Is the country heading in the right direction?

Is the country heading in the right direction? (Full Version)

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Brain -> Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/15/2009 8:42:34 PM)
Dick Cheney rolls in his grave / Of course, he's not actually dead. He just wishes you were Did you feel that? That sickly sort of rolling wave, that disquieting, genital-shriveling temblor of seething grumpiness that swept through the land and made dogs spasm, trees shudder and giant SUVs spit oil and misfire? You might've missed it. It happened just after Bill Clinton returned from his rather astonishing rescue mission to North Korea, two exhausted, grateful, grinning, tearful young American female journalists in tow, Al Gore standing by with a giant smile and President Obama and much of his administration off in the wings, nodding approvingly, as the entire nation found itself a bit dumbfounded at the calm and rather effortless brand of new, intelligent, humble, hugely effective humanitarian patriotism on display here. The churning, teeth-grinding rumble of disquiet? It was coming, of course, from Dick Cheney. (Author note: From here on out, the phrase "Dick Cheney" shall hereby refer not merely to the former vice-president himself, but also to the sour, clenched worldview he so perfectly encapsulated and still so lovingly represents. Dick Cheney is a lexical wonder. He can be a violent action verb: "Dude I just Dick Cheney'd that squirrel with my F-150." He is a dark intention: "Let's pull a Dick Cheney on that queer kid in the locker room." He is, most of all, a state of being, a mindset, a fixed position of general disgust. "Sorry lady, I can't save you from this burning building. I'm far too Dick Cheney to give a damn." Clear? Excellent. Let's continue). ………………………………............................... ………………………………............................... The difference is staggering. See, right now the kill-'em-all-and-let-God-sort-'em-out crowd is utterly disgusted that President Obama clearly has zero qualms about taking a notch or five out of bedpost of American machismo bulls--t, about swiping the cancer stick from the mouth of the long dead Marlboro Man and replacing it with something like integrity, calm words of wisdom, tact. To the Cheney metaverse, this is a disgusting and shameful way to do America's business. With the North Korea situation, we didn't come out looking like sweaty, bulbous titans. There was no red-faced screaming, no flag-draped caskets. Most of all, America didn't get to thump its chest. And if America can't thump its chest and pull out the biggest gun and let the world know who's still boss, well, America has no power whatsoever. Who the hell wants to be known for demonstrating peaceful, effective humanitarianism and calm diplomacy, and saving human lives if it makes us look like a bunch of weak-kneed pansies? Where is the glory? Where's the firepower? Image is everything. Strut the plumage. Carry the biggest stick. In Cheneyland, sneering intimidation is not only useful, it's vital. There is nothing else. Or maybe not. Maybe the Obama Way is already turning out to be far more effective, more subtle and intriguing, and much more in America's favor, as tyrannical psychopaths like Kim Jong Il are stupefied into compliance by even the pretense of being taken seriously by the Great Satan, and sane world leaders across the globe finally see a country they can deal with intelligently on pressing matters instead of merely joining them at the gun range to blast stuff to hell. You might say Dick is not pleased. In fact, Dick Cheney -- and the entire hawkish, antagonistic worldview he embodies -- is downright furious at this country's dangerous new direction. Which, in its way, just might be the best news I've heard all year. Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2009/08/14/notes081409.DTL#ixzz0OJUL9MOF

rightwinghippie -> RE: Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/15/2009 8:50:54 PM)
Of course in the real world, Obama made clear that Bill's visit, was not state approved and not diplomacy. Also in the real world, Obama is continuing the exact Bush policy of refusing to meet with NK except within the context of the 6 party talks. I guess the article might help people not notice the kids Obama is killing in Pakistan and Africa. Dick Cheny is indeed very happy that Obama is continuing his policies. I would bet Cheny cares way more about the actuall polices than who gets credit

Esinn -> RE: Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/15/2009 9:48:04 PM)
I think it is going better than when we had Bush. I have a feeling health care will improve shortly.

SpinnerofTales -> RE: Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/15/2009 10:01:09 PM)
quote: Of course in the real world, Obama made clear that Bill's visit, was not state approved and not diplomacy. Also in the real world, Obama is continuing the exact Bush policy of refusing to meet with NK except within the context of the 6 party talks. quote: ORIGINAL: rightwinghippie Of course Obama made clear that Bill's visit was "off the record"...it's called diplomacy. Let me remind you of the resolution of the Cuban Missile Crisis. After coming to the brink of nuclear war, the Russians and Americans came to an agreement both could live with. Then Kruschev sent a new demand for an agreement the United States could not live with. JFK's reaction was to pretend we never got the second arrangement and publicly agree to the first. In short, a little bit of force, a little bit of schmoozing and a little bit of being willing to bullshit is what diplomacy is all about. End result: no more nukes in Cuba. If the ultra right wing had invested in better ideas rather than putting all their bets on the failure of the Obama administration, we might have some justifiable admiration for a diplomatic action that worked all around.

rightwinghippie -> RE: Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/15/2009 10:10:13 PM)
Before you remind me of, you need to convince me of the relevance of the Cuban Missle Crisis to this issue. Is it just a deflection, and attempt to get the discussion into the details of the CMC? Are you of the opinion that Obama made a secret Deal ? And Obama is lying to the American people about it?

SpinnerofTales -> RE: Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/15/2009 10:22:43 PM)
quote: Before you remind me of, you need to convince me of the relevance of the Cuban Missle Crisis to this issue. Is it just a deflection, and attempt to get the discussion into the details of the CMC? Are you of the opinion that Obama made a secret Deal ? And Obama is lying to the American people about it? ORIGINAL: rightwinghippie The relevance is simple. In both cases we had an aim we wished (removal of missiles from Cuba in one case, removal of two citizens from the custody of North Korea on the other case). In both cases, diplomacy (I understand why you may have trouble with that word, the previous administration didn't know what it meant either) was employed to solve this problem. And the way diplomacy works is sometimes requires convenient interpretation of the facts. Do I think that Obama made a secret deal? No. Do I think he told Hillary to tell Bill to take a crack at it? Sure. And saying he was no way official kept him from having to make a deal or sacrifice anything. In short, since it worked, I think it was a good job.

Brain -> RE: Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/16/2009 12:08:10 AM)
If Obama is protecting George Bush and Dick Cheney does that mean the country is going in the wrong direction or the right direction? Pundits Trying to Help Cheney Avoid Jail OpEdNews Original Content at http://www.opednews.com/articles/Pundits-Trying-to-Help-Che-by-Ray-McGovern-090814-289.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- August 14, 2009 Pundits Trying to Help Cheney Avoid Jail By Ray McGovern The stenographers of the Fawning Corporate Media (FCM) are missing the most obvious explanation for former Vice President Dick Cheney's widely reported "disappointment" with former President George W. Bush on the issue of pardons - self-interest. Put yourself in Cheney's shoes, as uncomfortable as they might be. Daughter Liz has disclosed more than once what has her father so agitated - press reports that Attorney General Eric Holder is close to appointing a special prosecutor to investigate White House-authorized crimes, including torture - not policy differences, mind you, but capital crimes under U.S. as well as international law. Cheney's war crimes and other felonies? Not enough room to list them all here. But suffice it to say that Cheney's fingerprints - and those of his legal counsel David Addington - are all over the torture policies. Inspector General reports from the Department of Justice and from the CIA are scheduled to be released soon and are sure to reveal more Cheney fingerprints. Attorney General Holder reportedly found the CIA IG report nauseating with what are bound to be stomach-churning accounts of torture. …. As for violations of U.S. law, the list is long. Interestingly, two of the three Articles of Impeachment against Richard Nixon approved by the House Judiciary Committee on July 27, 29 and 30, 1974, were based, in part, on misusing the CIA. Such misuse was brought to a whole new level, as Cheney visited CIA Headquarters promoting "intelligence" on non-existent threats and took a leading role in misusing the agency to torture detainees. There's also the possibility that some of Cheney's co-conspirators will renounce their abuses, either out of genuine remorse for the hubris they showed at the height of their powers or in a bid to rehabilitate their careers. From his new job at Texas Tech in Lubbock, former Attorney General Alberto Gonzales earlier this week conceded that he erred in using the word "quaint" and "the Geneva Convention" in the same sentence in a memo he signed on its way to President Bush when Gonzales was White House counsel. It seems certain that prosecutor Fitzgerald asked Cheney to explain his handwritten note demanding that then-White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan falsely exonerate Libby in the Plame leak, like McClellan had already done for Bush's political adviser Karl Rove. Cheney wrote: "not going to protect one staffer and sacrifice the guy that was asked to stick his head in the meat grinder because of incompetence of others - " … In the closing arguments of the trial at which Libby was found guilty of perjury and obstruction of justice, Fitzgerald declared: "There is a cloud over the Vice President"and that cloud remains because this defendant obstructed justice." Implicating Bush Despite six months of resisting demands for a serious investigation of Bush-Cheney wrongdoing, Holder appears, finally, to be stepping to the plate with the intent of appointing a special prosecutor, albeit one whose authority may be tightly circumscribed. But Cheney doesn't want to risk the chance that a special prosecutor might insist on expanding the probe beyond the possible indictment of a few low-level operatives who exceeded the Bush administration's prescriptions on how much water to use in waterboarding a prisoner. So, Cheney appears to be pursuing a new strategy of pre-emption. His most obvious tactic is to tie his actions on torture tightly to Bush. On May 10 when Bob Schieffer asked Cheney how much Bush knew about the "enhanced interrogation techniques," the former Vice President stated clearly, if redundantly: "I certainly, yes, have every reason to believe he knew - he knew a great deal about the program. He basically authorized it. I mean, this was a presidential-level decision. And the decision went to the President. He signed off on it." Cheney seemed eager to answer the question. The idea, of course, would be to juice the jitters he already perceives at senior levels of the Obama administration, and to make it clear that no one will take Cheney down alone; i.e., without Bush right beside him. In Cheney's view, this image of a former President in the dock is sure to deter dithering lawyers and politicos at the top of the White House and Justice Department, who are more interested in sniffing the political winds than in enforcing the rule of law. My worst fear is that Cheney may be right.

Brain -> RE: Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/16/2009 12:32:58 AM)
I think it is probably better to read the whole article at the original website because it was hard for me to select parts of it and put them on this site. I wouldn't want to take anything out of context. http://www.opednews.com/articles/Pundits-Trying-to-Help-Che-by-Ray-McGovern-090814-289.html I guess all this criticism of Obama is having an affect on me as to my opinion of him.

OrionTheWolf -> RE: Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/16/2009 8:41:46 AM)
Personally I see no problem with diplomacy first, but..... It should always be known that if you are unreasonable or provocative towards the US, you get the other end without mercy. Diplomacy first, but once aggression is determined it should be swift and decisive.

MarsBonfire -> RE: Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/16/2009 10:48:29 AM)
Orion, I have to agree with you on this one. The ol' "Talk softly, but carry a big stick" is always the best way to make sure you have the most bargaining power. What most people seem to ignore is, KJI gave up these two journalists (which he could have milked for god knows how much anti-western propaganda) in exchange for a photo op with a man who no longer has any official power. Who REALLY came out ahead on this deal? If it was KJI's intent to gain any kind of leigitamacy from the photo op, he really failed. All the world saw was a tiny, thin, sickly looking dictator, standing next to an American ex-President who looked like a giant next to the guy. That's the trouble with NK... they have a hard time understanding the power of televised images, and how it changes perceptions in ways you might not expect. For the few seconds KJI got in front of the cameras with Clinton, we spent WEEKS of replaying the footage of the ladie's return to their families. In the end, all we remember, all the world remembers, is that they were held by an unjust, trumped up little Elvis impersonator of a dictator.

OrionTheWolf -> RE: Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/16/2009 2:35:44 PM)
Where I have a problem is that on the military side we try to ensure we have the very best to work with. Well we need to invest that kind of energy on the diplomacy side. Show that we are willing to compromise, not copitualte. Show that we are trully willing to work with, not just dictate. In all of this though, show that when all else fails that we will use what we must to ensure what we desire. Now all of this comes from someone that feels that we should not even be involved in many of the foreign relation issues that we are. Just the one's that have and may impact us directly. The others allow the UN to screw up, and withdraw some of our direct intervention, using those funds here at home.

Arpig -> RE: Is the country heading in the right direction? (8/16/2009 7:42:00 PM)
No it isn't....oh wait, you meant your country.....same answer.

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