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A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 12:36:24 PM   
slavejali


Posts: 2918
Status: offline 		I just thought of this topic because of the making a promise thread:

You hear a lot that a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress. ..but what does that mean? Does that mean that they should be on their best behaviour because people will judge their Master/Mistress by the submissives/slaves actions..or does it go deeper than that?

I'm pretty much under the impression that the submissives/slaves ability to actually become all that they can be as a submissive/slave is actually a reflection on the Master/Mistress's abilities as a Dominant/Master/Mistress.

I believe, a submissive/slave has innate qualities that perhaps arent really visible when operating in every day life, for example: If they didnt have a Master or Mistress, they would be totally capable of taking control of their own lives and dictating how and where their life is heading. "They arent submissive to everyone or everything".

Do you think a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress's abilities to Dominate?

If a slave/submissive isnt living up to their potential of a submissive/slave, is this a reflection on their Master/Mistress?

If this is true, what does it take to really Dominate a submissive/slave and really bring out those beautiful qualities of submissive nature?

I'd love to hear examples with the responses, I get a better picture of what you;re saying from examples..but if you dont have examples, thats ok too.

I will be interested in the responses. Thanks in advance.




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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 12:43:11 PM   
angelic


Posts: 1807
Joined: 1/24/2005
Status: offline 		imo, slavejali it comes back to... if One cannot Master Himself... He will not be able to Master me (i tend to be a handful) not because i want to be a brat... i just am very much aware of who i am.. inside... and i will not settle ever again.

_____________________________

~....and once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return.~ -- Leonardo de Vinci


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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 12:44:33 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali
Do you think a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress's abilities to Dominate?

Somewhat. But I don't think there is a clear and necessary link. We're all reflections and ambassadors of the people we choose to associate with in our lives. This is no less true in vanilla or bdsm.

quote:


If a slave/submissive isnt living up to their potential of a submissive/slave, is this a reflection on their Master/Mistress?

Not necessarily.
quote:


If this is true, what does it take to really Dominate a submissive/slave and really bring out those beautiful qualities of submissive nature?

Consent.

There's a big debate over the "inspirational" aspect. A lot of subs complain that their doms suck if they don't INSPIRE them to submit, or basically "make me want to do what I said I would do."

And that's a bit of a cop out. A dominant isn't bad in training just because they don't bend over to inspire you.

That being said, there is something to the idea of working together to make things happen. A subs feelings and motivations ARE a reflection on the relationship and dynamics...but so are the doms.

IMO, Ds isn't different than vanilla in this regard. We all feed into eachother, we are all accountable for our own commitments and we choose to get into relationships in order to be happier all together. Who we are IS reflected in who we choose to associate with, but we cannot surrender personal responsibility just because we are owned.

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 1:09:29 PM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
quote:

Do you think a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress's abilities to Dominate?


in the context of their own relationship, perhaps, but not in comparison to another D/s or M/s relationship as they, and the folks who are involved in them, are unique and continual works of art in progress!!!

quote:

If a slave/submissive isnt living up to their potential of a submissive/slave, is this a reflection on their Master/Mistress?


not everyone's "potential" as a submissive or slave is the same--and that "potential" might be as shifting as the sands over time...some submissives have no specific Master/Mistress and live up to their potentials as the submissively oriented human beings that they are in their own right. some serve their communities, their entire families, a specific cause, etc.

quote:

If this is true, what does it take to really Dominate a submissive/slave and really bring out those beautiful qualities of submissive nature?


not everyone's beautiful qualities of submissive nature hinge on another's ability(or lack thereof) to "bring it out". some just are, and it's still a beautiful thing. the 5 minutes you happen to feel it when your Dom teases it out of you might be the ultimate of your submissive potential. nothing wrong with that. just like there is nothing wrong with the feel of the constant 24/7 undercurrent of submission that some feel, from no-one in particular,patiently waiting and actively looking for the chance to express it as they travel down their own path.

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 1:40:18 PM   
amayos


Posts: 1553
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: New England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali

I just thought of this topic because of the making a promise thread:

You hear a lot that a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress. ..but what does that mean? Does that mean that they should be on their best behaviour because people will judge their Master/Mistress by the submissives/slaves actions..or does it go deeper than that?


Goodness, it's funny you bring this up, as I was just inspired recently by a rather disenchanting discourse on this board to think about this very question.

I believe slaves/submissives are indeed reflections of their Doms/Dommes/Masters/Mistresses; I can't help but praise a dominant for his/her creature's grace and clarity, as well as sense of respect and refinement. Just as this may be the case, I likewise do wonder about the obviously rude and crass ones who identify as owned submissives/slaves. Their spiteful generalities, their disbelief in anything past their nose and their unbecoming behavior most certainly can be a reflection upon their Master/Mistress, in addition to themselves.



quote:

Do you think a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress's abilities to Dominate?


Yes and no. It entirely depends on the seriousness of their roles, from both ends. This lends to a lot of debate based of relativity.


quote:

If this is true, what does it take to really Dominate a submissive/slave and really bring out those beautiful qualities of submissive nature?


As I've stated previously in other threads, I feel it is the ability to capture the heart and mind.


< Message edited by amayos -- 2/24/2006 1:41:46 PM >

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 1:45:50 PM   
phoenix1


Posts: 107
Joined: 1/7/2006
Status: offline 		"I believe, a submissive/slave has innate qualities that perhaps arent really visible when operating in every day life, for example: If they didnt have a Master or Mistress, they would be totally capable of taking control of their own lives and dictating how and where their life is heading."

This one may have those innate qualities but she definitely does need her Master for the very things you have stated. This one guesses that if she had no choice, she would probably survive, but she'd probably end up in shit creek.

"Do you think a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress's abilities to Dominate? " Yes.

"If a slave/submissive isnt living up to their potential of a submissive/slave, is this a reflection on their Master/Mistress?" Yes.

< Message edited by phoenix1 -- 2/24/2006 1:46:30 PM >

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 2:47:21 PM   
MHOO314


Posts: 3628
Joined: 9/26/2004
Status: offline 		First of all slavejali, I really like your posts, so thought filled and what a great sense if humor, you are so gracious when I have a hard time being serious-- kudos lady


quote:

Do you think a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress's abilities to Dominate?


No---To Me domination is subjective, One's idea of dominant does not always meet the standards of another--and after all a Dominant without a submissive is just a person looking---I believe it happens in the dynamic so its between the two not up to the judgement of others. (At the risk of getting flamed...) I seem to see that mentality more in the "Old school" Doms who live the Story of O fantasy.

quote:

If a slave/submissive isnt living up to their potential of a submissive/slave, is this a reflection on their Master/Mistress?


No--To Me that dynamic isn't working, after all just because one is submissive does not mean that submission works for Me--I think the boy would tell you that there is no question the Mistress is in charge, the leather strap and the simple assumptions just say, I am and it is----yet one sub I interviewed who pleaded to be owned could not even remember to call Me every day----that didn't mean I was not Dominant or I couldn't control him--it just didn't work between us. But I do think there are times that We as Dom/mes may not be growing our submissives as well as we can.


quote:

If this is true, what does it take to really Dominate a submissive/slave and really bring out those beautiful qualities of submissive nature?


Now as for bringing out qualities--because of the work I do, I became a "Mistress" of physical cues and verbal cues---I used it when I raised My child, the mouth says one thing, but the body and voice tone says another--I approach his development the same way---we had lots of chat and phone time before I was able to put the physical with the verbal--but as we talked about all kinds of things, I listened--for the sounds, the breath, the intonations--and learned what areas inspired him, what areas he was weak in and where he wanted to go--when we met, the physical matched the verbal to a T--as I touched those "areas" he opened up more and more--and of course I am a sponge of learning about him---

I need to watch and listen, I need to anticipate when I can---he will be moving to be with Me--after many years and many friends--to a place where he knows no one, I need to watch him, listen, know him, anticipate what will be hard for him--

and the biggest thing is to honor what he asked--not to isolate him from friends and family--

So will I hit it all the time? No, but will I work at doing the best I can---damn straight!


I'd love to hear examples with the responses, I get a better picture of what you;re saying from examples..but if you dont have examples, thats ok too.



< Message edited by MHOO314 -- 2/24/2006 2:51:12 PM >

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 2:54:14 PM   
slavejali


Posts: 2918
Status: offline 		I'm really enjoying these posts, and thanks for the compliment Mistress Hathor, i really do love these forums, i think they are a great service and a ton of fun.

I have a very busy day, but will keep checking this forum ( i have about a gazillion massages to do...oh my aching arms *grin*)..so please dont feel offended if I dont respond, or not in detail for awhile~

i hope the topic gives everyone as much interest as it will me.

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 3:09:44 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline 		This is how i am a reflection of my Master:

i live my life - all aspect of my life - with a desire to please him and make him proud. i have learned lessons he has taught me, about every day living, about self analyzation, about submission, about work ethic, familty ethic, social ethic....etc. He developed my ways of thinking, and he has pushed me incredibly hard, thus allowing me to find my own strength.

As such, the way i conduct myself (or the way anyone conducts him/herself) is a reflection of who i am. And "who i am" is his slave first and foremost. He is my center. and my life is enhanced as a result.

People who knew me two years ago look at me now and see a changed person. How many times in the last year have i heard how "healthy" my attitude has become, and how stable i now seem, and how peaceful i appear. i had dinner last weekend with a longtime friend whom i had not seen in almost a year. She looked at me and exclaimed, "Oh my God - you look ravishing!!!"

To me, this is a reflection of my Master. my attitude, demeanor, happiness, peace...the way i carry myself, the opinions and philophies i have - are all a reflection of his teachings. So, when you ask about people being a reflection of their Dominants, that is what i think of . Everyone is a unique individual with their own personalities and their own spirits. But people ARE in part a reflection of their environments - be it their upbringing, their schooling, their careers, the people they know, etc.

As for the "inspiration" question, Anyone can be inspired by anyone. i have had great bosses in my career, who have inspired and motivated me to work harder, to learn, to go above and beyond. Just as i have had crappy bosses who have "inspired me" to not give a damn. We all become inspired and motivated by various things.

my Master inspires me. i adore him, and want more than anything to please him. That need to please him inspires me to submit further. Knowing what he wants in a slave, and my deep desire to provide it, is my inspiration to delve deeper and to work my ass off for him. It is his way with me which inspires me to want to give more and more.

He knows me and knows how to bring out my best. He has spent his work with me focusing on my positives and my successes, and incrementally increasing his requirements which have grown my submission. However, just because he is the perfect Master for me does not mean he is the ideal Master for everyone. He did some work with a friend of mine who chose to hear only what she wanted to hear, who reacted, who refused to obey. He finally grew impatient enough to decide she was not worth his trouble, and off she went. i viewed that failure not as a reflection of his ability to dominate, but of her inability to live up to what she claimed to be. It takes two people to dominate someone successfully. One must have the dominating skills; the other must wish to be dominated.


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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 3:58:23 PM   
Submotive


Posts: 440
Joined: 9/9/2005
Status: offline
quote:

You hear a lot that a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress. ..but what does that mean? Does that mean that they should be on their best behaviour because people will judge their Master/Mistress by the submissives/slaves actions..or does it go deeper than that?


i like to be on my best behavior because it's a reflection of me first, then perhaps my Master.
quote:

Do you think a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress's


Of course, but once again, i think it's mostly a reflection on the sub. A sub can be trained and grow but only if that's her/his desire. From my perspective a Master/Mistress/sub/slave relationship is only as good as B/both individuals, not just one.

For me the concept is not only how my Master helps me grow, but am i helping Him grow as well? This is a dynamic that i value deeply. So to think that a sub is a reflection of her Master/Mistress is in essence also saying the Master/Mistress is a reflection of the sub.
When i think of it that way it takes away the "mystic" of the Master/Mistress personna and makes me accept that W/we are all just human beings, hopefully seeking to bring to O/one A/another, rather than seek to take.




_____________________________

Owned by Scotch Master

i would rather continue alone than be permitted to show only parts of myself to my Beloved.

If you're not living as you would like to today, when are you going to start?

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 4:16:26 PM   
bear372217355


Posts: 94
Joined: 11/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:


Do you think a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress's abilities to Dominate?


Yes, to some extent a sub/slaves actions in view of others in the lifestyle, at say an event, directly reflect their Dominant.

quote:


If a slave/submissive isnt living up to their potential of a submissive/slave, is this a reflection on their Master/Mistress?


To some degree, yes.

quote:


If this is true, what does it take to really Dominate a submissive/slave and really bring out those beautiful qualities of submissive nature?


An experienced Dominant, that knows how to do just that. A true dominant will learn what to do to get the most out of thier slave/sub. Treats, punishments, both usefull tools in the skillful art of training. IMHO, the best dominants are those that get in to the heads of their sub/slave and finds out what makes them tick.

quote:


I'd love to hear examples with the responses, I get a better picture of what you;re saying from examples..but if you dont have examples, thats ok too.


At home mi'Lady is like suzy homemaker, cooking, cleaning, etc. When little eyes are asleep, and mi'Lady puts my collar on me, it's a whole different story. At events, I wait on her hand and foot. I show her the resect she deserves, by following her rules or just being well behaved.

I act totally different when collared. All women are addressed as "ma'am", eye contact with women, other then those I'm allowed to make eye contact with, is forbidden, doing something for mi'Lady before she has to ask, or just generally being a complete gentleman to everyone in the room.

For that I get treats, I prefer treats to punishment, but I do sometimes do things when no one is looking, that will get me punished. Just never when anyone, but mi'Lady can see me. I would never do anything that would give anyone the impression that mi'Lady had anything, but the perfect slave.

_____________________________

Collared, caged and the sole property of Lady Elizabeth.

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 4:22:59 PM   
KnightofMists


Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali

You hear a lot that a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress. ..but what does that mean? Does that mean that they should be on their best behaviour because people will judge their Master/Mistress by the submissives/slaves actions..or does it go deeper than that?


We are a reflection of each other, we are a reflection of our relationship. It is meaningless except in the context of OUR relationship! and not anyone elses. I only care of others judgement that are significant to me and that is a very very small number. My girls do not behave for others judgement or to build any artifical reputation! They behave in the manner that is apart of who they are as well as in the manners that bring me pleasure! They behave in a manner that brings US happiness!

quote:


I'm pretty much under the impression that the submissives/slaves ability to actually become all that they can be as a submissive/slave is actually a reflection on the Master/Mistress's abilities as a Dominant/Master/Mistress.


I disagree. I believe it is only a reflection of the connection between the individuals and their compatiability! There is much of kyra and alandra that have absolutely nothing to do with my skills or abilities... they had the behaviors and characteristics long before I came along and will still have them if I am gone. However, we each leave impressions upon the other.. it is these impressions that are the reflections... but few could tell you what is the impressions and which was already there before! Those in the relationship know, and that is all that matters!


quote:


I believe, a submissive/slave has innate qualities that perhaps arent really visible when operating in every day life, for example: If they didnt have a Master or Mistress, they would be totally capable of taking control of their own lives and dictating how and where their life is heading. "They arent submissive to everyone or everything".


innate qualities... or just simples skills and abilities. Some of us are better and caring for ourself than others, Regardless of Dominant/submissive orientation. I consider the submissive person that has the skills and abilites to care for them self wilthout me to be a prize of great value. I do not want to rescue anyone! I want to enhance there lives with my own, as I expect they to enhance my own with theirs!


quote:

Do you think a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress's abilities to Dominate?


No and Yes. but we on the outside will have a very difficult time determining what is a reflection of the Dominant and what is not.

quote:

If a slave/submissive isnt living up to their potential of a submissive/slave, is this a reflection on their Master/Mistress?



No and yes.

quote:


If this is true, what does it take to really Dominate a submissive/slave and really bring out those beautiful qualities of submissive nature?


a subjective answer that will be different with everyone, we are each unique beings that require individual efforts to enhance the qualities that are within. No recipe will work for everyone or even a majority.



< Message edited by KnightofMists -- 2/24/2006 4:23:44 PM >

_____________________________

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An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 4:23:05 PM   
HouseofBear


Posts: 1280
Joined: 2/9/2005
Status: offline 		Quite honestly, and this may sound like blasphemy, both the dominant's and submissive's behavior reflect on the other. This is true of most relationships, whether they are lifestyle or not. How many times have you heard the comment "how can he/she be so stupid as to remain married to that jerk?" From my experience in the lifestyle, both dominants and submissives love it when someone makes a complimentary remark about their partner. Also, when one of a partnership does something dishonorable, it has a tendency to make others question the honorableness of the other party involved.

Lady Ursa

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 4:35:15 PM   
DragonNphoenix


Posts: 617
Joined: 8/2/2005
Status: offline 		Yes.. I believe that I am a reflection of my Dragons training. I know that my behavior and attitude can be a direct reflection upon my Dragon. I would not ever want to be a disapointment to him.

What it took to bring this about it me was him willingness to give me the time to come around and the heart/love to guide me gently when I lost track of where I was going. I was in a very abusive relationship and my Dragon wanted to make sure that I trusted him competely before starting any serious training with me.

I think that if one isn't living up to their potential it reflects upon both of them. I believe that the submissive/slave has to want to be the best that they can be first.

But, hey.. this is just what I think.

1st Girl Phoenix



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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 6:18:05 PM   
OscarHargraves


Posts: 693
Joined: 8/9/2005
Status: offline 		[color=#330099]My sub is very much capable of taking care of herself. She is quite independant when we are not together. What reflects on me is how she behaves when she is with me. That is, how I percieve her and how others percieve us together.

Just like a wife or your children, your Sub is a reflection of your personality and your training, at least to some extent. In a 24/7 relationship this is even more true. How you behave in the company of others reflects on who your Master is and how your Master has trained you.

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 7:05:19 PM   
jamesthehumanrug


Posts: 668
Joined: 10/21/2005
Status: offline 		greetings slavej
i find some kids show a clear PUBLIC-reflection on the home;environment and the parents,or care takers (SIGNIFIGANT OTHERS),so how is it different with tops and bottoms
EVEN PETS
STUPID PET;STUPID OWNER....
and some tops and bottoms have to be picky ,cause ,if a top ruined my image or didnt fill my potential
i'm miserable,and gone;
in other words
dont you dare degrade me or shame my actual postion, or real potential or talent or you dont know me, therefore ,you dont like,or respect me and, im not yours ;YOU ARE NOT GONNA ENJOY BEING free,to hold me from my real goddess ;who knows we are one.
i respect therefore, i love.
its pretty pure and ,simple
i know lifes too short;love the one youre with but ,YOU CAN ONLY BE SO GOOD A SLAVE,OR LOVER SOMETIMES;you may, not be able to go all the way,so don't ground someone, for ,not being able, to go all the way ,with you, as a slave, or visa versa...,
when someone's ,not ,into you ;like a top,in my case ,and ,they say "knock yourself, out "
IT'S,NOT A GOOD SIGN
;it means make yourself happy ;i cant,or dont want,to;and,you look rediculous...
,so you don't throw a fit ;
you ,just make yourself happy ,and allow them the freedom ,to do the same,
or ,FOR CRYING OUT LOUD; find someone who wont disrespect you that way,UNLESS YOU LIKE THAT KIND ,OF DELIVERY;....
i hate to ,not act like my true self ,as a HUGE-slave, in relation, to my HUGE-goddess;
AS FAR,AS the-ESTEEMED GOES....
whats the g.d problem;is all you end up saying ,when you are, with someone who dont love ,or respect you ;OR YOUR IMAGE, AND ,TITLE
....it IS an embarrassment !you embarrass each other...
LIKE ME HANGING, AROUND
WAITING, FOR A NITE OUT ,WITH A FLAT-BACK; DO-ME SLAVE;#2. FEMALE BOTTOM;
YA KILL MY EVENING;I'M ,INTO IT;or ,INTO YOU ,too....
YES, FOR SURE; A SLAVE,OR A TOP ,OR BOTTOM IS a reflection ,of ,BOTH THE top and,THEIR bottom....
YA; I SERVE ,AND ,I'M A SLAVE ,TO ALL TOPS ,FOR MY TOP, NOT ,FOR SOMEONE WHO WANTS ME,TO STAND UP ;BE A MAN B.S ;
WHAT KINDA 'TOP IS ,THAT?;NOT ANYONE I NEED,TO PAY ATTENTION,TO....
geez;
i can kill,in self-defense, on the spot, by a single word command ,from my misstress ,but, quit denying my public,or anyone knows,as a real-slave;i certainly don't have ,to prove my tuff,or dark side;with a loser like ,that calling me something else, and making off like my top ;my sentiment would be
,just..."get away ,from me kid;you embarrass me" ,wc fields.the top is top,in public ,or functioning ,with me and, im bottom,to the top,in ,and out;no flex....unless its always ,understood;bad behaviors show.i always know who i'm,with....
FUNNY;WHEN SOMEONE SAYS -OH; IT'S ,ALWAYS THE MOM, that gets the blame,for the kids behavior;
is it logical,to conclude ;well;NO- you're rite; this KID CAME, FROM THE CLEAR BLUE SKY?....

< Message edited by jamesthehumanrug -- 2/24/2006 7:44:53 PM >

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I REMAIN RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED
,LOVEles,
jamesthehumanrug

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RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 10:43:03 PM   
Driver1961


Posts: 459
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		Good one slavejali!

This is as Knight of Mists and numerous others have stated is so subjective and relevant to the expectations of each relationship, whether nilla, or Lifestyle related. Any response of No/Yes or detail is based on this experience of an individual with regards to the level of communication enjoyed within the relationship. I find it too personal to provide sufficient detail of my reasoning for my responses to you without 'compromising' part of my ongoing intimacy/growth with my subs. Simply not kosher,,,, yet this detail is as important for your effective evaluation of your 'OP' otherwise it is nothing short of a detailed 'poll'.


(This point is so relevant to effectively evaluate many of the 'searching' threads in here and is why many are flamed or perceive to be flamed here)

Essentially, (if I may somewhat refute my own point by putting forward my view) the communication between D/M and s/slave is interpretative to E/each person's expectations and compromises to the other from the beginning of the relationship and ongoing where appopriate or allowed.

What one sub may consider is a broken promise, is "not" to another based on this prior communication. (Hence the various conflicting comments of promise expectations on the other thread).
Yes a Dominant must exhibit strength which includes (in my book) reliability in actioning their word- otherwise without this you (as sub) are stupidly jumping the parapets only to find your leader has deserted you to lead yourself without warning.... Like, how childish that a Dominant only has to adhere to their word if only they said the words'I promise to do this...??!!!' Like Hello, I had my fingers crossed when I promised!!! Ridiculous. You either have and action strength of your word or you dont. Consistantly HONEST or liable to DECEIT?

The inherent nature of submissiveness is to rely consistantly upon their Dominant; thus the Dominant relies upon their submissiveness. The ying/yang of the relationship. This provides for the growth to attainment of the 'bliss' for the participants, without it hurt, stagnation, and of course abuse. Same applys in a first scene to first time players with each other.

Yes my subs do understand my expectations, yes their behaviour is a constant reflection upon my expectations. Yes I provide strength of leadership. Yes their CONSISTANT lack of appropriate behaviour may be inherent and contrary to my expectations. (last resort- Removal of my collar) after I have evaluated further strategies, sometimes with compromises. But all this is done with communication to provide fluidity for future growth within O/our relationship or within themselves.


Thanks again for another stimulating post.

Warm regards to all, Paul. Sir to Angel and Wild.

_____________________________

Dance as though nobody is watching!

(in reply to jamesthehumanrug)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/24/2006 10:47:16 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		LOLOLOLOL,

Assuming a certain bent..........Just hell no.
Sorry I cannot be more eloquent on the subject, I have no impetus to wax poetic on this subject.

But slavejali, I do appreciate your thoughts.

Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Driver1961)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/25/2006 1:31:07 AM   
RavenMuse


Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline
quote:

Do you think a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress's abilities to Dominate?


Yes and no. If they have been together for quite some time and the girl is a compleat doormat as a result then I would take more convincing that their Master was the sort of person that I could respect.

In most of her general attitude, no reflection at all. To anyone but her master she has no reason to submit or act in any way other than her normal nature. Maybe her master doesn't care how she acts in the place I see her, or maybe he considers actions to be acceptable that I would not. That maybe a diffrence of opinion but isn't something I consider a reflection of the Masters ability.

If I see a girl who is self-confident and happy then I consider that whatever other diffrences I may have with her master, he is obviously getting somethings very right!


_____________________________

This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

Owner of metalmiss

(in reply to slavejali)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: A Reflection on your Dominant - 2/25/2006 3:26:13 AM   
Wildfleurs


Posts: 1650
Joined: 9/24/2004
From: Connecticut
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali

You hear a lot that a submissive/slave is a reflection on their Master/Mistress. ..but what does that mean? Does that mean that they should be on their best behaviour because people will judge their Master/Mistress by the submissives/slaves actions..or does it go deeper than that?


I think that we are most strongly a reflection and a reaction to our parents/caregivers, I mean they are the ones that really reared us during the most formative parts of our life and I think can have the most impact on us.

Edited to add: For instance my personality, my self-esteem (whifch is pretty healthy), schooling, basics of learning how to keep a house (cleaning and cooking), and manners were all taught by my parents when I was a child.

After that, I would say whoever we hold dearest are also reflections of us. Reflections on what we value and are attracted to. So I think who a dominant chooses as a submissive is as much a reflection on what s/he value as a dominant as who a submissive chooses as a dominant is a reflection on what the submissive values.

quote:


I'm pretty much under the impression that the submissives/slaves ability to actually become all that they can be as a submissive/slave is actually a reflection on the Master/Mistress's abilities as a Dominant/Master/Mistress.


I think it’s a reflection on both people and what they value. And I don’t think there is a requirement that the dominant bring the submissive on a path of self-evolution to the point that the submissive is fully actualized. I’ll be honest I’m not even sure what living to ones full potential means – do you mean in terms of services provided? Self-actualization? Control matching fully what the submissive needs/wants?

C~

< Message edited by Wildfleurs -- 2/25/2006 3:28:11 AM >

_____________________________

"Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid." -despair.com

~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
The heart of it all - http://www.wildfleurs.com
~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

(in reply to slavejali)
Profile   Post #: 20
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