RE: Gwen

RE: Gwen (Full Version)

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[Poll]

Gwen

It's wrong, it's a form of indoctrination.

3% (1)

It's wrong, making money off the homeless.

9% (3)

It's a good idea, it teaches children morals.

18% (6)

It's harmless, it's just a toy.

3% (1)

Mattel should donate all money made to the homeless.

40% (13)

Who gives a shit?

25% (8)

Total Votes : 32

(last vote on : 9/27/2009 8:14:50 PM)
(Poll will run till: -- )

Message

lronitulstahp -> RE: Gwen (9/26/2009 12:18:34 PM)
my daughter has read the AG books. She also has two of the AG magnetic paper doll sets, which i purchased at a bookstore. i think the stories help introduce children to the idea of life in other times and places, and that is what it's really all about. my weeun did a presentation as "Addy Walker" for her school. She told about historical facts, and used Addy's story as a backdrop. The book helped her understand how life for a girl like her might've been during those times. i agree that the dolls are rather high priced, but i would rather spend that money on something that helps her use her imagination and learn about the world outside of her present day reality, than on the electronic gadgets that i see swallowing up kids and turning many of them into anti-social misfits every day.

Level -> RE: Gwen (9/26/2009 12:39:01 PM)
Hi Aylee; it's "cankles", and I was just being silly.

BKSir -> RE: Gwen (9/26/2009 12:44:15 PM)
Now, for me... by the way, Stephen, I hate you for making me laugh so hard at something I know I shouldn't have laughed at in this thread... ;) But, anyway, for me, I'm thinking they're marketing this all wrong. What kid want's a "Gwen the Homeless Girl" doll? No. Dumb move. However, at $95 a pop, market it to adults as a limited edition collectors piece, AND give the proceeds to local women's shelters or something along those lines. Sales would probably be huge then.

hizgeorgiapeach -> RE: Gwen (9/26/2009 12:49:33 PM)
mutters I'd still just go straight to the shelter and donate the money, rather than buy the doll - which, even if it were a collector's piece, would not go up in value until it were at least 4 decades old. I don't keep Anything around that long unless it's already considerably valuable when I aquire it - and even then it'll get sold to get the space it's taking up back if I don't personally gain a lot of pleasure out of having it around. And I mean pleasure on more than the "oh, I own this limited edition that other people want" sort of horseshit. I mean something along the lines of *I think it's beautiful to look at, and therefore take a great deal of pleasure in viewing it! If I don't gain direct Non-EgoStroking/ Oneupsman type pleasure from some physical item in my home - then it's nothing more than a dust collector to increase the amount of time I have to spend on Housework rather than on things I Want to do. (But I'll admit I'm probably in the minority in feeling this way.)

sirsholly -> RE: Gwen (9/26/2009 12:56:40 PM)
quote: "oh, I own this limited edition that other people want" translation: i iz a dumbass.

porcelaine -> RE: Gwen (9/26/2009 12:58:30 PM)
dolls are a form of entertainment for children. as for the values they will embrace, that is generally dictated by what they see and are taught. there's no reason why a child can't have a barbie doll and still grow up to be a well adjusted woman that celebrates her femininity and is able to tackle the world and play with the boys when necessary. we keep going to different extremes and if the feminists had it right there would be more of them in positions of authority but there aren't. in the end the child is going to keep or shed the things they feel are true for them. as for cost, for some it seems ridiculous to put that towards a toy. but the same people will spend money on starbucks, game systems, cigarettes, vehicles, and what have you. it is all a matter of priorities. what amazes me most is these same people often are the first to balk about dropping large sums of money on education, particularly in the elementary and high school years. college is another animal and that's another thread. the doll is in line with the backgrounds they portray for the american girl line. for what some spend on an xbox, i could have a wonderful porcelain doll who's value increases and isn't prone to combust from overheating. one decision isn't any better than the other. it is merely yours. porcelaine

purepleasure -> RE: Gwen (9/26/2009 1:58:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thishereboi quote: ORIGINAL: sirsholly quote: ORIGINAL: thishereboi fr I have bought a lot of dolls for kids in the past, but I can't say I ever did it to teach them a "social lesson". I did it to give them something to play with, that made them happy. What's wrong with letting kids be kids, they will have plenty of time to be depressed over social issues when they get older. Because quite a few of the dolls the kids are playing with, that make them happy, are of the Barbie type which is perpetuating an ideal that is not achievable by a normal healthy child and leads to a negative self image. Eating disorders units are full of these kids. Not sure what barbie has to do with a homeless doll, but I don't buy barbies, so maybe I missed something. Although if you scare a kid into thinking he might become homeless and daddy might leave, I guess that could effect his appetite. What's wrong with just letting them be kids? Do you honestly think a 4 year old needs to know about the homeless? Too many 4 year olds KNOW what it is to be homeless. Women's shelters are not homes, which is where many fatherless families end up.

calamitysandra -> RE: Gwen (9/26/2009 2:32:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thishereboi Do you honestly think a 4 year old needs to know about the homeless? Yes

porcelaine -> RE: Gwen (9/26/2009 2:41:31 PM)
while i am a strong believer in noblesse oblige. i don't feel it is my right to dictate where a corporation's contributions should go, nor how much should be allocated for charitable giving. if mattel elects to do this for sincere purposes or as a marketing ploy that is their decision. it would not change my opinion about the entity at all. it should also be remembered that individuals and companies make charitable contributions all the time and elect to remain anonymous to avoid the scrutiny that usually follows. if a portion was donated as suggested, one might still have adverse reactions and the suggestion that they created the doll to make money at the expense of the homeless. as with most things you can't please everyone. i would hope in this situation they wouldn't attempt to do so. porcelaine

thishereboi -> RE: Gwen (9/26/2009 6:48:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: purepleasure quote: ORIGINAL: thishereboi quote: ORIGINAL: sirsholly quote: ORIGINAL: thishereboi fr I have bought a lot of dolls for kids in the past, but I can't say I ever did it to teach them a "social lesson". I did it to give them something to play with, that made them happy. What's wrong with letting kids be kids, they will have plenty of time to be depressed over social issues when they get older. Because quite a few of the dolls the kids are playing with, that make them happy, are of the Barbie type which is perpetuating an ideal that is not achievable by a normal healthy child and leads to a negative self image. Eating disorders units are full of these kids. Not sure what barbie has to do with a homeless doll, but I don't buy barbies, so maybe I missed something. Although if you scare a kid into thinking he might become homeless and daddy might leave, I guess that could effect his appetite. What's wrong with just letting them be kids? Do you honestly think a 4 year old needs to know about the homeless? Too many 4 year olds KNOW what it is to be homeless. Women's shelters are not homes, which is where many fatherless families end up. Then take that $95 bucks down to the local homeless shelter, I am pretty sure they can come up with better ways of spending it, than on a doll that will teach them what they already know. When the 4 yr old gets older, you can even take him along and teach him a thing or two along the way.

purepleasure -> RE: Gwen (9/27/2009 6:01:34 AM)
nm

DesFIP -> RE: Gwen (9/27/2009 6:09:30 AM)
American Girl dolls are designed for those old enough to read the books. Age 8 and up. And honestly, an 8 year old in a public school will happen to know someone who is being raised by others than their parents. They probably do know someone who is living in their car, they just don't know it. We had a lot of the books, but I never bought her a doll. Maybe if she ever settled on which one, I might have. Probably not though.

LaTigresse -> RE: Gwen (9/27/2009 6:19:42 AM)
Personally I don't give a shit what toy manufacturers do. They can make a stripper Barbie, whore Barbie, pimp Ken, Madame Barbie, whatever the fuck they want. We are ignoring one VERY important aspect of this issue. PARENTS Parents are the people that are responsible for teaching their children morals and values, not some hunk of plastic. As far as teaching a 4 yo, 14 yo.........exactly WHAT IS the appropriate age to teach a child that not all children have what they have? Personally, until there is an age limit on children's suffering, there shouldn't be an age limit on teaching children that other children suffer. My kids spent their early years, often living below the national poverty level. For several years I was raising them in an $80 a month apartment that made lots of creepy night time noises, had feral cats living in one of the other apartments (we were the only people living in a 6 unit building, above an old drug store, in an old brick building in small town Iowa. It was across the street from a bar, where the occasional drunk wandered up the stairs of our building and had to be told to get lost). Yet, they did not suffer the fate of many. Not knowing where they were going to get the next meal or have a warm bed to sleep in. And yes, they were well aware that there were people much worse off than we. They were not disturbed by such knowledge, they donated toys, they realized that there were children mistreated, unloved, and hungry. My kids didn't grow up damaged by such knowledge. They grew up learning compassion. It's bullshit to protect children from reality. There are ways to make them understand without "damaging" them.

calamitysandra -> RE: Gwen (9/27/2009 1:19:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LaTigresse It's bullshit to protect children from reality. There are ways to make them understand without "damaging" them. So very well said. Most times I think we are trying to protect ourself in some obscure way.

Arpig -> RE: Gwen (9/27/2009 7:50:56 PM)
I taught my kids about the homeless problem by letting them talk to homeless people when they came up to us on the street, and by teaching my kids to give spare change when it really was spare. Maybe not the best way, but the two of the three I taught that way are compassionate towards the homeless. They understand their need and have participated in charity events to help them, so I think it works just fine. Kids don't need some pretty little doll and a story to teach them about homelessness, all they need is their parents and the streets of the city. Life itself is the best educational tool, but today more and more people want shield their kids from the reality and then try to teach them in a sanitized manner such as a pretty little girl in a clean dress....Don't look anything like the homeless kids I see out on the street. You want your kids to learn about the homeless? Shit take them downtown and let them see for themselves.

DesFIP -> RE: Gwen (9/27/2009 7:53:17 PM)
Some of us live in small towns where we don't have people living on the street. But there are those living in their cars and showering and bathing in a friend's place. And eating at a soup kitchen. Always interesting when the homeless is a classmate.

Arpig -> RE: Gwen (9/27/2009 8:08:18 PM)
So you don't have homeless people where you live, or at least not openly so...do you really need a $95 doll and a silly little story book to teach your kids that there are people out there who have no homes? Ask around the local churches, I am sure at least one of them runs a soup kitchen...take your kids there and let them help out, they will learn about it from those who know it best, those who need those soup kitchens, they will learn that they are people just like averybody else, and that they have a story and that they need human contact and compassion just like everybody else. Don't hide the world from your kids, take them out into it and let them see it for what it really is, warts and all. They will be better people for the experience.

ShaharThorne -> RE: Gwen (9/27/2009 8:18:53 PM)
NOt buying a worthless doll. My daughter is too old for dolls. She has experienced what it was like to be homeless. The money is better used helping a food bank, a shelter or extra food on the table.

DesFIP -> RE: Gwen (9/27/2009 8:28:23 PM)
Arpig, you totally misunderstood my comment. My kids don't see strange people being homeless or hungry, they see classmates getting dinner at the soup kitchen when they helped there. Which makes a hell of a lot more of an impact than some stranger in a different part of town. Does any child need an American Girl doll? No. No more than any adult needs an Audi over the lowest priced Ford. But people choose to spend their discretionary funds in any way they see fit. Do I need a hard cover book instead of waiting a year for the paperback to come out? No. But if I choose to do so it's nobody else's business. Just as it's not your decision of somebody buys a pair of Jimmy Choo's over Payless.

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