RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design

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Brain -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 6:07:46 PM)
This guy had an operation in the United States, I think it was to get a new liver, and then he ratted out his former colleagues to get into and out of the United States to have his operation at UCLA Hospital. I left it out because I don't know a great deal about Asia and I don't even know if Buddhism is a religion; do they have a God? I learned recently about a man who became a Buddhist in Japan. He was a former member of the Japanese mafia and he used to behead and execute people. This guy is not a Buddhist, he is a phony just like Oral Roberts and Pat Robertson and Jim Baker and all the rest of them. Japan — Ganster boss who turned to Buddhism One of Japan’s most feared yakuza has renounced violence and found Buddhism. A genuine conversion? Or a desperate attempt to avoid assassination at the hands of his enemies? David McNeill reports It sounds like the opening of a terrible yakuza movie, but this is what took place in this picture-perfect setting when Tadamasa Goto, one of Japan’s most feared mob bosses, stepped out of the shadows this week and into the path of God. http://www.buddhachannel.tv/portail/spip.php?article5220 quote: ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy You left out Atheist fighting Tibetians I guess the Chi-Coms don't fit your template though do they? quote: ORIGINAL: Brain I have had enough of wars, I am sick of Protestants fighting Catholics, Jews fighting Muslims, Sunnis fighting Shia and so on and so on it goes. I don't think it's going to make any difference whatever I do quite frankly, people are going to believe whatever they want to believe. This topic bothers me because I was very religious for many years and it significantly affected my life, in fact, I would have done things much differently if it were not for being religious. I used to accept whatever came my way and didn't take any action in many instances to change what was going on. I just accepted the situation whatever it was and usually didn't try to fight it too much if I disagreed. But now that I can see there isn't any such thing as God's will; these days I believe in my own free will so I can see that if I want something to be different I'm going to have to be the agent of that change. I don't know if this makes any sense to anyone but I just know that I need to do what I think is right and not what some illusionary man in the sky would like as interpreted to me by Rush Limbaugh or Pat Robertson. So when you talk about what should worry me, my reply is, it does worry me because that is exactly what's happening now. Because they are not replacing the Bible but they are twisting its meaning to suit their own purposes. Indeed, someone had a thread on here several weeks ago concerning conservative is rewriting the Bible and interpreting it so that it fit with their right wing philosophy and ideology. So I guess they're doing both.

Brain -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 6:13:58 PM)
I don't see how I'm insulting you because I don't understand your point of view. I didn't call you any names, you called yourself those names. All I'm trying to say is that I do not understand your logic. As Mr. Spock would say, ' it's illogical.' And I don't think you're stupid, I probably think I'm more stupid than you.

Brain -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 6:16:01 PM)
I'm sure the professor and those people who came to his lecture think he makes sense. Why doesn't anybody talk about why anything he said was wrong? Everything is attacking me.

Brain -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 6:29:18 PM)
I don't think they are talking about you. They are talking about suicide bombers and people that murder and kill innocent people and blow things up, that's what they are talking about. I have definitely had believers knocking on my front door trying to convert me from Greek Orthodox to their religion. And I am so sick and tired of them asking for money on TV. I can't believe that Jim Baker is operating again somewhere down in Tennessee, who would want to watch that guy after everything that happened with him? And that Pat Robertson flying around in his private jet, like he needs a private jet. quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Nor have i had a believer do these things. In fact, i never had a believer tell me that i am stupid, pathetic, crazy, ect. But i have had lots of atheists do this... and on these boards.

tazzygirl -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 6:32:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brain I don't see how I'm insulting you because I don't understand your point of view. I didn't call you any names, you called yourself those names. All I'm trying to say is that I do not understand your logic. As Mr. Spock would say, ' it's illogical.' And I don't think you're stupid, I probably think I'm more stupid than you. If you love broccolli... and i come on saying how, in almost every thread i start, how those who love broccolli are stupid, twisted, mislead, ect... how long before you take offence? Do i come across as stupid to you, Brain? i do believe.. im something more than myself. quote: This guy is not a Buddhist, he is a phony just like Oral Roberts and Pat Robertson and Jim Baker and all the rest of them. Buddhists do not believe in god. All those men were fakes... that doesnt make the religion fake.

vincentML -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 6:43:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brain I am a bad guy because I tell the truth? I don't think so. I'm the bad guy because I like new and interesting stories? I don't think so. I did not say you are a bad guy. quote: Your right about nonbelievers coming out of the closet, I will agree with you on that one. I believe more have to come out of the closet and explain why we are still believing 2000 year old fantasies when we did not have the science is ridiculous. ''Oh Lord, why hast thou forsaken me? '' Because I don't exist I can't help you. The key word is "belief." People believe because it gives them solace or because they grew up in the tradition and are comfortable with it. All of your attempt at proselytizing will not change their belief because you are not important to them. Neither you nor your linked sources have any credibility to them, nor authority. quote: If I start a thread it's because I find it interesting or I feel strongly about it. Obviously you do and you have the right to start as many threads as you wish, I think. However, from the replies I have seen here you are becoming somewhat like the boy who cried wolf too often. After awhile no one paid any attention. I see no advantage for a non-believer to confront believers unless the latter are attempting to weaken the separation of church and state. That's what I meant by saying it is more proper for non-believers to play defense rather than offense. All you do is irritate people which would be okay if you had in mind some achievable goal. What is your goal here? To convert the congregation of CM to your “truth.” That is not an achievable goal because everyone travels their own path, not your path. Everyone has their own truth. Their truth is none of your business. If believers attempt to proselytize to you, you are free to walk away, as these good people will walk away from you. The written forum has its own idiosyncrasies. If you post repeatedly about a topic you begin to “sound” shrill. That diminishes your credibility. Give it a rest, please.

ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 6:43:39 PM)
quote: Buddhists do not believe in god. Some do.

vincentML -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 6:50:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda I have on occasion tried to think of a way to make the argument for that position in a cogent manner and I have never come up with one so easily understood and straight forward as you have made. A tip of the hat to you from me. quote: Why, thank you very much. I've had the same reaction to a number of your own posts. A very merry christmas to you and yours! Same to you and yours, Panda. I celebrated the festival of lights with a lovely shellfish dinner at a too expensive restaurant. I hope your holiday is also very merry.

Brain -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 7:09:32 PM)
If you don’t think the topic is relevant, ignore it. I think he is right because he is using facts to prove this point. Religion uses faith and faith doesn’t prove anything. I never said all religious people are liars. I’m talking about those who are disingenuous. I believe there are people in positions of authority in the church and in politics who say they believe in God when in fact they do not. They are just using religion for their own purposes, whether it’s political or economic or something else. An example would be this C Street group that Rachel Maddow has exposed on her show on MSNBC. In my opinion, those guys are crooks. They’re lying about a building they live in so they don’t pay taxes and can make deductions on their income taxes that are illegal. They are saying they are some kind of a religious group so they don’t have to pay taxes. I’m not insecure in my beliefs, I’ve never been more certain at any time in my life that there is no such thing as God as I am now. I’m not trying to belittle anybody, I think I’m trying to understand something that doesn’t make sense. Just like George Carlin said, “It’s all very confusing.” quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig quote: nothing the professor said is important. Bingo!! He's giving his opinion on a topic that most of us are sick of, a topic with no immediate relevance, a topic you post about on an almost weekly basis. We have discussed this ad nauseum, if there were some topical relevance to the post, say some connection to something in the news or perhaps some actual threat to somebody's freedom then we would welcome the post. But this thread has none of that, it is effectively an atheist mass...a bunch of atheists have paid money to hear some other atheist tell them they are right...when you look at it that way its not that different from church now is it. And we are not attacking you, nobody has attacked you, you have done the attacking (you called all religious people liars). What we have done is inform you that we are sick to death of your endless atheist proselytizing & your attempts to pick yet another fight. We know your views on this subject, and showing us how many "important" people agree with you does nothing to persuade those who disagree with you. It does, however, make some of us wonder why you are so insecure in your beliefs, why do you feel the need to trumpet your beliefs incessantly? Why do you feel the need to belittle those who hold opposite beliefs?

Brain -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 7:17:26 PM)
It's entirely possible I could change my mind about the cause of global warming. I think it's possible it may be caused by activity on the sun but that has to be studied more. Regardless, I am not interested in polluting the planet when we can move to a green economy. If we can change the economy so the planet is self-sustaining and we are not destroying it with pollution we should do it, regardless of the cause of global warming. The preponderance of evidence is that global warming is caused by man and I still lean that way unless they develop that other theory about sunspots and nuclear explosions on the sun more fully. quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 quote: ORIGINAL: Brain I want the truth, whatever it is; God or no God. Besides, I thought we were allowed to talk about religion, or, a lack of it here. I’m not afraid of the truth whatever it is. I don’t like being lied to and I just wanted to add that there isn't anything else out there, and I mean God. The Known Universe - The Best of YouTube http://bestofyoutube.com/story.php?title=the-known-universe I just wanted to add this other article about Scientology in case some people have not seen it: Scientology Founder Was Revealed As A Fake Over 30 Years Ago Secret mission to expose L. Ron Hubbard as a fake - Times Online The founder of Scientology, L..Ron Hubbard Was revealed as a fake, by British Diplomats over 3 decades ago. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article6740831.ece Ok, you "want the truth" and you don't like being "lied to" but you believe in that "global warming religion" crap? Even after they've been exposed as liars and frauds! I think someone needs an INTERVENTION!

Brain -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 7:39:49 PM)
I'm not talking about you, I'm talking about the extremists that blow themselves up. Yes, I think blowing yourself up and killing innocent people is twisted. You believe you are something more than yourself and I believe we are no more special than any other animal on the planet. I need facts and evidence to believe in God these days and I'm just not finding anything except faith, and for me it's not enough. You said almost every thread I start with religion and that's just not true. Maybe 10% or 20% at most of the threads I start are about religion. It's nice that you know what does not make religion fake. I'd like to know what makes it real for you?

tazzygirl -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 7:50:39 PM)
Just because someone states they are religious, you believe them? If someone states they are a martian.. do you believe? If they claim to be myan... what then? Sometimes actions speak louder than words, Brain. Watch the actions along with the words... there you will find the truth.

Brain -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 8:03:58 PM)
I think I’m okay with people not paying attention to what I post if they find it not interesting. All I wanted to do initially is show one person that there are physicists who have revealed their religious beliefs, like this Prof. I really did not expect it to become so controversial.

Musicmystery -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 8:05:42 PM)
quote: Actions along with the words watch... the truth there find you will. [image]http://www.bagofnothing.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2007/05/yoda.jpeg[/image]

tazzygirl -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 8:07:27 PM)
LOL

ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 8:08:40 PM)
Who the hell invited Dick Cheney into our thread??!?

FatDomDaddy -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 9:08:55 PM)
??? What??? Japan? Last time I checked they were not Chinese nor destroying Tibetian culture. The Soviet Union Red China Cambodia under the Khmer Rouge North Korea East Germany Romania Nazi Germany Paragons of Atheism and responsible for the deaths of millions upon millions of people. Take all the people throughout history who died in state sponsered wars of religion and it would not even come close to the deaths inflicted on the human population of this planet by Atheist States. quote: ORIGINAL: Brain This guy had an operation in the United States, I think it was to get a new liver, and then he ratted out his former colleagues to get into and out of the United States to have his operation at UCLA Hospital. I left it out because I don't know a great deal about Asia and I don't even know if Buddhism is a religion; do they have a God? I learned recently about a man who became a Buddhist in Japan. He was a former member of the Japanese mafia and he used to behead and execute people. This guy is not a Buddhist, he is a phony just like Oral Roberts and Pat Robertson and Jim Baker and all the rest of them. Japan — Ganster boss who turned to Buddhism One of Japan’s most feared yakuza has renounced violence and found Buddhism. A genuine conversion? Or a desperate attempt to avoid assassination at the hands of his enemies? David McNeill reports It sounds like the opening of a terrible yakuza movie, but this is what took place in this picture-perfect setting when Tadamasa Goto, one of Japan’s most feared mob bosses, stepped out of the shadows this week and into the path of God. http://www.buddhachannel.tv/portail/spip.php?article5220 quote: ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy You left out Atheist fighting Tibetians I guess the Chi-Coms don't fit your template though do they? quote: ORIGINAL: Brain I have had enough of wars, I am sick of Protestants fighting Catholics, Jews fighting Muslims, Sunnis fighting Shia and so on and so on it goes. I don't think it's going to make any difference whatever I do quite frankly, people are going to believe whatever they want to believe. This topic bothers me because I was very religious for many years and it significantly affected my life, in fact, I would have done things much differently if it were not for being religious. I used to accept whatever came my way and didn't take any action in many instances to change what was going on. I just accepted the situation whatever it was and usually didn't try to fight it too much if I disagreed. But now that I can see there isn't any such thing as God's will; these days I believe in my own free will so I can see that if I want something to be different I'm going to have to be the agent of that change. I don't know if this makes any sense to anyone but I just know that I need to do what I think is right and not what some illusionary man in the sky would like as interpreted to me by Rush Limbaugh or Pat Robertson. So when you talk about what should worry me, my reply is, it does worry me because that is exactly what's happening now. Because they are not replacing the Bible but they are twisting its meaning to suit their own purposes. Indeed, someone had a thread on here several weeks ago concerning conservative is rewriting the Bible and interpreting it so that it fit with their right wing philosophy and ideology. So I guess they're doing both.

Arpig -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/25/2009 9:20:23 PM)
quote: I’m not trying to belittle anybody, I think I’m trying to understand something that doesn’t make sense. Bullshit!! You may not have called religious people stupid, or idiots, or fools in this particular thread, but you sure have in other threads, and you have in several posts in this thread stated that either a) Religious people are liars, or b) you are telling the "truth" when you say there is no God (which implies that those who say there is are lying). And you wonder why people are tired of it? Did you ever stop to wonder why there are several religious people, some atheists and at least one confirmed agnostic all telling you the same thing? Maybe they are telling you the truth, maybe your endless posts on this topic are getting more than just a little tiresome, and maybe its the timing, I mean starting a "there is no God" thread just before the major religious festival of our society...did you really expect people not to take some offense? Quit whining about being attacked, trust me you have not been attacked at all...you've been around P&R long enough by now you should realise that you have been treated with kid gloves. If somebody posted links to religious or creationist youtube clips as often as you post your atheist clips they would be told the same thing...give it a rest...c'est plat . ETA: Oh yeah, I am still waiting to hear how science proves that God doesn't exist...you made that claim way back when you started posting and despite numerous posts promoting atheism you have yet to actually reply to my request for the proof you claimed existed....jus' sayin'

vincentML -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/26/2009 5:43:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brain I’m not insecure in my beliefs, I’ve never been more certain at any time in my life that there is no such thing as God as I am now. I’m not trying to belittle anybody, I think I’m trying to understand something that doesn’t make sense. Just like George Carlin said, “It’s all very confusing.” Carlin spoke out with charm and humour. You do not achieve that. I am sad to say you come across as an immature Don Quixote tilting at windmills in somewhat of a frenzied manner. I am trying to be kind here but you embarrass some/many nonbelievers on these boards. The redundancy of comments such as yours keeps nonbelievers in the closet because they do not wish to be associated with such aggressive posts. You do us no favors. If you wish to understand, a better technique might be to read widely. I would recommend the books of Bart D Ehrman. Read, learn, gather peace in your heart, enjoy your life without conflict, and allow others to do the same if you think this is our only dance.

rulemylife -> RE: Neil Degrasse Tyson - Stupid Design (12/26/2009 6:11:39 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig You know, I am 50 years old, and in my half century I have lived all over the world and met people of damn near every faith imaginable....and never once has a creationist ever tried to convince me of anything unless I asked them their views....in fact the only people who have tried to convert me are atheists...Even the mormons who took me on a day trip with a bunch of their missionaries never once tried to sway me. So what is it about you atheists that drives you to proseletyze so vehemenantly...what gives? I find that very hard to believe considering that many faiths consider it a duty to "spread the word". Maybe because of your own religious beliefs you are more accepting of it and don't notice it as much. I do and it irritates me to no end. I live in a neighborhood with a Jehova's Witness Hall and every two to three weeks they march out in force on Sunday to visit every home in town. And if you ignore them they will leave literature stuck in your door. I have a relative who became born again and I attended his wedding. Most of the other people there were also "saved" and I had to leave early because every other word out of most everyone's mouth was praise Jesus or praise the Lord. It was a standard response to everything. I told someone I needed to take a piss and apparently Jesus needed to be praised for that. I have a friend who also became born again and it got to the point I had to ask her to stop constantly spewing out biblical quotes, which she did, but I still have to listen to it second-hand as she babbles to other people. It's worse than second-hand smoke. And I could give you many more stories, so please, let's not pretend proselytizing is not the foundation of many faiths.

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