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RE: Begging - 10/30/2009 7:40:54 PM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ncbabe
This is what works for me, outside of the begging to cum scenario.  He makes me work hard at asking for what I want, so I am forced to evaluate my wants vs my needs and it really makes me appreciate what I have and what I receive. 


I've been thinking over this thread and the problem with assuming that denial should be the default position, and agreeing to it should be rare, is that you can easily wind up with a sub who figures she won't ever get it anyway so why bother even to ask. More than that, one who works to suppress her enthusiasm and enjoyment in anything since she knows that anything she enjoys, she won't be allowed to have.

And that's a recipe for disaster.

My ex was like that, anything I liked, he took away. I was supposed to prove I loved him by not getting anything and being happy with that. As a result I don't ask for things, I have trouble telling The Man what I'm thinking of, what I want because my assumption is that he'll punish me for wanting anything. So I shut down a lot.

He really has to work to get me to ask for things. He makes me decide what movie to rent because I assume he won't like anything I pick, just because I picked it. I have trouble choosing a restaurant to go to because I assume he'll look for a reason to dislike it and ruin the evening for me. I had been so long in such a bad relationship that my default position is not to want, not to ask, not to share.

Which is why for us obedience is not the goal, emotional transparency is since my reactions if left unchecked will leave us with no communication. In this, as in other things, he has to lead the way. He has had to teach me that I do deserve to get my needs and my wants fulfilled.

_____________________________

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(in reply to ncbabe)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Begging - 10/30/2009 7:54:03 PM   
NuevaVida


Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline 		Celeste, I am really enjoying your posts in this thread.  You are sharing a lot about yourself and I appreciate that, so thank you.  And your comment about having to pee during menopause made me laugh, because isn't that the truth 

For me, I don't beg for basic stuff, but in the heat of a moment, for example, he will be toying with me sexually to the point I just can't stand it, and I'll beg for whatever - for an orgasm, for him to put it in me and fuck me, to suck him, etc.  When he denies me it makes me sexually desperate, which he enjoys, which fuels me even more.  But then, we're all wired differently.

But frankly that's the only kind of situation I would ever feel appropriate in begging.  I might ask for this or that (a glass of wine, to go to the used book store, etc.) but if he says no I drop it.


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(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Begging - 10/30/2009 10:30:33 PM   
ncbabe


Posts: 1060
Joined: 4/19/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail


quote:

ORIGINAL: ncbabe
This is what works for me, outside of the begging to cum scenario.  He makes me work hard at asking for what I want, so I am forced to evaluate my wants vs my needs and it really makes me appreciate what I have and what I receive.


you just about got a begging poem made there, babe!!!!!




I'm a poet and I didn't even know it!  Now I'm wondering if begging in rhyme will carry more weight or just annoy him...

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As we think, so we become.

Nichts ist unmöglich


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Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Begging - 10/30/2009 10:35:10 PM   
ncbabe


Posts: 1060
Joined: 4/19/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

quote:

ORIGINAL: ncbabe
This is what works for me, outside of the begging to cum scenario.  He makes me work hard at asking for what I want, so I am forced to evaluate my wants vs my needs and it really makes me appreciate what I have and what I receive. 


I've been thinking over this thread and the problem with assuming that denial should be the default position, and agreeing to it should be rare, is that you can easily wind up with a sub who figures she won't ever get it anyway so why bother even to ask. More than that, one who works to suppress her enthusiasm and enjoyment in anything since she knows that anything she enjoys, she won't be allowed to have.

And that's a recipe for disaster.



I'm not sure if this observation was brought about by my comments, but just in case it was I would like to clarify that for me, denial is not the default position.  Neither is approval.  If I ask something of him I do so knowing that once I have asked, it is out of my hands and the decision could go either way.  Begging is not something I do often and is usually at his request.  When I do beg, he expects it not to be flowery but well thought out and articulated.  This does not apply to sexual situations.  There is usually no thought involved there *smiles*


_____________________________

As we think, so we become.

Nichts ist unmöglich


(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Begging - 10/30/2009 11:28:38 PM   
NihilusZero


Posts: 4036
Joined: 9/10/2008
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: PainfullyCurious

As a Master, in what situations do you like to hear your sub beg?

When we're playing around and it's not serious.

Or when I'm depriving her of orgasm.

In other cases I'd prefer just a soft, honest request to have something she thinks is important heard.


_____________________________

"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
~Siouxsie & the Banshees

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(in reply to PainfullyCurious)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Begging - 10/31/2009 12:51:56 AM   
PainfullyCurious


Posts: 157
Joined: 10/26/2009
Status: offline 		Of course I'm noticing a lot of variation in replies. One common trend I am noticing though is that no one expects a mind-reader. There's a prevailing attitude of when-I-want/don't-want-them-to-beg-i'll-say-so. It is a convoluted subject, but that simplifies things a bit.

(in reply to NihilusZero)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Begging - 10/31/2009 5:16:38 PM   
catize


Posts: 3020
Joined: 3/7/2006
Status: offline 		There is a certain act that, at gut level, I have emotional difficulty admitting that I like. (talk about convoluted! Ha!)

S. sometimes toys with me sadistically in play sessions when it comes to that act. He makes me beg for it and I must do so loudly, clearly, and in a convincing manner. If I don't get it right I must repeat my plea until he is satisfied. But he only requires it in play. It is a humiliation kinda thing, which I find hot, as well as his way of making me face the fact that I do like it.

With the rest of our relationship, as well as with R., direct requests are preferred.

_____________________________

"Power is real. But it's a lot less real if it's not perceived as power."
Robert Parker, Stranger in Paradise

(in reply to PainfullyCurious)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Begging - 10/31/2009 5:24:45 PM   
BoundDragon


Posts: 265
Joined: 3/20/2007
Status: offline 		Begging is such a primitive reaction... I love it. I feel personally I can only really beg when i have nothing else to try and I'm out of control. Its the only time I let go of my hang-ups and insecurities (its strange, taking away my freedom actually sets me free).
For me reaching that point is such a big button pusher.
I think there is nothing wrong with denial to get me to that point or even hold me there. But realease must come at some point... be it minutes or days later.

(in reply to PainfullyCurious)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Begging - 10/31/2009 5:29:16 PM   
MasterAramis


Posts: 279
Joined: 7/29/2008
From: Connecticut
Status: offline
quote:

nagging is when you think that if you keep saying something over and over because I must not have heard you, and when I hear you I will acquiesce.......that is fuckin annoying.


No shit! I hate that crap and would just as soon toss the wench into the sea than to hear that crap. What women don't understand is that men have an extremely low tolerance for annoying whiners.

Aramis

_____________________________

"He who would be a man must be a master. He who surrenders his mastery surrenders his manhood." - Players of Gor

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Begging - 10/31/2009 5:38:16 PM   
catize


Posts: 3020
Joined: 3/7/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterAramis


quote:

nagging is when you think that if you keep saying something over and over because I must not have heard you, and when I hear you I will acquiesce.......that is fuckin annoying.

No shit! I hate that crap and would just as soon toss the wench into the sea than to hear that crap. What women don't understand is that men have an extremely low tolerance for annoying whiners.
Aramis



As a woman, I can assure you that I find whining an annoyance no matter the age or gender of the whiner!

_____________________________

"Power is real. But it's a lot less real if it's not perceived as power."
Robert Parker, Stranger in Paradise

(in reply to MasterAramis)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Begging - 10/31/2009 7:57:04 PM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ncbabe

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

quote:

ORIGINAL: ncbabe
This is what works for me, outside of the begging to cum scenario.  He makes me work hard at asking for what I want, so I am forced to evaluate my wants vs my needs and it really makes me appreciate what I have and what I receive. 


I've been thinking over this thread and the problem with assuming that denial should be the default position, and agreeing to it should be rare, is that you can easily wind up with a sub who figures she won't ever get it anyway so why bother even to ask. More than that, one who works to suppress her enthusiasm and enjoyment in anything since she knows that anything she enjoys, she won't be allowed to have.

And that's a recipe for disaster.



I'm not sure if this observation was brought about by my comments, but just in case it was I would like to clarify that for me, denial is not the default position.  Neither is approval.  If I ask something of him I do so knowing that once I have asked, it is out of my hands and the decision could go either way.  Begging is not something I do often and is usually at his request.  When I do beg, he expects it not to be flowery but well thought out and articulated.  This does not apply to sexual situations.  There is usually no thought involved there *smiles*



Sorry Didn't mean to aim my comments at you, more at Ron. But quoted you since you summed up the situation so well.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


(in reply to ncbabe)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Begging - 11/3/2009 2:59:01 AM   
ranja


Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline 		When He knew me totally, when i was a very open book and He had me tied up helplessly and i felt so bare and vulnerable that i became overwhelmed and i started crying and He knew i was fine and i was totally in His power... and then i had to ask Him if He would please wipe my nose... it was the most intimate moment... i have begged for things before but that simple question as my snot was dripping on my lips... the moment was awesome... it made us both high...

(in reply to PainfullyCurious)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Begging - 11/3/2009 3:23:14 AM   
RapierFugue


Posts: 4740
Joined: 3/16/2006
From: London, England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

begging and nagging are two different things.......begging from a wanton slut is pleasurable, to please me, for clothes to wear when she goes outside, to just about anything......

nagging is when you think that if you keep saying something over and over because I must not have heard you, and when I hear you I will acquiesce.......that is fuckin annoying.



Thank you for saving me 5 mins typing out almost exactly the same thing

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Begging - 11/3/2009 4:08:11 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterAramis


quote:

nagging is when you think that if you keep saying something over and over because I must not have heard you, and when I hear you I will acquiesce.......that is fuckin annoying.


No shit! I hate that crap and would just as soon toss the wench into the sea than to hear that crap. What women don't understand is that men have an extremely low tolerance for annoying whiners.

Aramis


If you don't acknowledge that you heard her then how is she to know if you did? Since men are notorious for not listening to women.

It really doesn't hurt to say "I understand what you said and where you are coming from but I disagree about what to do."

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


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Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Begging - 11/3/2009 6:15:12 AM   
PainfullyCurious


Posts: 157
Joined: 10/26/2009
Status: offline 		So I was reading an article on dogs. (Forgive me if you think people are all that different, but sometimes we are not.... More complicated and elaborate in the way we play things out, yes, but not fundamentally all that different, at times.)

Anyway, begging is listed as a dominant behavior, not a submissive one. I thought that was interesting. Perhaps some masters like it because it's a more subtle form of rebellion and it gives them the opportunity to demonstrate their dominance without the sub having to act out too much.

I mean, I've seen a lot of subs/slaves say that they do exactly as their masters wishes all of the time. That's reassuring, but it doesn't exactly create the need for the master to show their dominant side very often then.

Hmmm.. Now I'm re-thinking something I wrote in a previous post. I'll explain there...

(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Begging - 11/3/2009 6:17:43 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		I will point out that dogs go all in begging, and will take a beating for it gladly, and come back and beg some more....just an observation.

Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Begging - 11/3/2009 6:19:11 AM   
Aileen1968


Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline 		Woof

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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Begging - 11/3/2009 6:22:07 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Damn, Aileen....I thought it was KatyLied for a moment.

But good to see you as always.

Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Aileen1968)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Begging - 11/3/2009 6:23:43 AM   
Aileen1968


Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline 		She's too busy being a skanky whore.
Oh wait...so am I.

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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Begging - 11/3/2009 6:24:39 AM   
lucylucy


Posts: 612
Joined: 3/1/2009
Status: offline 		When I nag, it's accompanied by an eye roll. Begging? Believe me, no eye rolling.

_____________________________

“There are those who give with joy, & that joy is their reward.” Gibran / "Those who are willing to be vulnerable move among mysteries." Roethke / "Let the beauty we love be what we do. There are hundreds of ways to kneel & kiss the ground." Rumi

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 40
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