Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (Full Version)

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jlf1961 -> Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/25/2009 4:52:49 PM)

I don't know, maybe it is just a pet peeve, but does anyone else get upset when so-called "Educational" shows present outright falsehood as fact?  Is it any wonder why our educational system is screwed up to the point of being near useless.

In just one show, The History Channel's "Haunted history of Halloween" the statement "Roman Emperor Constantine saw a vision of Christ on a battlefield and converted to Christianity."  and followed that with "Constantine called the bishops of the christian church to Nicaea to set the basic ideas of the church."

1.  Constantine did not convert to Christianity until he was on his deathbed, and only at the urging of his wife who was Christian.  Constantine was a lifelong follower of Sol Invictus, the Roman Sun God.

2)  The council of Nicaea was called to, first get all of the priests and bishops to preach the same thing, at the point of a sword, and second to force an agreement that the birth of Christ would be celebrated on the 21st of December, the winter solstice which was also a high feast day for Sol Invictus, Mithras (another sun god) and numerous pagan religions within the Roman Empire. 

They got around that by coming up with the Nicene Creed which was more doubletalk than an actual declaration of faith.  It said that Jesus was the son of god, but did not set his divinity.

The basic dogma didn't come about for another 200 years, about the same time as what books of the bible were canon and what were heresy, or to put it one way, anything that disagreed with the powers that be was thrown out.

The truth is far more interesting. 

Constantine had a vision of the cross, and in his vision he was told, "By this sign you will conquer."  So he had his troops paint crosses on their shields, but didn't convert to Christianity.  He remained a follower of the sun god simply to keep him popular with the majority of his subjects.  Christians were a minority, a growing minority,  but not the dominant religion of the empire.

In fact, if you were to compare the religion of Sol Invictus against all the beliefs in the empire, it was no more popular than any one of the other beliefs during the time.



tazzygirl -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/25/2009 4:57:30 PM)

A case of ... when the legend becomes fact?



Politesub53 -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/25/2009 4:58:39 PM)

I feel the same about Hollywood and the portrayal of WW2.



pahunkboy -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/25/2009 6:25:11 PM)

I have no idea what you are talking about.

"invented Christianity"    hmmm



servantforuse -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/25/2009 6:38:40 PM)

Have you been watching PBS ?



Musicmystery -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/25/2009 8:00:29 PM)

quote:

does anyone else get upset when so-called "Educational" shows present outright falsehood as fact?


Yes. "News" channels too, and "based on actual events."




Arpig -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/25/2009 9:58:11 PM)

being a history geek I am faced with this sort of thing all the fucking time. I have learned to enjoy a good story for its entertainment merits rather than worry too much about the historical accuracy. Nero didn't fiddle while Rome burned, he was too busy trying his darndest to save it from complete destruction...but that just doesn't make as good a story.



Termyn8or -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/26/2009 12:49:41 AM)

"Constantine did not convert to Christianity until he was on his deathbed, and only at the urging of his wife who was Christian.  Constantine was a lifelong follower of Sol Invictus, the Roman Sun God. "

Would this be proof that Catholics are not Christians ?

T



MarsBonfire -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 2:05:25 PM)

Well, consider: any show with "haunted", "ghost", or "UFO" in it's title is already pushing a tabloid viewpoint. Entertainment value, not education, is their aim. And yes, I do find it disheartening that these shows seem to have taken over the cable channels.

So much wasted airtime, pushing BS, rather than telling people the real story. That's why I love shows like "Mythbusters", which foster a healthy skepticisim, and the scientific process to arrive at truth... We need a lot more shows like that on the air.




blackcat39 -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 4:26:12 PM)

I like the fact that people actually are smart enough to know the truth.  I like  truth.  It warms my heart.  ;0

Stupid people who don't know they are ignorant is dangerous.

I like how Santa the myth was created to help promote the economy/materialism in 1930's.  They attached it to the birth of Christ.....Moreover, the myth is set up to trick the children, for thru the children can you keep the lie alive to promote materialism.

It worked for 60 years, not bad for a myth.  ;0  At least in this case the ignorance was bliss.  ;0



tazzygirl -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 4:43:18 PM)

~sighs
 
Santa was not a myth promoted in the 30's.  Santa has been around for centuries. 
 
http://www.stnicholascenter.org/Brix?pageID=436
 
In 1931, the Coca-Cola Company decided that they wanted to increase their sales to children. The law at the time did not allow advertisements showing children drinking Coca-Cola, so how about showing a friendlier Santa Claus, relaxing with a Coke served to him by children? The talented commercial illustrator Haddon Sundblom was assigned to come up with a new, more commercial Santa. Instead of Moore's elf or Nast's grumpy gnome, Sundblom came up with a larger than life, jolly fellow in the well-known, bright red suit with white fur trim (the Coca-Cola colors).
 
...
 
...Although some versions of the Santa Claus figure still had him attired in various colors of outfits past the beginning of the 20th century, the jolly, ruddy, sack-carrying Santa with a red suit and flowing white whiskers had become the standard image of Santa Claus by the 1920s, several years before Sundlom drew his first Santa illustration for Coca-Cola. As The New York Times reported on 27 November 1927: A standardized Santa Claus appears to New York children. Height, weight, stature are almost exactly standardized, as are the red garments, the hood and the white whiskers. The pack full of toys, ruddy cheeks and nose, bushy eyebrows and a jolly, paunchy effect are also inevitable parts of the requisite make-up.

http://www.garsondesign.com/holidays/xmas/referencepages/santaclaus_history1.html#cocacola



Lucylastic -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 4:54:10 PM)

mm you are a popular little chap for skewing facts and truths, ..in such a short time too
Saint Nicholas was real.look it up
Santa claus, actually came to the US via the Dutch "Sinta Klaus" but way before coke put him in a red jacket.Have a look at this card from victorian era( a little way before the 30s
http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/british/ten_ages_gallery_07.shtml
He was written about (his look) in a poem in 1822 (again a few years before the 30s) and depicted as early as 1860 in the red suit, altho he was known to wear a green coat before the coke thing...
Once it got into the hands of the merchandisers tho... all bets were offf

Just as an aside, I find hospital dramas and medieval/tudor programmes to be unreliable too. Hubby found depictions o f the British army to be laughable in a few movies etc so we had a sign made up with the disclaimer... Its Their Movie.


Lucy



blackcat39 -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 5:27:06 PM)

Okay, regardless.  We started putting Santas in all the malls and department stores to promote matarialism and the goods (buy gifts for your youngens) Every December.  Actually, alot of sales are done during this time.  Speaking of which, what did you get for Christmas this year?  ;0



blackcat39 -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 5:28:25 PM)

My dad told me at a young age it was a myth.  Appearantly when I told the other kids the truth, it upset alot of them.   Santa isn't real.  lol  ;0  I didn't wanna upset them all, so had to let them believe the lie.....



slvemike4u -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 5:39:57 PM)

"Stupid people who don't know they are ignorant is dangerous."
It doesn't get any funnier than this....truly amazing.



Politesub53 -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 5:52:07 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: blackcat39

I like the fact that people actually are smart enough to know the truth.  I like  truth.  It warms my heart.  ;0

Stupid people who don't know they are ignorant is dangerous.

I like how Santa the myth was created to help promote the economy/materialism in 1930's.  They attached it to the birth of Christ.....Moreover, the myth is set up to trick the children, for thru the children can you keep the lie alive to promote materialism.

It worked for 60 years, not bad for a myth.  ;0  At least in this case the ignorance was bliss.  ;0


The Dutch introduced the idea to America via New Amsterdam in the 1700s. Father Christmas dates back to the same period in the UK. I am not sure why you think it is a 1930s myth.




Politesub53 -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 5:53:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

"Stupid people who don't know they are ignorant is dangerous."
It doesn't get any funnier than this....truly amazing.


And is dangerous in itself. [8D]



tazzygirl -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 5:57:17 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

"Stupid people who don't know they are ignorant is dangerous."
It doesn't get any funnier than this....truly amazing.


he talks to himself alot... hmmm



slvemike4u -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 6:00:16 PM)

Well,speaking solely for myself, he has quickly become a "must read"....good comedy is always appreciated [:D]



Lucylastic -> RE: Myth presented as Facts, OR get the shit right the first time, it sounds better. (10/31/2009 6:01:27 PM)

[sm=banghead.gif][sm=angry.gif][sm=cactus.gif]
I love the smell of Irony before bedtime



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