guess so they can contact you, or if seeing the same rumors being circulated...or "reported" over and over again, to address it to the nation. As we all know, there are people for and against this bill. The thread on astro turf vs artificial turf, in my opinion, is the exact thing Linda Douglas (the woman in the first video) is talking about. I see this as the whitehouse trying to disarm these arguments and debates. After all, townhall meetings are becoming a place of violence over this matter, despite how anyone wishes to color it, insist on it being their right, or whatever. In no way am I saying everyone should listen to the whitehouses defense and just automatically agree with it, because the president says we should. I am just saying they are trying to off-set the arguments against it. Its their right to defend it, as much as its the right of those who wish to debunk it.

Now.....if men in black suits came to pick ME up, accusing me of throwing such accusations, and preparing to legally punish me for it, then I'm with you. It's a big brother thing. But thats not how I am seeing it.

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(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 3

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 7:46:59 AM

kdsub

Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
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heh heh heh...I have just reported YOU...you are now on the list...Better look out the window...THERE....SEE!!!... a black SUV...oh boy your are in big trouble now.

Yes my post is dumb...but damn can't you see how ridiculous you sound. Do you see bogymen in the closet at night too?

This type of paranoid crap well be the downfall of our country yet.

It is amazing that intelligent people like yourself are so easily fooled and led by the nose by the Carl Rove's of this world.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 8/8/2009 7:57:08 AM >

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Post #: 4

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 7:51:59 AM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
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From: United States
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Well hell Butch,now that those damm liburals are in the White House we should all be paranoid.....Oh how I long for the days of Bush/Cheney when the air was fresh and transparency in gov't was the buzzword....when laws the Founding Fathers could be proud of were passed...yanno like The Patriot Act!!!!! Yeah those were the days my friends.....a shame they had to end.

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(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 5

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 7:57:38 AM

angelikaJ

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This isn't reporting on your neighbors a la The Crucible.

This is using computer technology to have a clearinghouse for information on rumours and scare tactics (such as this).

I can understand with your mindset that you could perceive it very differently from the way it is presented and I can see how others might as well.

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Post #: 6

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 8:04:40 AM

TheHeretic

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From: California, USA
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Try this, folks, just so we can get a reboot. Imagine that what we have is an email address (an official, "WhiteHouse.Gov" address) so people can be encouraged to report anyone questioning Bush II's plans to invade Iraq to secure Saddam's weapons of mass destruction.

Still so okay with the concept?

< Message edited by TheHeretic -- 8/8/2009 8:11:00 AM >

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

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Post #: 7

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 8:17:16 AM

FirmhandKY

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Try this, folks, just so we can get a reboot. Imagine that what we have is an email address (an official, "WhiteHouse.Gov" address) so people can be encouraged to report anyone questioning Bush II's plans to invade Iraq to secure Saddam's weapons of mass destruction.

Still so okay with the concept?

Damn, Rich.

Don't you know ... it's only something to get excited about when Republicans take names ... Democrats are "beings of light", and would never misuse such information.

Republicans, on the other hand, would instantly arrest everyone, and send them to concentration camp.

Hell, that's American Politics 101. Get with the program!

Firm

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Post #: 8

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 8:20:35 AM

slvemike4u

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From: United States
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Yeah Rich,as a matter of fact I am ok with your hypothetical....hell some good might have come from having everyone opposed actually counted.Perhaps we wouldn't have went looking for nonexistant WMD's in the Iraqi desert...Great idea...too bad we can't actually go back and implement it!
p.s. Did you really intend to phrase the question in that fashion.Seems bad form to mention opposition to Bush's folly(ie:looking for WMD's where there were none)and not get some pushback over it.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 9

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 8:40:04 AM

ThatDamnedPanda

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Joined: 1/26/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
I have a problem with this. I have a great big fucking problem with the idea that the White House wants to "keep track" of people who question what the President says. The government is asking us to report our friends, neighbors and co-workers.

I say "Oh, HELL no!"

"Hell no" is right, because the way you're describing that webpage is 100% pure, absolute bullshit. There is nothing in there - not one fucking word - that asks people to "report our friends, neighbors, and co-workers." Not one word. You're just making that up. What the paragraph says, in excruciatingly clear English, is that there are so many people out there spreading idiotic and hysterical lies about health care reform (and, obviously, so many people gullible enough to believe them), they need a little help in getting the word out. And they're asking people who hear these idiotic rumors to pass the rumors on so the Administration can publically counter these lies and misconceptions. Not one word about "keeping track of people who question what the president says." That's just complete fantasy.

They could not possibly have been more clear about what they were asking. I mean, for christ's sake, that page was written at about the 5th-grade comprehension level. The fact that a grown man could read that "see Jane run" language and still completely misinterpret it as something so far removed from what it really says (and then spread that total bullshit on the internet, as you're doing) speaks volumes about the problem they're up against. You can only dumb something down so much; as long as there are people out there who insist on completely distorting it and misrepresenting it, these stupid, paranoid rumors are never going to stop.

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Post #: 10

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 8:43:43 AM

ThatDamnedPanda

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Joined: 1/26/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Try this, folks, just so we can get a reboot. Imagine that what we have is an email address (an official, "WhiteHouse.Gov" address) so people can be encouraged to report anyone questioning Bush II's plans to invade Iraq to secure Saddam's weapons of mass destruction.

Still so okay with the concept?

No, try this instead - try reading the fucking article and confining your remarks to what it actually says instead of making up these bullshit fantasies and spreading these tinfoil hat rumors that you're just making up out of nowhere. What do you think of that concept? I'll admit it probably wouldn't be as much fun for you, but it would certainly be a lot more beneficial to your credibility.

_____________________________

Panda, panda, burning bright
In the forest of the night
What immortal hand or eye
Made you all black and white and roly-poly like that?

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 11

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 9:12:37 AM

MmeGigs

Posts: 706
Joined: 1/26/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
Try this, folks, just so we can get a reboot. Imagine that what we have is an email address (an official, "WhiteHouse.Gov" address) so people can be encouraged to report anyone questioning Bush II's plans to invade Iraq to secure Saddam's weapons of mass destruction.

Still so okay with the concept?

The Bush II administration did that. Operation TIPS. It didn't go over very well and didn't last very long.

This is different, though. They aren't asking folks to report people, they're asking folks to report rumors. Big difference there. The disinformation swirling around about health care reform is astounding. One of the best has to be that seniors will be forced to commit suicide. Once a juicy rumor gets rolling, it's nearly impossible to debunk it no matter how ridiculous it is. It looks to me like the Obama administration is trying to get ahead of the rumors and counter them while it's still possible to do so, before they become widespread. Seems pretty common-sensical to me.

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 12

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 11:13:29 AM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u
Did you really intend to phrase the question in that fashion.Seems bad form to mention opposition to Bush's folly(ie:looking for WMD's where there were none)and not get some pushback over it.

Yes, Mike, that was exactly how I wanted to frame the analogy. A bunch of bullshit from official sources that was supposed to go unquestioned, just as we are apparently not to question President Obama when he speaks (or his spokesholes speak on his behalf) about health care reform.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 13

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 11:20:07 AM

DanaYielding

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Joined: 12/11/2008
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Aren't lies, rumors and innuendos the American way of life? Hell we've had politicians doing it since before there was a recognized country!

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 14

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 11:23:12 AM

dcnovice

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Joined: 8/2/2006
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<fast reply>

If the White House were attempting to track people, I would indeed join Heretic in finding that disturbing.

My honest impression, though, is that the administration is trying to gather information on rumors, with a view toward answering them. That seems quite different to me.

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it's never enough to keep up.

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Post #: 15

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 11:29:01 AM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
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From: Chicago, IL
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Let me get this straight, the Obama administration is equivalent to the Nazis or Stalinist Russia because the government is trying to do something snopes.com does? This is definitely in the right section of the forum.

(in reply to dcnovice)

Post #: 16

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 11:37:45 AM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda
try reading the fucking article and confining your remarks to what it actually says instead of making up these bullshit fantasies and spreading these tinfoil hat rumors that you're just making up out of nowhere.

I quoted directly from the White House site, Panda. They are asking that casual conversation be reported directly to the executive branch of government.

Double standards seem to be all over the place today.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to ThatDamnedPanda)

Post #: 17

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 11:39:33 AM

GreedyTop

Posts: 52100
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From: Savannah, GA
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Theyre asking for casual conversation relating to rumours surrounding the health care reform issue.

ETA::

taken from the website AND from your OP: These rumors often travel just below the surface via chain emails or through casual conversation.

< Message edited by GreedyTop -- 8/8/2009 11:41:55 AM >

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Post #: 18

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 12:31:01 PM

TheHeretic

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From: California, USA
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Funny thing, Ken, even the ACLU has the intellectual honesty to call this a, "bad idea that could send a troublesome message."

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If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 19

RE: Flag at WhiteHouse dot Gov - Very Troubling - 8/8/2009 12:31:38 PM

SilverMark

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I made the mistake once of going to whitehouse.com once while helping my then 12 year old son with a report....it is a much better site but, couldn't finish the free tour with him in the room!

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Post #: 20

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