Vultures circle over Liberia (Full Version)

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LadyEllen -> Vultures circle over Liberia (11/25/2009 6:53:03 PM)

One might have imagined that the poorest countries in the world such as Liberia, that cannot possibly pay off the debts they have incurred might be left alone to try to recover.

And when western governments in 2005 excused billions of unpayable debt for such countries, one might have imagined they might have a better balance sheet to enable recovery.

But that charity was not the end of it - much more debt was sold on to private finance companies known as "vulture funds", two of which are suing Liberia in London tomorrow for US$20 million.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2009/nov/25/vulture-funds-sue-liberia

Some might imagine that all that inter governmental debt being excused, this might have incidentally offered the vultures an opening to such lawsuits, notwithstanding that US$20 million is apparently more than the combined annual budget for health and education in Liberia.

And if the vultures have their way of course, one might imagine that whatever they recover will represent - at some pence in the pound or dollar - some of those governmental funds that have been forgiven as debt, the remaining debt only possible to pay to the vultures because of the relief granted.

I do so love high finance but I shall never be part of it; my disability to cast off all ethics can be such a hindrance.

E



popeye1250 -> RE: Vultures circle over Liberia (11/25/2009 7:04:17 PM)

LE, this is one of the reasons that first world countries shouldn't be "bankers" to third world countries.
In the U.S. if you walk into a Cadillac dealorship with no credit, no job, and no money you're not driving away in anything.
Anyone who thinks third world countries are going to pay them back doesn't belong in government.



LadyEllen -> RE: Vultures circle over Liberia (11/25/2009 7:16:41 PM)

I agree in some ways T, but then a lot of the government debt is in terms of loans provided so that third world countries can buy products made by companies in the country making the loan. Its a bit of a scam all in all as I see it - and basically it represents taxpayer funds being used to provide profits to shareholders and revenues to government from money thats already tax.

That much of the products sold in this way were weapons to support corrupt third world governments and luxuries to reward their loyalty to the west in the cold war may be held to justify the whole thing, but I see no point in pursuing these states, whose corrupt former governments have now been replaced (by new corrupt governments in many cases), when the loans made were almost purely for our purposes and ought therefore to be held to be western governmental expenditure, not loans.

E



popeye1250 -> RE: Vultures circle over Liberia (11/25/2009 8:28:40 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

I agree in some ways T, but then a lot of the government debt is in terms of loans provided so that third world countries can buy products made by companies in the country making the loan. Its a bit of a scam all in all as I see it - and basically it represents taxpayer funds being used to provide profits to shareholders and revenues to government from money thats already tax.

That much of the products sold in this way were weapons to support corrupt third world governments and luxuries to reward their loyalty to the west in the cold war may be held to justify the whole thing, but I see no point in pursuing these states, whose corrupt former governments have now been replaced (by new corrupt governments in many cases), when the loans made were almost purely for our purposes and ought therefore to be held to be western governmental expenditure, not loans.

E



Big surprise there! And as usual, the Taxpayers get ripped off!
Washington is the biggest "profit center" for big corporations.



InvisibleBlack -> RE: Vultures circle over Liberia (11/25/2009 11:47:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
In the U.S. if you walk into a Cadillac dealorship with no credit, no job, and no money you're not driving away in anything.


Ah, but not all that long ago, if you walked into a bank with no credit, no job and no money, you could walk away with a 30-year adjustable rate mortgage and a new home. My friends in the industry used to call them NINJA loans - No Income, No Job or Assets.



DarkSteven -> RE: Vultures circle over Liberia (11/26/2009 3:55:39 AM)

Lady E, why are you surprised?

Here is the US, one of the fastest growing industries buys uncollectible debt for pennies on the dollar.  They then call the debtor and harass him or her.  Frequently they will misrepresent, such as claiming that a debt which is so old as to not affect a credit report, is indeed damaging a credit report.

It's a sad statement that so much of the US economy depends on extending credit to people who never should qualify and pretending that they did. And then beating them up afterward.



popeye1250 -> RE: Vultures circle over Liberia (11/26/2009 9:18:26 AM)

LE, I once saw something on the "Telly" about Liberia and the Liberian representative was saying that because of "slavery" they had a,..."special" relationship with the U.S. I was thinking, "Here we go, the old "soft shoe", they're looking for a CHECK!"
I'd love to be president for one day and have all those countries "reps" in the w.h. and tell them, "Oh, we don't do foreign aid anymore, but *what else* would you like to talk about?"
Funny, most of the embasseys in Washington exist *solely* to get the annual CHECK from us Taxpayers.
All their machinations are predicated on getting that one piece of paper every year!
I wonder how many Mercedes Benzes the Taxpayers are paying for in foreign countries each year?
We're talking tens of billions of dollars each year so it has to be a LOT!
Oh, and the annual "shopping trips" to London via "private jet" for all mannor of luxury goods by African "Kings" and their wives and girlfriends!
Kind of makes you want to start your own "country" doesn't it!

P.S. it kind of make me wonder who the real vultures are.



LadyEllen -> RE: Vultures circle over Liberia (11/26/2009 9:51:39 AM)

Well, there is a special relationship between the US and Liberia, but like you I think, I believe independence means independence - which isnt to say we shouldnt help others out if we can, but is to say we owe nothing, zilch, nada by way of such former relationships.

As to gaining entitlement to special funding and the perks of being president of such a country, I believe Simon Mann might have some counsel to offer.

E



Arpig -> RE: Vultures circle over Liberia (11/26/2009 8:40:05 PM)

Personally I feel that all the debts should be written off. Clean the slate internationally so to speak, not just 3rd world debt, but all of it. Just declare it all paid in full and start over, hopefully a little wiser the 2nd time round.



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