Tea party ? (Full Version)

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Termyn8or -> Tea party ? (10/30/2009 1:59:10 AM)

How about a TV party, and I don't mean trannies. I mean televisions.

Every TV is now made in China with minor exceptions. Now the Boston tea party was against a tax by the British, but then the insane profits made by US corporations are just about the same thing.

You know that little $119.00 TV you bought your kid last year for the induced panic buying called Christmas ? Well that was bought for about $30 from China.

So if someone somehow found a way to really fuck up the route of these inferior, lead filled, poisonous products into this country, it would be a good thing right ?

Or are you saying that keeping on giving them our money is better ?

Think of it, the original tea party was designed to throw the biggest monkey wrench into the works as is possible under the circumstances. Something like this today would entail shipping routes from China.

Even if a few lose lives, the assholes who take our money would be hurt, at least by being paranoid and having to go through all this security shit.

Think about it. This could work. Make TVs cost a couple of grand for the cheapest garbage they can produce. Eventually they go out of business and we come back in.

But the this means everything, callphones, stereos, PDAs, PCs, everything, it is all made overseas. Somehow fuck this system up and you bring them to your knees.

Why didn't this occur to me bef,,,, oh yeah, it did. Simple really. In fact we could do the same by just refusing to buy their fucking garbage, which I do, but most sheeple can't do that. At least until the price gets too high.

Fuck those SOBs, and you thought I was a nice guy. Actually I am, but to those who are nice to me.

Yup, the new tea party of 2009. Let freedom ring.

Hey, wait a minute, the government did actually provide a service. By printing all that money they did it for us. All we have to do is wait. Now we got the two hundred bucks and they have the one hundred pizzas. (you know who you are).

It is an interesting situation with China sitting on a bunch of US debt, but you know, let the chips fall.

T




popeye1250 -> RE: Tea party ? (10/30/2009 8:16:35 AM)

Term, one thing about this "global economy" B.S. is that it is energy (fossil fuel) intensive.
It takes a lot of fuel to push an 80,000 ton ship from China to long Beach, Calif.
And then trains or trucks to it's final destination.
Also, there are a lot of people like me who prefer to buy goods that are made in the USA. If it says "Made in China" I just put it down and walk away. I think that people should have a *choice* as to where the things they buy are made.
I do pretty well too, I don't have a lot of plastic junk in my house. And, I haven't been in a Walmart store in about 8 years now.




Termyn8or -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 1:36:56 AM)

pops, there is yet another thing to consider. They say GLOBAL warming, GLOBAL pollution and all that shit. And then they go on about something else before anybody can actually think. If we need that many TVs so be it. But if we are talking GLOBAL here, what is the difference if the pollution comes from China or the US ? It is still the same amount of pollution. It's all in where the money goes.

I am trying to enlighten and inform, about the real truth. You see my posts, help me. Help me help you ! The more people in the know the better. Help me help everybody, and if you decline on the basis that you owe them nothing, go fuck yourself. But if you are willing, let's take a stab at it !.

T




Brain -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 2:20:07 AM)

In the future China will sell/trade locally, like Taiwan , Japan etc., they don't need the US and the global economy will wind down.

Jeff Rubin, author of Why Your World Is About to Get a Whole Lot Smaller
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNUGCu1hx88


Jeff Rubin talks about how skyrocketing oil prices will see a regression in global economies, and a return to local ones, as outlined in his new book, Why Your World Is About to Get a Whole Lot Sma...




tazzygirl -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 2:37:27 AM)

lol.. everyone has a book




Termyn8or -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 3:23:19 AM)

I have read Rubin, but we are not on the same page.

T




SL4V3M4YB3 -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 8:33:49 AM)

Protectionism will hurt you more in the long term. Whatever your import taxes are they'll be matched by other economies around the world and products globally will cost more. The part you are missing out of your recovery equation is your need to export to grow your economy and that won't happen if your are more interested in import taxes rather than helping the companies in your economy come up with innovative products (not TV's) (they can only be innovative if they are competing on the same terms with others by finding new areas of demand). So you have a problem recycling old TV's? Well then give incentives to companies that reprocess such products and you'll see you lead the world and the problems you've solved other countries behind the curve will be asking for answers from you for.




MarsBonfire -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 1:33:59 PM)

Not to mention, all of the companies which produce electronics for the world market are cross- inveated with the markets of their target patrons. So, the evil chinese company making TV's is doing so under contract to Wal-Mart, and a half dozen other US retailers. You hurt them, you also hurt the companies at home.

Your single best course of action is not to propose something as radical as becoming Somoli-style pirates, disrupting shipping lanes, but to simply take your dollars elsewhere when you go to buy. As Pop said, just put the TV down, and look around for something built locally. First, it's completely legal, and second, you can get the message across to ALL those involved in making the decision about what gets manufactured, and where.

Typical teabagger, Glenn Beck listener, reaction: if you see a conspiracy, start a fucking war over it. Pathetic, really.




SL4V3M4YB3 -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 3:35:34 PM)

I say I say that Glenn Beck reminds me of Foghorn Leghorn.




blackcat39 -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 6:22:37 PM)

Import taxes is good.  Better, just tax the corporations importing that manufacture outside the US.  10 cents on the dollar.  Maybe then they'll decide its not cost effective to manufacture outside the US. 

I don't have a problem with you manufacturing goods and services outside the US, but then you import it back into the US to create the deficit in the first place that makes other countries RICH?  That is corruption at its base......

blowing up one ship or killing people isn't the correct answer either.  That is moronic.  Economic warfare needs to be dealt with, and proposing the stupid non-sense they teach in universities shows stupidity.

Money and banking is set up to by liberal morons.  Do not believe we should import more than export.   We need a trade surplus.  Our services should cost more, not less.......

We also need an annual surplus, not Deficit that adds(surplus=to subract) to the national debt up to 10 trillion.  We need it start moving down, not up.  This requires people in office who are visionary, disciplined and ethical.  Liberals represent a change to the negative.  Actually, so do many Republicans.  We need more independents in office.




tazzygirl -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 6:25:21 PM)

Yeah.  Great idea.  Lets charge the country that holds our bank notes more import taxes.  Great way to save money!




Fellow -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 6:35:32 PM)

Corporatism is hard to defeat. Just whining does not help. The corporations own the government and they will continue searching the cheapest means of production possible.  US worker is still good enough  to compete with Chinese by offering high quality products people want to buy for higher price (to cover labor cost). However, there is nobody interested in organizing the production as the system ideology promotes outsourcing. 




blackcat39 -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 6:36:59 PM)

Your sarcasm shows you don't read that well.  Actually, we charge the Corporations that are manufacturing outside the US to then import into the US any and all goods by 10 cents on the dollar.  Then American corporations won't be the ones creating their own trade deficits for their own government.  ;0




blackcat39 -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 6:39:02 PM)

We should not be outsourcing our manufacturing.  We need to make our guns and bombs and aerioplanes in the US.  ;0




Irishknight -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 7:03:39 PM)

Just make any American company with outsourced work pay the monetary equivalent to minimum wage. Add to that a law charging a tarriff on any product from a plant that doesn't meet OSHA minimum requirements for safety.
If the tool box company that went to Mexico from the town 14 miles away suddenly had to pay an equivalent wage to the cheapest US worker and their factories had to meet all OSHA safety laws for them to sell their products in this country, they would either vastly improve the flow of money into the poor country whose laborers they are exploiting or they would find it competitive to make products in the US. We don't need protectionism. We just need to make the playing field more level.




Fellow -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 7:32:05 PM)

Some point out an interesting connection between US trade deficit and the federal budget deficit. Trade deficit makes it possible for US government to borrow as the Chinese use their surplus to buy US government bonds. It can be good in some cases but not in wider long term macroeconomic perspective.




NeedToUseYou -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 9:52:48 PM)

Argghhhh, all this talk about manufacturing.. I used to be in the same boat, in thinking that manufacturing has any future in the employment scheme. It doesn't as far as line workers go.

What do I mean?

Well, I've worked in several factories, low grade unskilled labor jobs. I worked in a bottle factory for example, you know the only reason they needed line workers at all? It was to search for bottle defects, essentially 80%+ of the employees were functioning as defect sensors, in 20 years I'm 100% sure they will have sofware that can handle identifying and rejecting such defects.

My Second job, was at a lighting factory. Guess what I did there, essentially the same thing, I assembled lights, with the aid of robots, my function was to check for defects in between processes primarily. As in I functioned as a visual defect detector. Again, a factory employing a 1000+ workers, essentially about 700+ were defect detectors.

My 3rd Factory job (a few months), was very crude in that I simply made sure the machine didn't get out of alignment. A job made completely useless with more sophisticated computing.


As far as every "factory" manufacturing job I've had they will 100% not exist in the very near future. I have to laugh anymore at the notion that employment is going to be based on manufacturing going forward. It's simply not going to be the case at all, trust me on this one. The jobs going forward are going to be in information, engineering and technical training (to fix the robots, by robots I don't mean full robots I mean like the arms that assemble things, the computerized screw machines, the visual defect detector, etc..).

So, people stop looking towards the past, manufacturing TV's will not provide more than a few jobs to your children, whereas in in the past they provided thousands for the exact same number of TVs.

I'm mean do people understand, Every product cycle requires less cost and higher quality than the previous cycle by the contracting party. This neccessates removal of humans slowly but surely with more reliable, dependable, computer controlled methods of manufacture.

Manufacturing as far as a major employment factor, is a slowly dying dinosaur.

It's time to stop thinking like it's last century. Watch documentaries on modern factories and this will become readily apparent.

Edited to add....

See what is happening is a company looks at the cost of upgrading their processes to manufacturer a product. They price the cost of buying new uber great machinery versus the cost savings and higher defect rate of exporting a process to the third world . Well, at present it still makes sense to export the older method of manufacture and pay a 1.00 a day and eat the defect rate, etc.... However, eventually like everything that equation will not even make sense to pay any real amount to manufacture anything of consequence.

Does that make sense. The chinese and other lower paid markets aren't stealing your jobs, they are holding off advanced manufacturing methods. If those factories stayed in the US, more than likely they would modernize instead of exporting the menial jobs, thus, it's not 10 jobs in china would equal 10 jobs in the US, it's more like 10 jobs in China would be 1 job in the US, or the company folding.






Irishknight -> RE: Tea party ? (10/31/2009 11:52:30 PM)

I'd rather see the 1 job in the US even if its just maintaining the machines. If 1/10 of those jobs shipped out due to corporate greed were brought back, the economy would be in a better state than it is.
And the Chinese didn't steal our jobs. OUR government gave them away with no plan for anything to replace them. All that we got out of it was cheap, throwaway garbage that breaks 20 minutes after it leaves WalMart.

And its not just manufacturing. Its service and help lines as well. Try to get a service rep who actually lives in this country. Hell, even the annoying telemarketing calls are coming from overseas these days. I even applied to an American company whose human resource department sent everything to India to be reviewed... wtf? If these companies recieved no real benefit from outsourcing, then American workers would be able to compete. If they had to pay 7.50 an hour as opposed to 1.00 a day then it would level the playing field. THAT would be true globalization.




Termyn8or -> RE: Tea party ? (11/1/2009 12:06:41 AM)

Need, that is an interesting aspect to all this. Get ready to fucking cry, and have a seat.

This is how it is. First of all almost every country has newer and better manufacuring facilities than us. And as we bomb and rebuild the world this will not change. The bottom line is that they use alot more robotics an other automated technology. When they get a guy who is able to make the machine produce, they will pay him well. Paying one guy fifty bucks an hour who will get the job done is better than having five people who can't, even if you don't pay them asnything. The right Man makes the machine work.

In a way, what they have done is to scrap the industry part out of our industry. Ther empty factries across this country are devoid of anything of any value. They don't even lock the doors because all they have is scrap steel. It is like "Please take this". We are now a nation of junk. Rusted out cars, fallen down bars and out of tune guitars.

During the second industrial evolotion, other countries invested in their future, and that meant spending money. We had none because someone keeps on stealing it. I have people living with me and I pay the bills here, do you think any of them would fuck my car up so I can't get to work ? Of course that would be extremely stupid, but that is exactly what our "leaders" have done. They are killing the goose that lays the golden egg.

They are destroying the most avid market on this planet, throughout time. The fact was the US ciczenry would buy anything. "Dude, you mean this thing I just take out of my ear and it plays vodeos ?". "Yup and in the near future you will be able to access the internet". Oh cool, I got two ears so I will take two of them. Another example, you can get the upgrade engine in your car. It costs about quintuple the amount to fix, breaks down frequently and will cost you at least half of the gas mileage compared to the base model. Oh yeah gimme that !

That's how we are, or at least were. We can't be like that anymore. Back when there was enough of a manufacturing base here to suppot this Ponzi economy, it may have worked for quite some time. But no matter how much thet try to fuck us, in the end they will be bitten in the ass by one of their own theroms(sp). that is that nothing happens until something is sold. This is first year marketing, even Hamrick Truck Driver's school alumni know it.

See rich people see the economy as a big wheel, and they all want is to lay a razor like device on it to scrape off enough to make it work. But there comes a time when there is just too much drag on the imaginary wheel and it simply stops.                               

I want to be here when it happens. I make about thirty bucks an hour and my count today in my pocket is $1.12. When I sit down and meet someone who has millions I already treat them like an equal. But when the shit really hits the fan and all that money means nothing, we really will be equal. Except for one thing, I am used to it, and they are not.

At least I have somethig which to look forward to, and it is part of my reason for putting up with another day on this planet. I mean if the spaceship came, I would be on it whether as a guest or a stowawy.

T

PS - "At least I have somethig which to look forward to" grammatical assistance would be appreciated. Competent only please, I tried to work that out better than that several times before giving up.

T




pahunkboy -> RE: Tea party ? (11/1/2009 8:37:58 AM)

But aren't machinists needed?




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