Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (Full Version)

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xBullx -> Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 8:08:05 AM)

I can't remember ever being so disappointed in the American (US) "Citizen". This week was filled with a record number of "WTF's", at least for me. Ok, I admit it, I flip around the radio dial while in my truck and normally end up on POTUS, CNN or Fox (I really like Neil Cavuto, he looks like Eddie Munster), I have Sirius/XM so I do have a broad range of entertainment choices.

But lately I've been listening more carefully to what I see as the emerging story behind each of the individual dramatic episodes. Last night I was home for a change, it was a late supper and “the noise maker” Hannity was on the tube, and no he is not my typical brain food. But all the same he was interviewing a couple females that were demonstrating in Pittsburgh at the G20 facade. These girls seemed dreadfully mislead and dare I say, ignorant as to what they were saying. For fuck sake do these people really believe that any experiment with any type of official Governmental redistribution of wealth will work? Well besides the illegally established tax system we surrendered to and already have in place.

Come on folks the power of the people is in their freedom/liberty, not in their Government!!! The French revolution wasn’t about wealth redistribution; it was supposedly about the right of the individual… and in that the ability to establish his own wealth. Well actually it was about how so many could be influenced by a few, but all the same I think the cry was for libertAy and not for more government control.

But a system where private top end salaries are limited and the reason to work hard to achieve greatness is regulated do they really believe that this will inspire a better tomorrow?

So here's my political query.

Is America truly as eager as it appears to surrender her liberties completely? I mean, we have sacrificed power to the Fed since Washington made the Jay Treaty with the British shortly into his Presidency, but it seems that an extremely vocal minority are making a push to reinvent the Russian revolt of the 19th century, and I assure that not all the intent is good. The behind the scene instigators seemed to have vilified anyone that attempts to excel and generate a sizeable income for themselves. "Hate the Capitalists (were Jews capitalists in the late 19th and early 20th century Austria?)"!!!!!!!! WTF…

I don’t know, it seems the "slaves" are having a revolt… And they want a new master, the problem is they have never thought for themselves and it appears they have no intention of starting now.

The new Patrick Henry quote, “Give me the illusion of a government program, lotsa free shit, and take care of my unmotivated ass or give me, uhmm, uhmm…..oh hell I don’t know what I want, no one has dictated further thought.

I love the argument that my father was a factory worker and my mother waited tables to raise a family of 6 kids, they never had the nice things. These girls last night asked why anyone needs more than 500,000 thousand dollars a year. First, these hypothetical parents of 6 most likely had to get married, shotgun wedding and all. Then they had to struggle due to the lack of education and the willingness to settle for their own perceived fate. Of course dad could have went to night school and worked to be an exec or mom could have became the first Sara Palin, by being fed up with the local leadership and run for school board(and so on), but as is the case in 90 percent of the examples I have mentioned, they were busy changing diapers and having beers at the local pub. More times than not these parents were busting their ass with the hope of making a better life for the 6 spoiled brats that now hope to surrender the freedoms they take for granted. I assure you that the people fostering the great idea of the nanny state have the intention of being the nanny or are so dense that they forgot the more times than not Matilda’s (1996 movie) nanny is a Trunchbull and not Mrs. Doubtfire(a different movie altogether).

Be careful what you wish for, the next great dictator is ringing his hands, smirking and just patiently waiting his turn, and I promise you he’s out there.

Listen up folks America isn’t perfect, but it still provides the best opportunities out there. Take that away and I assure you the some brand of hate will, in time own us all. While I don’t mind some government regulations to maintain fair business practices; establish some degree of public safety; create, improve and maintain infrastructure, as well as serve for the common defense. I do mind the government being my keeper; the fact is that Uncle Sam will never be a good keeper for us all; he’s too opinionated and overbearing. He needs to remain a poster board character and not a master of us all.





Laymedown60 -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 8:58:37 AM)

Have faith…it will pass like it always does. Most, not all, but most of these protesters are young, impressionable, and mistaken in their beliefs that money is the root of evil. That mindset will change as they continue to experience life and accumulate responsibilities.

Butch




Musicmystery -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 9:15:03 AM)

Hi Bull,

I'm not so sure it's the nanny state or socialism or rights per se (which people readily surrender when someone waves a flag in their face or when they think it will help "their side" nationally) or even redistribution so much (and every always is about economics in the end) as it is a misguided sense of entitlement. Management, workers, leaders, followers, rich, poor, business, charity, old, young, religious, secular--everybody thinks the world owes them something. They've been taught they have equal time and voice just for breathing, that their share is sitting there, saved for them, and that the path to the good life is not developing and applying one's strengths, but proclaiming oneself a victim, embracing one's weaknesses. It's become as true of corporations as of the uninformed who can't think of any solutions, so they march and wave signs.

People have become proud to be weak. If enough weak people gather together, they won't have to be strong.

My take anyway.

Live well!





xBullx -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 9:24:27 AM)


quote:




People have become proud to be weak. If enough weak people gather together, they won't have to be strong.






Those damn "Sames" anyway...........




AnimusRex -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 9:39:46 AM)

So we have a choice between Stalinist Communism, and the status quo?

I think that is a bit of a straw man there.

I too am a believer in the liberating effects of the free markets, but you don't have to be a socialist to see that what we have in the status quo is not right.

Specifically- much of our economy is NOT anything like a "free" market; in fact, most large corporations have a small army of lobbyists who are hellbent on sucking at the public teat, whether by tariffs, favorable tax loophpoles, or sometimes just outright bribery of public officials.
Examples would be TARP and the bailouts, but some are less obvious, like agricultural subsidies, mining leases where corporations use public land for free, and get to keep the profit, or government contracts which are conducted in a competition-free environment. None of these things would exist in a "free" market.

Trying to defend the status quo as an example of liberty and freedom is simply innacurate- in order for freedom to work, there have to be fair ground rules that everyone follows; anarchy never truly exists- what happens in the absense of rules is monopoly and the loss of freedom.





SpinnerofTales -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 10:21:27 AM)

I have to admit that I find this whole bruhaha about the "redistribution of wealth" kind of amusing. Folks, the wealth has already been redistributed. Do a little googling and see what percentage of the wealth in this country was 40 years ago, ten years ago and what it is now. (and no, I am not going to do an hour's research to find citations. I did my homework, do yours) The gap between the average middle class person and the average top 5%er has widened to something approaching the grand canyon.

A good part of this redistribution of wealth has been accomplished with the help of government policies designed to help those (big surprise) with the most money to give to their campaign war chests.  So we're not talking about redistribution of wealth as if it never happened. We are talking about changing the current system of redistributing the wealth in a way that will be more beneficial to the country as a whole.





xBullx -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 11:01:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SpinnerofTales

We are talking about changing the current system of redistributing the wealth in a way that will be more beneficial to the country as a whole.





In who's opinion?




OrionTheWolf -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 11:07:17 AM)

 


quote:

ORIGINAL: SpinnerofTales

A good part of this redistribution of wealth has been accomplished with the help of government policies designed to help those (big surprise) with the most money to give to their campaign war chests.


What is occuring is not changing either. It has been a bait and switch from all appearances, that may morph into a shell game.

quote:


So we're not talking about redistribution of wealth as if it never happened. We are talking about changing the current system of redistributing the wealth in a way that will be more beneficial to the country as a whole.



Some changes need to be made yes, but I do not trust the government to do this via more control over our society. Remove the ability for large corporations to heavily influence our politicians, and then the only place they can gain support and money will be from individuals, which is how it should be.

Otherwise all polticians at the federal, and some at state levels are not Democrats or Republicans, they are Corporatist. You have to change the politicians or you are just re-arranging the furniture in a house with a crumbling foundation.




Kirata -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 11:13:10 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Otherwise all polticians at the federal, and some at state levels are not Democrats or Republicans, they are Corporatist.

Yep. And as Benito Mussolini famously observed, Fascism is "the merger of state and corporate power" and "should more appropriately be called Corporatism."

K.




xBullx -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 11:50:19 AM)

Define irony....

Just 60 years ago we were desperately fighting against what now "unknowingly" seems to be our latest ambitions.

Do you think the dupers share toddies after their Saturday evening strategy sessions laughing at those worthy of their dupe?

It's a magnificent chess match...





pahunkboy -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 11:51:27 AM)

Bull,

if you look at any of my links you get a better picture of what is going on.

Chapman says the military will overthrow the government.

So there is your answer.

:-)




Elipsis -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 11:56:53 AM)

The government has been redistributing wealth for a long time now... it's called taxes.

Tax money goes all over the place into hundreds (thousands?) of government programs and projects - the utility of these programs is often in debate but I think most can agree that they range from the very useful and beneficial to shockingly stupid and wasteful.





pahunkboy -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 11:59:10 AM)

http://larouchepac.com/lpactv?nid=11891    depite what you think of larouche- you must know his idea to restore glass stegal.  He at least has a starting point for a solution rather then just tell us it is bad.    The later vid is good.  

As a people we have the talent to overcome this.   If we want to.




Elipsis -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 12:04:30 PM)

Ok... I was unfamiliar with what the "glass stegal" standard is and was genuinely interested right up until about 2:25 through the video when the chick said "We are on the verge of a genocidal holocaust.

I mean... seriously...




Politesub53 -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 12:19:42 PM)

I am English and also watched it. The presenter lost me when she said anyone who didnt agree with the video wasnt a twue American. What utter tosh.




Elipsis -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 12:38:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

I am English and also watched it. The presenter lost me when she said anyone who didnt agree with the video wasnt a twue American. What utter tosh.


Oh christ I'm glad I didn't make it that far.




Arrogance -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 1:43:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: xBullx

quote:

ORIGINAL: SpinnerofTales

We are talking about changing the current system of redistributing the wealth in a way that will be more beneficial to the country as a whole.




In who's opinion?



The opinions of the majority because they would be the ones who would benefit.




OrionTheWolf -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 1:53:35 PM)

A few things strike me from your comment:

1) If polticians, and the media are putting on many distractions to the masses, then the majority would not have the correct information to make a decision. This is what our elected officials are supposed to be for.

2) Tyranny of the majority is still a tyranny.




xBullx -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 2:21:41 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arrogance

The opinions of the majority because they would be the ones who would benefit.



I've been keeping an eye on the polls (the less politically partsan driven ones) and it seems you just might be in error saying the "majority"; it now seems a deceitful and vocal agenda driven minority are the ones that stand to benefit and my bet is their saught after benefit is not concurrent with your ideals.

Just remember when someone else is making the decisions for you, they place their benefit ahead of your own. While that seems satisfactory to slave types, I'm certain that wouldn't apply to me.

It's amazing how the Nietzche's concepts on morality are growing self-prophetic.

But a question or ten if you will....

If in using the health insurance scam, we are able to provide some brand of health care to the "forty" million folks without it; keeping in mind that there is around 300 million of us, how would you define that "40" million as a majority?

Or...

What do you see as the government's role in establishing your dietary intake?

How about...

If you chose to further your education, the schooling itself were to cost you hundreds of thousands of dollars do you think you should have your saraly limited by government regulation? What about this, what if you wanted to be a housewife, and because you were not presently with child or expecting the government decided that it needed you laboring for a work force that was short labors to provide for the common "good"?

I mean it should be obvious enough to see I am a strong and capable red blooded American male, but I think you should have to support me, and I will inform you at this time I am a disabled Vet, so ante up buttercup, I want to stay new home. So I'm just gonna sell my company (( a company that I, with the help of a gracious co-signer (cause I had absolutely no credit or cash reserve) built from the ground up, one that me and my family sacrificed to build)), buy a small house, albeit nicer than yours and just kick back, not because I have too, but because you owe me and I feel entitled to part of your wealth.

Or are you one of those that has no intention to get off your ass and feels entitled to the fruits of my labor?




Arrogance -> RE: Hello Michelle, I too am disappointed... (9/26/2009 6:59:12 PM)

*Yawn* Uhh... Nice rant.

The point of my post was that we had legislation benefiting the upper crust of the socio-economic ladder at the expense of the middle class.

So what's wrong with switching it up, if only for the sake of quid-pro-quo?




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