Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: History calls


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> RE: History calls Page: <<   < prev  1 [2] 3   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 6:13:08 AM   
switch2please


Posts: 494
Joined: 12/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

"Examples Willbeur? "

Easy one. Words from a commercial on TV "and our plan usually lets you keep your own doctor". Why would they feel the need to mention that ?

T


ooooh oooooh oooooh! pick me, pick me!! 

(in reply to Termyn8or)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 6:15:21 AM   
eyesopened


Posts: 2798
Joined: 6/12/2006
From: Tampa, FL
Status: offline
In my perfect world we would change our immigration laws to match those of Australia, and immigrants need to have employer sponsors to immigrate.  No one ever beats up on Australia.  Perhaps we could adopt the cute accent as well so we could be better liked?

Perhaps having more LEGAL available workers would create a climate where it would no longer be a benefit to have so many illegal workers.  Just a thought.

_____________________________

Proudly owned by InkedMaster. He is the one i obey, serve, honor and love.

No one is honored for what they've received. Honor is the reward for what has been given.

(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 6:18:56 AM   
switch2please


Posts: 494
Joined: 12/5/2008
Status: offline
How is this relevant? The issue is a lack of jobs to support a larger workforce, and you want MORE workers?!?!?!?!

(in reply to eyesopened)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 6:21:55 AM   
switch2please


Posts: 494
Joined: 12/5/2008
Status: offline
wait...I see....you think if we had less illegal immigrants, we'd have more jobs. Logically, this would appear to be correct - we'll just insert our "able-bodied" seniors into the physically strenuous manual labor and service industries? Perfect.

(in reply to switch2please)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 6:23:07 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline
Indeed Eyes, but you have such a long land border to the south and short sea crossings over the Caribbean that it would be impossible to police; Australia is in the happier position of being comparatively remote and difficult to reach.

Illegal workers are by their nature more profitable to employ; unless the penalties exceed the benefit by some margin, it will be difficult at best to overcome this situation. And policing it would require stronger governmental regulation and cost a great deal of money - two things which detract from economic growth, possibly as much as the illegal workers, and would not be popular with a significant proportion of the population.

The US has to find its own solution here, taking what lessons it can from others' experience certainly, but tailoring them to its unique situation. As the most innovative country on the planet for the last hundred years or so, I refuse to believe that a solution cannot be found.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to eyesopened)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 7:41:32 AM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline
I live here LE, and I see plainly why it can't.

T

(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 10:20:08 AM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen
Illegal workers are by their nature more profitable to employ; unless the penalties exceed the benefit by some margin, it will be difficult at best to overcome this situation. And policing it would require stronger governmental regulation and cost a great deal of money - two things which detract from economic growth, possibly as much as the illegal workers, and would not be popular with a significant proportion of the population.

That's the problem in a nutshell. As s2p says, the reason that illegal immigrants are doing all of the shitwork is because they're a lot cheaper to employ, and will actually do the job for a pittance, rather than refusing point blank to work for that, as Americans tend to. This has always been my objection to the argument that immigrants are stealing jobs.
Unfortunately, as a wannabe Texan, America's last President was very keen on exploiting illegals and did fuck all about the problem. The new guy isn't going to do anything either as the last thing he wants is the GOP accusing him of racism...

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 11:26:54 AM   
subfever


Posts: 2895
Joined: 5/22/2004
Status: offline
(fast reply)

Socialized programs are nothing but band-aids on a far bigger problem that few care to address... let alone seek to eliminate. It's the same, old, tired, address the symptom and not the cause.

While those at the top of the food chain steal the world's wealth, the peons are pitted against each other to compete for the crumbs. The masses seem quite content to argue and philosophize about how to equitably distribute the crumbs. Wonderful job of indoctrination by the PTB. I have to applaud their ingenuity.


(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 11:31:33 AM   
housesub4you


Posts: 1879
Joined: 4/2/2008
Status: offline
Actually, both would be doing very well, if the US Government paid back all the money it has borrowed from them in the last 20 years.

Something that seems to be lost when discussing how bankrupt Medicare is/will be.  Perhaps if it was funded, instead of cut to pay for a war (all the while borrowing from it) it would be in much better shape

(in reply to eyesopened)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 11:51:11 AM   
EbonyWood


Posts: 2044
Joined: 7/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: eyesopened

In my perfect world we would change our immigration laws to match those of Australia, and immigrants need to have employer sponsors to immigrate. 


This is absolutely false.
 
I have lived and worked in Australia, actually in labor recruitment for their mining industry. There is no sponsorship requirement. It is merely one way to expediate your immigration.

(in reply to eyesopened)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 12:19:12 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline
Isn't the main reason that Australia gets to be so picky about immigrants that nobody wants to go there?

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to EbonyWood)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 12:25:29 PM   
EbonyWood


Posts: 2044
Joined: 7/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Isn't the main reason that Australia gets to be so picky about immigrants that nobody wants to go there?


Illogical - LESS choosy would imply that, not more.
 
I like my comedy with SOME logic.

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 12:27:18 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline
There's logic there: it's a lot easier to vet a smaller number of immigrants than it is a shitload.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to EbonyWood)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 12:32:34 PM   
EbonyWood


Posts: 2044
Joined: 7/8/2005
Status: offline
I think they only vet people leaving.
 
Checking on sanity etc.

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 12:34:47 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline
Seriously? They're probably desperate for any immigrants they can get, then.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to EbonyWood)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 12:39:48 PM   
EbonyWood


Posts: 2044
Joined: 7/8/2005
Status: offline
I think your argument is becoming derailed. But forget that.
 
Why ARE you arguing? Do you dislike the country for some reason?
 
Have you been there?
 
I'm not getting your motivation.

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 12:44:32 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: EbonyWood

I think your argument is becoming derailed. But forget that.
 
Why ARE you arguing? Do you dislike the country for some reason?
 
Have you been there?
 
I'm not getting your motivation.

Cheap attempt at humour. The Australians I've met, I rather liked.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to EbonyWood)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 1:53:31 PM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: eyesopened

When Social Security and Medicare were first introduced, the expected longevity of the recipients was expected to be a 5-15 year range.  No one could have predicted the advances in medicine and healthier lifestyles.  The largest growth in the senior demographics are those over the age of 80.  It was expected back in the 40s and 50s that most folks would only be recieving benefits for 5 years and very few might recieve benefits for 30 years.  Now we have senarios where two generations in the same family are recieving benefits at the same time.  My brother and my father are one example.  Who could have predicted that?

The IRS has been looking closely at these figures.  The best solution is to change the age at which we recieve benefits to more closely align with the longevity expectations of the original bill.  Even if we increase the age at which folks become eligible for SS and Medicare to age 75 instead of age 65, the cost saving would be huge without having to decrease benefits or service. People working for an additional 10+ years supplies more tax base.  It really is the best answer.  Change the eligibility age to age 80 and it would be more in line with the original intent.  I don't know anyone who believes they are aged at age 65.


Life expectancy at 65 was actually 2 years then, not 5. And it would only take an phased in increase of full retirement to age 70 to keep the payroll tax where it is, not 75.

(in reply to eyesopened)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 1:58:18 PM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: switch2please

false: Social Security was not intended to be permanent, and yet it's still in effect.

false: Raising the minimum age for benefits would be ideal...and can you imagine the outrage?



FYP.

Raising the minimum age has been done before, without "outrage", and is entirely consistent with economic and population trends.

(in reply to switch2please)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: History calls - 11/25/2009 2:39:29 PM   
thornhappy


Posts: 8596
Joined: 12/16/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: eyesopened

When Social Security and Medicare were first introduced, the expected longevity of the recipients was expected to be a 5-15 year range.  No one could have predicted the advances in medicine and healthier lifestyles.  The largest growth in the senior demographics are those over the age of 80.  It was expected back in the 40s and 50s that most folks would only be recieving benefits for 5 years and very few might recieve benefits for 30 years.  Now we have senarios where two generations in the same family are recieving benefits at the same time.  My brother and my father are one example.  Who could have predicted that?

The IRS has been looking closely at these figures.  The best solution is to change the age at which we recieve benefits to more closely align with the longevity expectations of the original bill.  Even if we increase the age at which folks become eligible for SS and Medicare to age 75 instead of age 65, the cost saving would be huge without having to decrease benefits or service. People working for an additional 10+ years supplies more tax base.  It really is the best answer.  Change the eligibility age to age 80 and it would be more in line with the original intent.  I don't know anyone who believes they are aged at age 65.

Kill the cap on SS withdrawals and you'd fund it to about 95%.

Right now you pay SS taxes on income up to about $90k nowadays (single).  After that point, you pay no SS taxes.  So the guys hauling down hundreds of thousands pay the same SS taxes as the ones earning $90k.

(in reply to eyesopened)
Profile   Post #: 40
Page:   <<   < prev  1 [2] 3   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> RE: History calls Page: <<   < prev  1 [2] 3   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.093