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RE: The Sopranos - 4/18/2006 10:57:13 AM   
bschwimmer


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They remind me like a couple of guys that used to hang out with my uncle murray the bookie

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RE: The Sopranos - 4/18/2006 12:05:16 PM   
fyreredsub


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Tony is a Gorean in disguise

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/3/2006 8:54:43 AM   
cloudboy


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Well interest in the Sopranos is certainly waning. I'm not sure if the show should be lauded or rebuked for its wayward storytelling. We are now six or so episodes in, and the only significant plot arc running is VITO being forced out of the closet but into hiding. Zillions of things have either died or are left dangliing including but not limited to:

1. Carmela's spec house
2. The fallout from the Assasination by the italians
3. What's going on with Junior
4. The status of Bobby's train garden.
5. The status of Paulie's Aunt who raised him.
6. Meadow and AJ not really growing up.

Of course looking at this list, its no wonder folks are watching based on past consideration.

BTW: SALON had a great review criticizing the show.

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/10/2006 6:31:47 AM   
cloudboy


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This thread is doing about as well as the current season (going nowhwere.)

My gripe with the Sopranos this season is the lack of any continuing story arc that somehow ties the whole season together. The only storyline that qualifies in any way is Vito coming out in NH and the neaderthals in NJ wanting to kill him for it. The problem is, this story is a sideline, albeit the biggest in a LONG LINE of sidelines:

Son sells his Dad's company to Johnny, yet Paulie still cripples him. Mother begs Tony to understand while he's in the hospital. No consequences are explored from the violence of this episode.

Paulie finding out shit: first that he's illegitimate and second that maybe he has cancer. I'm rooting for him to die.

AJ and Meadow still somehow remain the poster kids for contraception.

Mentions of Adrianna filter in at odd times, kind of like Bush White House mentions of the war in IRAQ.

Junior shoots Toney and is committed the nut house. The comedy of this remains unexplored.

Johnny's daughter gets married while he's incarcerated. He's now seeming losing control of his captains. He remains an interesting character, but he's largely out of play.

Carmela floats without general purpose, albeit in a sexy Porsche.

A small eye is turned to the corporatization of America when Tony sells his property. Montage leads to him fishing to the Stugats.

Tony goes into the Hospital and he comes out of it. Life is a pair of sox.

Maybe Christopher makes a movie, maybe I write a novel --- no one really cares.

Artie is still the whinniest fucker around, yawn.

The dilemma of Christopher's additction: blow is more complelling than Mazerattis and McMansions, not good.

Bobby Bacala shoots an aspiring rapper to help his record sales, rap and diapers remain popular "hates" here on CM.

Hesh's son gets mauled by a passing car, still don't know if he's dead or alive.

EUGENE PONTECORVO commits suicide, no one gives a damn and his family is forgotten. FBI connection / interest to him dies on the vine.

Silvio has asthma, never knew that before. It was fun seeing his wardrobe of suits though. Also, when you can't read the paper in peace while taking a shit, you know that life's become too stressful.

Is the point that characters don't develop and evolve in interesting ways?

Is it true that the writers and creators of the Sopranos have such imperial fiat and freedom from HBO, that well, hey, they can experiment with the show even with the audience watching?

You tell me!

(Which you won't, because this thread is a walking corpse.)

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/10/2006 8:36:14 AM   
Lordandmaster


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The episode with Ben Kingsley was a complete waste of time.

I'll never forget the episode where Patsy and that other guy try to get protection money out of a Starbucks manager.

But mostly it's pretty lean, and I doubt they're ever going to tie up all their loose ends.  Oh, and, speaking of Patsy, there's another loose ened you left out: remember when Carmela was trying to get money together for some kind of charity or benefit or something, and she walked in on that woman who runs the body shop?  Patsy and some other guy were in her office, talking some kind of business.  No idea what that was all about.

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/10/2006 3:28:19 PM   
cloudboy


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Glad you could follow my post, rereading it I found it a little confusing with errors sprinkled in.

If I had to say what the shows problem is, I'd say it lacks a focus on a core set of characters. The time is too spread out over Vito, Paulie, Tony, AJ, Carmela, Artie, Christopher and the minor characters below them.

I did appreciate Tony being Christopher's "father figure" there while he swilled down the wine like hell's pig himself. With father figures like that, enemies don't look so bad anymore.

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/22/2006 4:36:37 PM   
cloudboy


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The next episode is the season finale, and they really have not built a lot of anticipation into it. If I had to say what this season is about, here would be my theory:

NO ESCAPE: The mob life is an inescapble trap with few options.

a. Tony's near death experience doesn't change anything for the better. He recovers and its back to the same-old-shit. Everyday is indeed a gift, or pair of socks, as he quipped to Dr. Melphi.

b. "Eugene Pontecorvo has inherited $2 million from his aunt, and he and his wife Deanne see his inheritance as a way out." Not so fast...a Rich inheritance can't buy your way out --- in fact you'll be squeezed three ways: by your family to quit and move to Florida --- by the Guys who want you to commit murder --- and by the Feds who want you to rat out your friends. Turns out Eugene felt offing himself was the best option.

c. Junior's end appears to be Alheimers, alienation, and the threat of jail time if he can be found competent. Now he's stuck in a nursing home.

d. "I'm 46 years old. I mean who am I? Where am I going? " Even in his dreams, Tony is stuck in a problem and situation he cannot solve.

e. Paulie finds out he's an illegitmate bastard with Cancer.

f. The boy who inherits his father's garbage business cannot even sell out his stake in peace, and he's entangled in a mob mess he never created. Trying to do the right thing, Paulie cripples him anyway.

g. Johnny Sach faces 15 years hard time and a 4.5 million dollar forfeiture of his assets by the feds. His last hurrah is a wedding furlough, cut short.

h. Vito, successful, happy, well liked, and full of promise as a mob captain is ruined when his homosexuality is outed. The smallest misstep costs him his whole life. His last breaths are ones of terror, torture, malice, humiliation, and murder.

i. When in Paris, Camella marvels at the sights but wallows in her own depression and feelings of insignificance, powerlessness, and family disolution.

j. Christopher lapses back into drugs and fails to break into a more glorious position in movies.

k. Bobby gets shot by a bunch of punks. Happy-go-lucky as he is, life just takes advantage of him anyway.

---------

Life in the sixth season is petty, cruel, and unforgiving.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 5/22/2006 4:37:38 PM >

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/22/2006 6:01:15 PM   
maybemaybenot


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I'm thinking more along the lines of the season finale < next four episodes> are going to develope into a war between the families. Phil called the hit on Vito, overstepping Tony and Johnny Sach outing the Cosa Nostra.... I am expecting this to be the turning point of the season. < why we had to wait this long to get some sort of plot still escapes me>

Of course, I could and probably am wrong, but that would be more Soprano-like than this entire season has been.

                              mbmbn

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/22/2006 7:51:20 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Aren't there supposed to be eight more episodes after the upcoming season finale?

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/22/2006 8:03:51 PM   
maybemaybenot


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Yup, there are, LAM.
I heard early 2007 will be an additional 8 episodes.

I'm not sure if I heard it correctly this AM on talk radio, but I believe they said this up coming Sunday there will be 3 episodes, then the 2006 season finale the following Sunday.

                  mbmbn

< Message edited by maybemaybenot -- 5/22/2006 8:05:28 PM >


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RE: The Sopranos - 5/22/2006 10:57:16 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Not to get too maudlin, by the way, but cloudboy--if that's what they're trying to convey, it's absolutely true.  The gangster life just isn't worth it.

Remember the episode a few years ago where A.J. and his snot-nosed friend look down on A.J.'s rich girlfriend's house, only to discover that it's just the doorman's station?  The girlfriend really lives in an unthinkably large mansion.  That episode had two purposes: first, to assert that CEO's and so on are bigger crooks than gangsters (an ongoing theme of this show); and second, to show that gangsters are nowhere near the top of the heap.

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/22/2006 11:08:13 PM   
yourMissTress


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

The next episode is the season finale, and they really have not built a lot of anticipation into it. If I had to say what this season is about, here would be my theory:

NO ESCAPE: The mob life is an inescapble trap with few options.

a. Tony's near death experience doesn't change anything for the better. He recovers and its back to the same-old-shit. Everyday is indeed a gift, or pair of socks, as he quipped to Dr. Melphi.

Tony is not going to change, even his 2nd shooting does nothing to change him.  What could he do?  He has no education, no marketable skills...there is nothing he can do and still maintain his current standard of living.

b. "Eugene Pontecorvo has inherited $2 million from his aunt, and he and his wife Deanne see his inheritance as a way out." Not so fast...a Rich inheritance can't buy your way out --- in fact you'll be squeezed three ways: by your family to quit and move to Florida --- by the Guys who want you to commit murder --- and by the Feds who want you to rat out your friends. Turns out Eugene felt offing himself was the best option.

If Eugene picked any of his other "options" his wife and family would never have been able to enjoy the money.  It doesn't matter what you do, what your luck is, when you are in the family your only way out is death.

c. Junior's end appears to be Alheimers, alienation, and the threat of jail time if he can be found competent. Now he's stuck in a nursing home.

Junior has been locked up in one way or another since the beginning of the series.  He's been on house arrest since season two.  For a while he was searching the obituaries for funerals so he could be out of the house.

d. "I'm 46 years old. I mean who am I? Where am I going? " Even in his dreams, Tony is stuck in a problem and situation he cannot solve.

Tony has refused to see what his problems truly are from the beginning.  Dr. Melfi points them out and he bats them down again and again, until it suits his purpose in arguing with her on yet another point.  She has come to only bring up issues that he specifically asks her for help with.

e. Paulie finds out he's an illegitmate bastard with Cancer.

Paulie has always been a bastard...couldn't resist.  Italian men are famous for having a very strong love and admiration for their mothers.  Paulie has exemplified this through out the series.  The men that constitute the Cosanostra are also famous for the "Madonna/whore" complex.  I think that Paulie's bio-mom being a nun and his subsequent reaction to the aunt is perfect illustration.  As far as the cancer...well, yeah, I hope he's got pollops the size of a calzone...

f. The boy who inherits his father's garbage business cannot even sell out his stake in peace, and he's entangled in a mob mess he never created. Trying to do the right thing, Paulie cripples him anyway.

Yes, you expected less?  or more?

g. Johnny Sach faces 15 years hard time and a 4.5 million dollar forfeiture of his assets by the feds. His last hurrah is a wedding furlough, cut short.

This is great.  Johnny Sacrimone has been 8 pegs too high on his own list all along.  I loved the way he was brought in by the Feds, falling face down in the snow running from them.  I do however feel sorry for Ginny, sitting there in her house listening while Janice who's been given quite a gift is still enjoying rubbing people's nose in the little bit of crumbs that Tony happens to toss her, by strutting a decorator through the house putting down the current decor.

h. Vito, successful, happy, well liked, and full of promise as a mob captain is ruined when his homosexuality is outed. The smallest misstep costs him his whole life. His last breaths are ones of terror, torture, malice, humiliation, and murder.

Vito has been in this life forever, he knows the price of expressing his sexuality.  His sudden weight loss and heightened self esteem makes him a little too eager to strut his stuff, and he gets caught.  If this didn't get him, his greed for money and power would have. 

i. When in Paris, Camella marvels at the sights but wallows in her own depression and feelings of insignificance, powerlessness, and family disolution.

Carmella LOVES to wallow in self pity.  She feels incredible guilt for profiting from her husband's business, but as we saw in season 2, not enough to leave him and the money behind.  Even when she did leave him, it was because of his cheating, and when she took him back she made lots of rationalizations and justifications about his line of work.  And almost immediately resumes the roll of a martyr.
 
Her jealousy of Angie Bompensero is impossible for her to mask.  Angie is a successful business woman, who has enough money to "put some out on the street" which puts her on a par with the men of the series.  Carmella has tried and even with Tony's money and the assistance of her father, she can't make a go of it.  Her failure on every level (business and family) is hitting her in the face and she can't help but reach out and slap her best friend in the face by bringing up the death of Jackie Jr. to Rosalie while they are on vacation and having such a wonderful time.


j. Christopher lapses back into drugs and fails to break into a more glorious position in movies.

Christopher...he's a junkie that was forced to quit.  He's the perfect example of a person that has to want to help themselves.  He has set himself up to relapse again and again with the two jokes that he has chosen as sponsors.  He really has nothing to lose, what in his life does he love that he could lose?  Money?  He doesn't need Tony to make money.  Power?  He doesn't have any.  Love?  He doesn't even love his pregnant wife, she was terrified to tell him she was pregnant.  Tony?  Now that may be something he wouldn't want to lose...

k. Bobby gets shot by a bunch of punks. Happy-go-lucky as he is, life just takes advantage of him anyway.

Bobby, dammit I wish this one would grow a pair, I think with Janice behind him he could really be a powerhouse.

---------

Life in the sixth season is petty, cruel, and unforgiving.


This coming Sunday they are going to air the last 3 episodes in a row.  The final episode of the season will be the following week.  Lots of plot lines are left hanging.  That's always been one thing I loved about the show.  They never needed to play everything out and assumed that the viewers would draw the likely conclusion.  As well as the fact that there are so many different plotlines that if they did play them all out the show would never end.  Remember the Russian that Paulie and Christopher chased into the woods?  Remember the housing scam that Tony had going? The list goes on.
 
Tony is finding out that his son has the same options that he had, follow dad's footsteps or do menial labor, because he was never taught enough self discipline to finish his education.  Meadow will follow her mother's footsteps and give up her own identity for a man, and most likely declare herself a martyr on the same magnitude as her mother.
 
All of that said, I too am hoping for something exciting to happen.  It's apparent that there's going to be a war between Tony and Phil, but who is willing to when " the guys go to the mattresses they ain't out earning."

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/22/2006 11:16:04 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Is that Big Pussy's widow?  I've never really understood what all that is about.  Is she kicking up to Tony?

quote:

ORIGINAL: yourMissTress

Her jealousy of Angie Bompensero is impossible for her to mask.  Angie is a successful business woman, who has enough money to "put some out on the street" which puts her on a par with the men of the series.  Carmella has tried and even with Tony's money and the assistance of her father, she can't make a go of it.

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/22/2006 11:20:48 PM   
yourMissTress


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Yes, Big Pussy's widow...remember when Tony busted her windshield and told her not to talk to Carmella again unless it was about oven cleaner?  Right after that she asked if she could try taking over Pussy's body shop, Tony allowed it because he was supporting her anyway, and of course took full advantage.  He sent Phil there to get his car fixed after he was rear ended during the whole fight he was having with Tony B (Steve Buscemi's character).  Angie made a go of it and is doing really well despite having to do all Tony's bullshit work for free.  After seeing Philly and another thug there talking with her, I'm sure she's kicking up.

< Message edited by yourMissTress -- 5/22/2006 11:21:38 PM >


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RE: The Sopranos - 5/23/2006 12:44:19 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Thanks, I didn't realize all that.  I wonder why they keep coming back to this point.  Maybe something will come of it down the road.

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RE: The Sopranos - 5/23/2006 6:19:45 PM   
yourMissTress


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I think they keep coming back to it, to magnify Carmella's frustration.  She wants to be a business woman, she wants to be successful in her own right. Where as if Big Pussy were still alive, Angie would be happy to remain a housewife, but circumstances forced her to do something and she's succeeding fabulously. 
 
Like the scene where all the girls meet to discuss the church auction. Carmella has always been the leader of the group and Angie comes in late, tells everyone not to order just let Artie cook because she's in a hurry, she talks over Carmella, donates $2,000.00 worth of body work, gets a call and leaves in a hurry.  And the whole time Carmella looks like she just smelled a fart.

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RE: The Sopranos - 6/6/2006 1:19:27 PM   
cloudboy


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It took 77 episodes for AJ to find some grounding and get a girlfriend. This was a sublime note that was a long time coming. Whowouldathunkit?

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RE: The Sopranos - 6/6/2006 2:09:39 PM   
Lordandmaster


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I was kind of expecting Tony to get whacked.  Now what?  Another season?  Yawn.

AJ's new girlfriend is fucking HOT.  Anyone know the actress's name?

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RE: The Sopranos - 6/6/2006 2:21:07 PM   
stef


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

I was kind of expecting Tony to get whacked.  Now what?  Another season?  Yawn.

I didn't expect him to get whacked but I was surprised there wasn't even an attempt on him or someone in his crew after the fiasco at Little Carmine's "sit-down."  Too bad we'll have to wait until 2008 to see the remaining 8 episodes   :/

quote:

AJ's new girlfriend is fucking HOT.  Anyone know the actress's name?

Dania Ramirez.

~stef

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RE: The Sopranos - 6/6/2006 4:07:03 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Smile.  Thanks.

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