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a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 2:34:40 AM

VanityFix

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as a alternative lifestyle forum i have seen a few gay/bi/trans people around,
i was talking to a couple of gay freinds and was on the topic of the word fag, it generally seemed that none of them cared about it and didnt care who used it as long as it wasnt with malicious intent, i personally find the idea of using the word a bit of a thinking process. hell when i came out as liking women as well as men i questioned if i could use it still..

i was curious among queer guys around collarme who uses this word to take power back from it? who you "allow" to use it? if its sacrilege to speak or whatever? the term faghag? is it bad manner to address a lesbien buddy as a dyke?
mostly on the subject of the whole F-bomb but im curious of any thoughts from a group retaking a hateword or views from anyone.

just to clarify my intent with this post is to get feedback on some thoughts not spred any hate for any group of people, i skimmed TOS and dont think this violates anything, my apologies if it does.

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 2:54:15 AM

LillyoftheVally

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A little on a tangent, I say 'fag' on a daily basis to mean ciggy, but got seriously shouted at once.

I find the term fag hag pretty harsh but then there is a negative connotation, and dyke the same - fag hag implying ugly and dyke (in this context) meaning a woman who is gay because she can't get a man (Interesting tidbit a dyke is also the name of a mound/hill etc built offa's dyke was a tool used to prevent the invasion of wales)

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 4:33:33 AM

DarkSteven

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I'm not using that word. Period. It seems to be getting fashionable for gays to use it now, but it would just be asking for grief.

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 4:50:22 AM

beargonewild

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As VanityFix mentioned, we are trying to change the negative connotations surrounding the word "fag" and make it a positive word in my community. In many ways we are trying the same process which the black people have done with he word "nigger." It is fine to use that term among themselves but heaven help anyone else using that same term. I willingly admit I do use the term "fag" myself though I do for the shock value to get a person to stop and think very carefully about what they want to say next. Otherwise I take a less in your face approach in an attempt to educate the less educated person.

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 6:20:27 AM

angelikaJ

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The only time I heard the term fag hag used was by gay men.

The term I hear used now by straight people is "She's a Grace."

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 6:34:21 AM

MistressWolfen

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Not a word/s I have heard used commonly in years, and then only within the LGBT community. ..will admit to a somewhat sheltered social life. I am all about reclamation, words have power.

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 7:42:21 AM

mixielicous

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fag? use it all the time. faggot? never! its derogatory, (nigga vs. nigger)

fag hag in the north east does not equal ugly. Here it denotes a woman middle aged or older, with primarily gay male friends. Similar to a spinster, not married.

"Shes a Grace" would be synonymous to "fruit fly" a young, heterosexually active woman who has many gay friends and is accepted within their local circle.

But hey, what does a breeder know? ;)

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 8:38:32 AM

LillyoftheVally

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mixielicous

fag hag in the north east does not equal ugly. Here it denotes a woman middle aged or older, with primarily gay male friends. Similar to a spinster, not married.

"Shes a Grace" would be synonymous to "fruit fly" a young, heterosexually active woman who has many gay friends and is accepted within their local circle.

Well even in those definitions I find both pretty offensive. I have been called a fag hag on many occasions and always in a derogatory way

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 8:42:34 AM

mixielicous

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I guess words are what you make of them. I guess I have been lucky to not encounter these terms in derogatory manners. Its just more labeling in the end though. We all know how tricky that can be.

Personally, I have never been called a fag hag, but a spinster, sadly, already yes. I wasnt offended but saddened that marriage at an early age has come back in such a major way, that at 25 I am one of the few "bachelorettes" I know.

end hijack.

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 9:06:12 AM

fluffypet61

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mixielicous
fag hag in the north east does not equal ugly. Here it denotes a woman middle aged or older, with primarily gay male friends. Similar to a spinster, not married.

The definition that was applied to me a few years ago in a different city was
Fag Hag - a straight woman who has a best friend who is gay and spends a lot of time together shopping and traveling. Often expecting to leave a alone after a dinner engagement or party, since he found someone else with whom to spend the rest of the evening. (i also served the purpose of gf in front of his mother and her friends.)

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 9:25:46 AM

pahunkboy

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fag hag- does not offend me.

I am not comfy around   "fag" "faggot", in general- the usual obscenities- I stray from.

Growing up- the f words used maliciously. So it becomes a way of challenging a male- to me a "man"....

As a gay guy tho- that does not mean I want to be treated like a female.

So the social rules that go for straight guys go for me as well.   With a male- when challenged this way it can only mean the user wants to take something away from me.   That is not acceptable.

I would have a very hard time in a jail or all male population. While I dont have to bravado- that some guys throw around- I do bite. Take something from me that I do not want taken and I will fight.

In a way it becomes a quagmire.

On the other hand- I can easily talk to woman as I am not eying only the breasts- I not trying to lay them.

I don't think we should discard the social niceties of traditional society.

..fighting words are... fighting words.

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 12:18:56 PM

beargonewild

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It's quite interesting as here north of the border a fag hag is usually a term of endearment to a straight female who the majority of her friends are gay men or she prefers to hang put with gay men without the fear of being hit upon, like one of the guys though only female.

Another discrepancy is caling someone a fag isn't much of an insult anymore, us gay men will normally hear "faggot" which carries more of a negative insult.

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 1:09:02 PM

DemonKia

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FR, after read thru

lol

Okay. I prefer bi men in the romantic way. (Prefer bi women, too, that way.) & I like gay men, a lot. Proudly consider myself a fag hag, tho' I'm careful where & under what context I express that . . . .. & my handy definition is that a 'fag hag' is she who likes to hang out with LGBT persons, perhaps even more than she likes to hang out with straight guys . .. ..

Been a beard, too . . .. *waggles eyebrows*

I kinda have a bit of a kink for 'taking back' language, reforming the derogatory terms into inoffensiveness . . . . . Dating back to when I learned to love the term 'bitch'; it is used epithetically at me when I'm not being a proper doormat, so I take pride in those moments, lol . . . .

Similarly, if 'fag hag' is used pejoratively, much of that punch comes from some association with the stigma of being LGBT, which I just don't buy into . . . . . I'm rather the other way, being a bit of a biphile & a homophile & a transphile, lol . . . .

< Message edited by DemonKia -- 8/19/2009 1:52:57 PM >

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 1:43:15 PM

peachgirl

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I've never used "fag" as anything other than a descriptive term...but I do make a distinction, with "faggot" being derogatory. I grew up in the L.A. area, maybe in this part of the country it's more common? because I've never heard any of my gay friends mention otherwise...

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 5:51:10 PM

Aneirin

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Fag to me, well, I use them every day, is a fag, a cigarette, but more commonly a rollie. A faggot, well we eat them here, get them down the chip shop as an alternative to pie or fish. Regional and nationality variations on meaning obviously comes into play here, but am aware the word is used in a derogative and descriptive way in the US from what US movies we see over here. I suppose descriptive words have to be used to define a person and their preferences, but, to me, fag, knowing what it is from this side of the pond, can only be used in a derogative fashion, as who wants to be likened to a cigarette, a disliked but addictive thing used then discarded, often stamped underfoot or thrown in the gutter.

All words hold power, it is up to us to understand that power and use it wisely.

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 6:14:02 PM

zenny

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Words only hold power over a person that allows it.

As to the topic at hand... Oh, great, another 'reserved word'. Anyone think a generation will come along that will realize the meaning of 'sticks and stone will break my bones but words will never hurt me'?

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 10:43:25 PM

lioncub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zenny

Words only hold power over a person that allows it.

As to the topic at hand... Oh, great, another 'reserved word'. Anyone think a generation will come along that will realize the meaning of 'sticks and stone will break my bones but words will never hurt me'?

I certainly hope a generation figures that out! It would mean they were all happy and sure of themselves with great self esteems. However, I don't ever see that happening. Sticks and stones, if used violently, will always hurt. I believe the same for words, but it is a difference of how much one let's them hurt. At least in my experience, I find it very difficult to keep words from hurting, even though I know they are only words.

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 10:46:53 PM

fadedshadow

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with our without the word, there's still going to be prejudice. sucks eh?

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 11:26:57 PM

LillyoftheVally

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zenny

Words only hold power over a person that allows it.

Though I agree with what you are saying, and I feel this about everything not just words, I also think that people have a certain amount of responsibility.

quote:

As to the topic at hand... Oh, great, another 'reserved word'. Anyone think a generation will come along that will realize the meaning of 'sticks and stone will break my bones but words will never hurt me'?

Does this mean that you believe that people should be allowed to use derogatory terms then? SImply because of a school ground rhyme? I mean do you wander around calling people a fag? or faggot? Or are you simply complaining because sometimes people just enjoy that more than anything?

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RE: a queer question: the F word - 8/19/2009 11:35:49 PM

BKSir

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Personally I don't care for any of the terms, but I don't "hate" them. They're simply words. It's the intent behind them that matters. What if, instead of saying "faggot", the word was replaced by "apple"? After a while, it would be considered a derogatory term also, even though, it's just an apple. It's a lot like people that say things like "Oh my heck!" or "Fetch!", because they don't want to swear (normally because it's a no no in their religious viewpoints). Well guess what. I know what you mean, the feelings and thoughts behind the words are the same. And if I know what you mean, god sure as hell does.

As far as taking back the term as our own, I don't really agree with that theory either. Again, they're just words. A collection of letters that have power and meaning because we give it to them.

But, that may just be me... *sets two pennies on the counter*

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