RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (Full Version)

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TheHeretic -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 7:54:39 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MarsBonfire

Yes, Music, and they don't cost anywhere near as much as taking AF-1 on a junket around the globe, for what is essentially a photo op with the troops. (Remember Bush and the fake Thanksgiving Day Turkey?)

mmm-mmmmm-mmm Barrack Hussein Obama: multi-tasker!



Tha changing of the subject moves along nicely, Mars.  Your efforts never go unnoticed even if the rigged election wrapped up a while back.  [;)]

Muse, I'm guessing you missed 60 Minutes interview with Gen. McCrystal last weekend.  President Obama's staff seems to be having trouble with all that nifty technology.  They had spoken once since the General assumed command.  I wonder if Obama would have met with him at all without that tidbit going public.

Is he waiting for TOTUS to tell him what our course should be?





SpinnerofTales -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 7:59:27 AM)

quote:

Muse, I'm guessing you missed 60 Minutes interview with Gen. McCrystal last weekend. President Obama's staff seems to be having trouble with all that nifty technology. They had spoken once since the General assumed command. I wonder if Obama would have met with him at all without that tidbit going public.
ORIGINAL: TheHeretic



I understand your impatience, Heretic. It must be frustrating waiting for the president to make an important decision so that you can tell us how wrong it is and how it will destroy America. Patience, old friend, patience. Obama will decide on a course of action. He will put it into place. And no matter what that course is, you will tell us all how it is the worst decision in recent, if not the entirety of history.



mnottertail -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 8:02:20 AM)

I bet you were armchair marshalling and catcalling the cowardice of Obama in the somali incident as well. Several times we have throughout the course of history, found that political figures should not run wars, and keep their hands off, leaving military matters to the military, and not further politicizing the events.

But, exactly how would minute by minute conversations with the commander in Afghanistan, and bellowing death to infidels, and Weapons of Mass destruction, and Mission accomplished, and send Dick Cheney in there with some no bids, resolve that situation?

Ron



rikigrl -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 8:04:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091003/ap_on_go_pr_wh/eu_us_afghanistan

President Obama met with General McCrystal for a whole 25 minutes.


Can you say tel-e-phone? Good boyyy. Yanno, they are actually able to talk without the pres. being in country....i'll bet that they cam to cam (wink wink)

quote:

Afghanistan.  Do we stay, or do we get the hell out?  There is no "present" button, Mr. President, and the facts aren't going to change, no matter how many meetings and conferences you call. 


Can you say lo-gistics? Good boyyy. Where are the extra troops going to come from? Who's daddy do you want lieing dead in the Swat Valley on Christmas Day? Perhaps you'd like to volunteer? Don't run and hide, make a decision, shit or get off the pot..




TheHeretic -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 8:08:46 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SpinnerofTales

And no matter what that course is, you will tell us all how it is the worst decision in recent, if not the entirety of history.




That's insulting, Spinner, and also completely ignorant.  You should apologize for mischaracterizing me like that.  I already have an often-stated position on what I think the US should be doing in Afghanistan.  I was saying it when Bush II was running the show as well.  President Obama's decision, assuming he finds the testicular fortitude to make one, will not alter my thinking one bit, no matter how pretty his speech about it might be.




TheHeretic -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 8:11:51 AM)

Your coin landed wrong, Riki...

I'm from the "get the fuck out" school of thought.



rikigrl -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 8:24:08 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Your coin landed wrong, Riki...

I'm from the "get the fuck out" school of thought.


my most sincere apologies Heretic, i knew not your position obviously. Given that McCrystal had just asked for more troops i read it that you wanted said request to be fullfilled asap. Once again, my apologies.



MarsBonfire -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 1:26:23 PM)

Making note of post #24 of this thread. If, by the end of the month, The President has made a decision, and Heretic critisizes him, I will be sure to post a reminder of where to find Heretic's bullshit.

Any and all apologies should be held in suspension until that time.



MrRodgers -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 1:35:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ialdabaoth

:( When you guys start arguing like this, it makes it REALLY hard for anyone to get any actual thinking done about the topic.

Thinking is dangerous. Think money, oil/gas, think pipeline, think Taliban with no Pakistani nukes. I think...that about covers it.

After all, if almost 8 years wasn't enough for a 'mission accomplished' then what could it be ?



TheHeretic -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 1:46:03 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MarsBonfire

Making note of post #24 of this thread. If, by the end of the month, The President has made a decision, and Heretic critisizes him, I will be sure to post a reminder of where to find Heretic's bullshit.

Any and all apologies should be held in suspension until that time.



I think you mean post #25, Mars.  24 was somebody else assuming they knew my thoughts on Afghanistan because they apparently knew I didn't vote for the President.

Tell you what, I'll even make it easy for you.  Here is something I said on a thread better than a year ago, about what I think we should be doing in that part of the world.  You can hold me to that as well.

    We are stuck in Afghanistan as well, but the circumstances that brought us there create a lot more latitude in how we play it, and just how obligated we are.  I think we need a very different strategy to deal with the Taliban.  Except for a couple divisions of Marines to guard the embassy and airport, I'd like to pull every conventional troop out.  Special forces, UAV's, and death from above.

http://www.collarchat.com/m_2104767/mpage_3/tm.htm  post #50

Funny thing on that other thread, that goes right to Spinner's accusation that I merely oppose the President without thought.  I was pointing out that I agreed with the shift in position then candidate Obama had made.



Arrogance -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 2:27:18 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim

If I were in the military now, and especially if I were in harm's way, I would not obey one frickin' order from anyone until "my" CiC made up his frickin' mind...one way or the other.  As Lee Iococa said: "Lead or follow. Just get out of my way."  Obama saying "Present" doesn't frickin' cut it.   


The whole "Present" bashing makes me laugh.... because Mccain voted "Present" more times in the span of time that Obama was a senator than Obama did.



TheHeretic -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 3:59:51 PM)

It was now-President Obama's "present" voting record in the Illinios legislature that earned him the reputation, Arroga.

It isn't just Afghanistan.  "I'm-a-nut-jub" is watching this closely as well, wondering how long Obama might waver on stopping the Iranian bomb program.



rikigrl -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 8:55:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim

If I were in the military now, and especially if I were in harm's way, I would not obey one frickin' order from anyone until "my" CiC made up his frickin' mind...one way or the other.  As Lee Iococa said: "Lead or follow. Just get out of my way."  Obama saying "Present" doesn't frickin' cut it.   


Failure to obey orders would put you right where you frickin' belong.



Loki45 -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/3/2009 9:39:37 PM)

Well said, rikigrl. You beat me to it as well.



SpinnerofTales -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/4/2009 1:06:05 AM)

quote:

It was now-President Obama's "present" voting record in the Illinios legislature that earned him the reputation, Arroga.

It isn't just Afghanistan. "I'm-a-nut-jub" is watching this closely as well, wondering how long Obama might waver on stopping the Iranian bomb program.  ORIGINAL: TheHeretic



Did I miss the "life and death" issues of war and peace that were decided in the Illinois legislature?

On a more serious note, you've brought up an interesting point. Right now we are in the unenviable position of being in a two front war (a bad idea that came from a very flawed strategy idea that few people noticed Bush was trying). In addition, we have Iran to worry about (and I would be very surprised if a military option is not being considered if not openly discussed)....There is a lot of stuff going on and that means a lot of thought and planning before a strategy is publicly announced.




mnottertail -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/4/2009 8:11:49 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

It was now-President Obama's "present" voting record in the Illinios legislature that earned him the reputation, Arroga.

It isn't just Afghanistan.  "I'm-a-nut-jub" is watching this closely as well, wondering how long Obama might waver on stopping the Iranian bomb program.



http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSTRE58M6RY20090924
http://en.rian.ru/russia/20090910/156085007.html
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/americas/2009/09/2009923222442432506.html

It ain't just up to Obama, there is an entire world out there to deal with. But I can't fathom how it might be wavering, I think he's saying what he is saying, and doing things in good order and finding as much accord as is available.

I also note that the Frog Fuck who was much ballyhooed for dissing Obama is taking a typical French pussy stance when it comes to this isssue.

Oh, and there is more, but the mindless screaming of what are we gonna do, why is this not being taken care of in the next 20 seconds with another war that we couldn't win, because we are the only one in the world who is ......that king of the hill guilt shit.........

While diplomacy, accord and following international law is generally a quiet and genteel effort.

So, he's (and his administration and civil service government) are doing a little something something.

Ron



TheHeretic -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/4/2009 8:37:36 AM)

That isn't the reply I'm waiting for from you, Spinner.  You have some unfinished business from this thread to address...



TheHeretic -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/4/2009 9:06:48 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

So, he's (and his administration and civil service government) are doing a little something something.




What they are doing, Ron, is figuring out that this shit is a hell of a lot harder than it looks.  Let me flat out terrify you for a sec.  The most experienced and knowledgable person at the table is Joe Biden, who couldn't be trusted to open a mall in North Dakota without mentioning the padlock combination to the missile silo down the road.  We have a "keep your enemies close" political appointee at SecState, and a "how is this going to look in the press?" weenie at CIA.

Now it can't be that President Obama is agonizing about breaking a campaign promise, just ask a smoker who makes less than a quarter million a year about that, whether the press gave him a free pass or not.

It doesn't matter how long he stalls, how many meetings he has, the question is going to stay the same;  Does he commit hundreds of thousands of US troops to a meatgrinder where nobody ever wins, or does he risk the political fallout that the next terrorist attack on the US of A will be based out of Afghanistan on his watch?

If only there was a way to make sure such an attack wouldn't happen before he got elected for his second term, the way they are doing with the proposed health care reform, huh?



mnottertail -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/4/2009 9:12:08 AM)

I know there are always some people who feel that Americans are always young and inexperienced, and foreigners are always able and tough, and great negotiators. But I don't think that the United States acquired its present position of leadership in the Free World if that view were correct. JFK.

And the problem is not in Afghanistan, and anyone who thinks it is, is unfortunate, I also hope he gets out of Afghanistan, and deals with Pakistan, which is the cure to that problem over there.

Ron



thornhappy -> RE: Pres. Obama meets with Afghanistan Commander (10/4/2009 9:15:19 AM)

Obama's probably spending a lot of time with SecDef Gates, which is  how it should be.  



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