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$500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 5:12:38 AM   
barelynangel


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http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Coming-Soon-500-for-Every-usnews-3217986354.html?x=0&.v=1

What do you think about the US putting into savings $500 for each kid born in the US to use after they are 18 for things like education, first mortgage etc.

angel

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 5:41:31 AM   
DarkSteven


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Dumb, dumb, dumb.

It used to be that college was a ticket to success in America.  Nobody asked whether it was the college itself, or the ambition/connections that went with attending college.  Kids were prodded to attend, and now we have record amounts of underemployed college grads.

Home ownership used to be considered a good thing.  Nobody asked whether it was owning a home itself that was good, or the sense of responsibility/desire/ability to budget.  People were offered too-good-to-be-true mortgages, and we have record numbers of defaulted mortgages.

After both "go to college and your future is secure" and "buy a house and you're always better off than renting" have been busted, our lawmakers come up with a program that not only ignores reality, but is laughable in its scope (who alters their life to get $500?) and is an obvious boon to the crooked banks that damn near almost wrecked the economy.  That you and I pay for.

Edited to add: The GOP tried to privatize Social Security just before Wall Street proved it's untrustworthy.  This bill has a third option, which amounts to the same money grab by Wall Street on a smaller basis.  Quit giving those bastards handouts and send the crooks to jail!


< Message edited by DarkSteven -- 10/7/2009 5:43:27 AM >


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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 5:49:16 AM   
pahunkboy


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It sounds like a scam to me.

$500 will buy what?   A book?

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 5:54:39 AM   
Lashra


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Just more crap. As a college student I can tell you that $500 bucks may cover the cost of a couple of books. If the gov't wants to do something for our kids how about getting them good, affordable healthcare, bettering our public school education and lowering the costs of going to college.

Just my 2 cents.

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 9:13:04 AM   
thishereboi


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fr
Not really sure if this would work or not. I would have to know a lot more, like who decides where the $500 goes until the child reaches college age. Would it be in a savings account and which bank? How much control would the parents have over the account until the child had access to it? Who is going to track every birth in the country and make sure the money gets distributed correctly? What if something happens to the child before they reach college age? Do the parents get the money or does it go back into some fund? And I understand those who say $500 wont get you much. At the school I am at, it would get you maybe 4 books. But after earning interest for 18 years, hopefully it would have grown a bit. At least if it is managed right, which leads back to my questions.


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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 10:02:57 AM   
Moonhead


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They've been doing that over here for a while now, and it doesn't seem to have tanked too badly. That said, they are putting rather more than $500 dollars into the funds for the kids, so it's going to accumulate a bit more interest over 18 years.
(thb: the parents don't have any access to the funds over here. No idea if it'd be the same system in the 'States, though.)

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 10:14:09 AM   
DemonKia


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FR, after read thru

& meanwhile, it's my understanding that Germany basically provides unlimited free college education to its citizens . . .. . . . I presume they have to maintain a C average or some such -- that's how I'd set it up . . . . .

In my book, the countries that decide there's such a thing as 'too much education' deserve what they get . . . . . . (Declining ranking as a tech leader, etc, etc . . .. ) While education is not perfect & can be extensively critiqued, it way beats the alternative. But for some, ignorance is bliss. We're mulling making that a national motto, I suspect . . . . . .

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 3:00:57 PM   
kccuckoldmist


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Five hundred dollars in a bank might in eighteen years be $1,500 and at best come close to breakeven with inflation. I think a thought like this goes more toward style over substance. A child is not going to learn to save money all a child is going to see is a small amount of money and what ways can I get my hands on it. But it sure plays well to out of touch elected officials.

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 3:47:21 PM   
DemonKia


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I suspect that in essence we're not really talking about 'money', freely transferable cash, that kinda thing . . . . Rather what we're talkin' is probably more like a 'gift certificate', payable to accredited educational institutions . . . . . Essentially, from a big picture angle & ignoring all the details . . . . . . &, yeah, mostly a gimmee for the financial institutions . . . .


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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 3:58:50 PM   
servantforuse


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Big waste of money.Here in Milwaukee the high school drop out rate is nearly 40% of those who start school. Lets concentrate on getting them through 12 grades first.

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 4:13:40 PM   
DomKen


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I'm amazed at the negative thoughts on this. If the money is untouchable till 18 and encouragement is made to deposit more into the fund this becomes a nice little nest egg. For instance at a paltry 5% interest with an additional $10 deposited every month the amount is 4719.52 after 18 years.

Don't look at this as the sole amount but as an encouragement to start saving.

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 4:29:24 PM   
einstien5201


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5% is better than any interest I'm getting right now...and ~$4800 *might* cover a year of state college at todays rates, but since the cost of college is outpacing inflation by quite a bit, I'm not sure how much it will cover in twenty years.

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 5:12:39 PM   
Sanity


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Print enough dollars, give enough dollars away, and they'll be worthless.

That's what I think.

Obama under fire over falling dollar

Alarm over debt draws together diverse coalition

CBO: Budget deficit hit record $1.4T in 2009

Shouts of 'Stop printing money' greet Dem congressman at townhall

Thousands Line Up For Stimulus Money in Detroit

Give away enough "free" college educations and a college education will be practically worthless, as well.



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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 5:51:09 PM   
DarkSteven


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Big waste of money.Here in Milwaukee the high school drop out rate is nearly 40% of those who start school. Lets concentrate on getting them through 12 grades first.


I disagree.  The value of a HS education has steadily been dropping.  Pushing unmotivated dropouts back into school will depreciate it still more.

If someone does not value education, let him try to take on the world without one. 


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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 5:54:17 PM   
Ialdabaoth


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
Give away enough "free" college educations and a college education will be practically worthless, as well.


Utterly untrue, because an education is fundamentally different than money. Money is by its nature a zero-sum game. Education is not.

When you learn things, you have the opportunity to understand the world better, which gives you more options and more choices. A college degree may be just some piece of paper that increases your salary, but a college education is a set of skills and understandings about the world that can help you make sense of it, and decide what to do next.

Giving that away for free, to everyone, would change the world in wondrous and unimaginable ways.

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 5:57:23 PM   
Ialdabaoth


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

It sounds like a scam to me.

$500 will buy what?   A book?



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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 6:16:30 PM   
popeye1250


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

Dumb, dumb, dumb.

It used to be that college was a ticket to success in America.  Nobody asked whether it was the college itself, or the ambition/connections that went with attending college.  Kids were prodded to attend, and now we have record amounts of underemployed college grads.

Home ownership used to be considered a good thing.  Nobody asked whether it was owning a home itself that was good, or the sense of responsibility/desire/ability to budget.  People were offered too-good-to-be-true mortgages, and we have record numbers of defaulted mortgages.

After both "go to college and your future is secure" and "buy a house and you're always better off than renting" have been busted, our lawmakers come up with a program that not only ignores reality, but is laughable in its scope (who alters their life to get $500?) and is an obvious boon to the crooked banks that damn near almost wrecked the economy.  That you and I pay for.

Edited to add: The GOP tried to privatize Social Security just before Wall Street proved it's untrustworthy.  This bill has a third option, which amounts to the same money grab by Wall Street on a smaller basis.  Quit giving those bastards handouts and send the crooks to jail!



Steven, good post.
I'd rather see our govt. put an end to all this "foreign aid" nonsense that's making Lobbyists obscenely rich and pay down the debt with that money.
For the kids? Two years in the military along that Mexican border.

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 6:18:14 PM   
kittinSol


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Considering how... "prolific" many American women seem to be, this could make a nice little nest egg to put aside for buying a television at Wal-Mart.

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 6:42:13 PM   
Ialdabaoth


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

Dumb, dumb, dumb.


Yes, but for rather interesting reasons.

quote:

It used to be that college was a ticket to success in America.  Nobody asked whether it was the college itself, or the ambition/connections that went with attending college.  Kids were prodded to attend, and now we have record amounts of underemployed college grads.


That's because people don't understand the value of a college education. Everyone assumes that the reason you go to college is to get a good job - that you're just supposed to "pay your dues" so you get this stupid piece of paper that says you're entitled to a higher-paying job. That's not what college should be for. College should be about education, not class distinction. Knowledge is power, and yet people are treating college like it's some prestige-thing, instead of an opportunity for knowledge. That is what's wrong with our outlook on college.

quote:

Home ownership used to be considered a good thing.  Nobody asked whether it was owning a home itself that was good, or the sense of responsibility/desire/ability to budget.  People were offered too-good-to-be-true mortgages, and we have record numbers of defaulted mortgages.


That's because people don't understand the value of owning a home. Everyone got all obsessed about buying houses, then selling them when the price "inevitably" went up. They tried to play the "housing market" like some sort of money-making game, instead of buying a house and living in it. The value of a house is that it keeps out the wind, and the rain, and gives you a safe place to eat, and sleep, and take baths, and keep your stuff. All these people got worked up about the prestige that supposedly comes with home ownership, or got starry-eyed about "how much money they could make" buying and selling homes, and this is what you get.

quote:

After both "go to college and your future is secure" and "buy a house and you're always better off than renting" have been busted


Only because those phrases no longer mean what they're supposed to mean. They've been drained of all proper semantic value.

quote:

our lawmakers come up with a program that not only ignores reality, but is laughable in its scope (who alters their life to get $500?) and is an obvious boon to the crooked banks that damn near almost wrecked the economy.  That you and I pay for.


Garbage in, garbage out. You start out with incorrect assumptions, how can you possibly lead to correct results?


All that said, here's a few pearls of wisdom about college and housing:

Go to college. Everyone. Please. Go to college. But don't go so you can "earn a better salary"; don't go so you can "always have a career path available". Go to learn. Go to discover more about the world, to find things within the world to be passionate about, and to figure out what you can do about them! I see so many kids sitting around me in my classes, just trying desperately to memorize whatever stupid fucking "key points" are going to "be on the next test", just so they can forget them once the test is over to make room for more "key points" - while the teacher is talking about EPIC FUCKING SHIT! Half the time, I just want to stand up and scream "would you all stop taking notes and LISTEN to her for a minute? She's talking about important stuff here! Who cares whether fucking Rene Descartes was born in 1596 or 1695? Who cares what the latin phrase was that he used? If that's going to be on the test then it's a stupid fucking test! Our teacher is talking about the NATURE OF CONSCIOUSNESS, here! Can we please wake up and have a discussion about the NATURE OF CONSCIOUSNESS now?" ... but, no. Study the facts, bubble in the scan-tron, forget them like nothing ever happened, get your goddamn certificate, and spend 10 years of your life staring at a cubicle wall. That sounds awesome.


Try to buy a home. Better yet, try to find a way to build a home. Yes, use licensed contractors if you're going to build the physical structure. But don't just get some stupid pre-fab track housing in the suburb. Find a spot that you're going to want to live, and build a home there. Think about the rest of your life. Think about how you want to live it. Think about where you want to live it. And then make a home there. A home isn't just walls and a roof and a garage and a carport and a pretty little garden so all the neighbors can know how much you spent to get into this neighborhood. A home is where you tuck your children in at night. A home is where your next-door-neighbors will come to welcome you to the neighborhood. A home is where your children are going to play in the front yard, where you're going to work on model trains in the basement, where you're going to teach your babies how to read and write and how to tell right from wrong. A home is a house, and a neighborhood, and a community, and time. Decades of time. If you're lucky, generations of time. Because even after you're gone, that home will still be standing there. And imagine how lucky your children will be if they don't have to struggle to buy a home of their own, and if they understand how lucky they are and why to value that gift.


And if you don't regularly churn through mud and dirt and rocks to get into the middle of fucking nowhere, you have no business buying an SUV. Get a minivan if you need to haul around 8 kids. Otherwise, get a nice subcompact. Save your money. If you need something "fun", get a mid-90's Miata or a late-70's muscle car for a few thousand dollars.


But whatever you do, please... stop thinking money = value. Time is value. Love is value. Experience is value. Knowledge is value. But money's just a marker for value, and as we've discovered recently, it's a terrifyingly fickle one.

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RE: $500 for each baby born in the US - 10/7/2009 9:10:37 PM   
DemonKia


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But, Ialdabaoth, with all due respect, we, the US, have been investing in 'money' & disinvesting in education for a long while, in a rather deliberate manner . . . . .

& on several levels. A culture of anti-intellectualism can be fostered, or respect for learning & knowledge can be cultivated. They do seem to be somewhat antithetical to each other . .. .

*gets dizzy with delusions of power for a moment*

If it was up to me, there's two fundamental things I'd do (while staying away from even more necessary basic reform of how education is done, in general -- a whole other topic) --

I'd institute some kind of non-military public-service corp for 18-30 year olds, or something along those lines. I'm flexible about details, mostly . . . . . lol . . . . Akin to the Civilian Conservation Corp. Pay, room, board, real world job experience doing functional stuff (details to be worked out, but there's certainly lots of work needing done), training, etc, etc . . . . .

& I'd focus adult education on the adults over the 22 year old line; vo-tech, academic, & etc, more of it, aimed at a model that recognizes modern humans live something on the order of 50-ish productive adult years & training for one career is silly. Continuous re-training over the worker's lifetime, to meet whatever changing needs the worker & the market need / want / etc . .. . .

The US business culture has been shooting itself in it's long-term foot by shirking the societal need to keep pushing the frontier of educating the masses, but we're about to get a lengthy lesson on that front -- goodbye imperial center, hello humility . . . . .

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