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IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/1/2010 9:39:41 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		Ok- I rethought the comments on my links.  I see your point.

My question is - are we still facing peak oil?  Is it eminent?   Due to how prevalent we use oil- it is needed for everything- then Obama staying in Iraq might be shrewd.

Before anyone says we don't need oil- let me remind you that FOOD is heavily oil dependent.

So- is the US just wanting to control the world resources- or are we truly at peak oil?

If we are at peak- do ends justify the means?

Comments?
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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 12:27:47 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		PaHunk, no, not even close yet.
Didn't you hear about the two enourmous oil finds off the coast of Brazil last year? And "enourmous" is not even close!
One of them is bigger than all the oil in the Middle East! I saw the graphics of it somewhere and couldn't believe it!
It was like an area the size of the Eastern United States!
And then there's Russia and just their "known" reserves are humongous.

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 1:08:55 AM   
jlf1961


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From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline 		The known oil reserves in the US, and this includes the Alaskan fields, would last the US for fifty years.  Alternative fuels will probably be in use before then.  Please remember the diesel engine was originally designed to burn veggie oil.

It is a little known fact that the technology to burn hydrogen peroxide as a fuel has been around since 1944.  The Germans developed the technology for their type XXI and XXII uboats.  The US got four of those boats at the end of the war and the big three auto makers tore the power plants apart.  The engines were 50% efficient in 1945 and the current technology is at a whopping 80% efficient. 

The problem is storing Hydrogen Peroxide in such a way that it will not break down to water.  It has to be stored in with a perfect seal on the tanks or it breaks down to water and oxygen.

The peroxide burning engine is a sealed system since Hydrogen Peroxide is an oxidizer in its own right. 

Please note that both the gasoline and diesel engines are only about 15% efficient.


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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 2:38:01 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
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You wonder why we are in Iraq, Afghanistan, now Yemen and soon to be Iran? This is the reason right here! Watch this series to understand the bigger picture. There are so many other factors that could very easily bring down amercia.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jng1nhsQHR8

this user  http://www.youtube.com/user/thevoiceofalexjones

This is what got me thinking.  The series is maybe an hour.  He does make you wonder.   This is the retired LAPD narcotics head- who confronted congress over the CIA dealing drugs in south central LA.

(I am trying to get better about my links)

< Message edited by pahunkboy -- 1/2/2010 2:39:06 AM >

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 6:34:23 AM   
housesub4you


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Status: offline 		Well, was it not China who got the bid on the Iraq oil fields last month?  At least our troops are there making sure the USA gets the chance to bid,.....oh wait no we didn't, the Iraqi government did not let us bid

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 7:23:56 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		supposedly there is 11 days of oil in Iraq.    That is not much.

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 9:28:13 AM   
AnimusRex


Posts: 2165
Joined: 5/13/2006
Status: offline 		People, please.

Look at the big picture here. The demand for natural resources is increasing at an accelerating rate. The world's most populous countries- China, India, Russia- are also the fastest growing economies.
They comprise over half the worl'd population, and their appetite for natural resources is expected to skyrocket as they chase after the American lifestyle- suburban homes, two gas guzzling cars, 4,000 calories per day, etc.

No one can pinpoint exactly when peak oil will be reached- but one thing is a verifyable fact- oil is a non-renewable resource, and we are currently consuming it at a rate of about 100 million barrels per day.
100 million barrels that are burned, spewing 100 million barrels worth of pollution into the same air that we all breathe. And if we discover more oil somewhere? We will burn it that much faster, since human appetites are infinite.

So the big picture here, is not to dream and fantasize about living in a world of cheap energy, but to act like adults and get serious about husbanding our resources and living responsibly.

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 9:33:29 AM   
housesub4you


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Status: offline 		What are you taking about?  The fields in western Iraq where China has the rights have oil to last a hell of a lot longer than 11 days.

plus, it is right under the surface (in drilling terms) and will only cost about $1.50 a barrel to to pump out, vrs the current cost of anywhere between $20 to $35 a barrel depending on where you are drilling.

So they got really cheap oil at the cost of US lives

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 9:45:54 AM   
pahunkboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: housesub4you

What are you taking about?  The fields in western Iraq where China has the rights have oil to last a hell of a lot longer than 11 days.

plus, it is right under the surface (in drilling terms) and will only cost about $1.50 a barrel to to pump out, vrs the current cost of anywhere between $20 to $35 a barrel depending on where you are drilling.

So they got really cheap oil at the cost of US lives



I thought 11 days sounded un-doable. 

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 10:18:51 AM   
luckydawg


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Status: offline 		The 11 days of oil (like the 6 months of oil in ANWR), is true if you examine the full statement. It is assuming that all energy useage in the world is oil, ie we assume that all Hydro, Natural Gas, Coal, and Nuclear (as well as the tiny amount of Solar and Wind) is oil and that it only comes from one place.

It is technically true, but meaningless.

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 12:35:22 PM   
SL4V3M4YB3


Posts: 3506
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From: S.E. London U.K.
Status: offline 		If it gives you an example of our energy demands and how much of it is unnecessary then how is it meaningless?

It's the question where do the next eleven days come from whilst pointing out some people will oppose green energy for whatever reason, mostly over romancing of the past; the days before anybody ever began to think energy could come from other sources.

I can't testify as to the accuracy of the eleven days of oil example stated however.


< Message edited by SL4V3M4YB3 -- 1/2/2010 12:39:42 PM >

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 1:04:45 PM   
Brain


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Joined: 2/14/2007
Status: offline 		It's not relevant because we need to stop using oil and start using sustainable resources like solar. We need to stop polluting the planet.

I saw a show about this either on the discovery channel or National Geographic and they said using a small lake about a mile wide and 50 feet deep you can supply the world with enough energy for a year, and apparently without pollution. I need to read more about this technology.


Hydrogen fusion power | Technology Futures

ITER is an international consortium that is planning to build a 500 megawatt fusion reactor by 2016. Fusion power is the holy grail of the energy industry because it uses relatively inexpensive fuel (hydrogen), creates little contaminated nuclear waste, and can generate large amounts of power.


Advanced engineering is underway, and one of the goals of the project is to use pre-qualified and off the shelf materials and components. The ITER fusion reactor will generate ten times more power than it needs to maintain the fusion reaction.


A usable fusion power plant would replace coal and oil power plants, and would have a dramatic impact on CO2 emissions, which may contribute to global warming. Fusion plants would also be pollution free. China, which uses a lot of coal that is causing pollution problems, is a partner in the project.

http://www.designnine.com/news/content/hydrogen-fusion-power

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 1:08:07 PM   
Fellow


Posts: 1486
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		Nobody knows for sure (the size of oil reserves is a secret or the data given by a country can not be trusted) but, I believe, we are at peak oil already. The price of oil has tripled in ten years and it is not just a sepulation (lot of speculative price has been cut off with economic crisis). I do not define peak as the output limit, the oil output rate can be significantly increased but with dramatic increase in production cost. The last makes it economically unsustainable. You can not trust what politically motivated "economists" tell you. Just look at the signs. The horroble (nature destroying) technologies have become profitable (oil sands for example).

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 7:09:22 PM   
luckydawg


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Status: offline 		I told you why it was meaningless, Slvemybe.

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/2/2010 11:40:53 PM   
Fellow


Posts: 1486
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		My comment was related to "peak oil". I say nothing how the situation will be economically resolved. It is commonly thought the (lagging) transition  to the other (more expensive) energy  sources will cause hard times economically, socially and internationally. There has been optimism about inexpensive nuclear energy for 70 years.  

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/3/2010 12:06:42 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		Brain, keep in mind that - we must explore all types of energy.  After all- can you really risk all eggs in one basket in 10 degree weather?

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/3/2010 6:51:24 AM   
SL4V3M4YB3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydawg
I told you why it was meaningless, Slvemybe.


You've actually got it back to front in my view because it is technically incorrect (as oil isn't the only energy source) but the example has stark meaning in terms of demonstrating how any oil field will not meet our energy demands alone if that is all we concentrate on developing. Only this year did global investment in green technology take over from that of non-renewable sources. This is a kind of travesty considering how long the problem of peak oil has been studied and demonstrates the very short-sighted profit orientated approach that blights the modern world.


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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/3/2010 7:33:19 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		Just a note.   Big oil does not like coal.     IMO- one can not put all eggs in one basket on this one.

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RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/3/2010 10:25:13 AM   
FatDomDaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

The known oil reserves in the US, and this includes the Alaskan fields, would last the US for fifty years. 


Shale oil reserves will last hundreds of years.


(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: IS there "peak oil"?, or no not yet. - 1/3/2010 10:30:10 AM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
Status: offline 		Until you you find out its going to wipe out the lake's silver spotted smelt and its green eyes toad fleas... then you'll be protesting.



quote:

ORIGINAL: Brain

It's not relevant because we need to stop using oil and start using sustainable resources like solar. We need to stop polluting the planet.

I saw a show about this either on the discovery channel or National Geographic and they said using a small lake about a mile wide and 50 feet deep you can supply the world with enough energy for a year, and apparently without pollution. I need to read more about this technology.


Hydrogen fusion power | Technology Futures

ITER is an international consortium that is planning to build a 500 megawatt fusion reactor by 2016. Fusion power is the holy grail of the energy industry because it uses relatively inexpensive fuel (hydrogen), creates little contaminated nuclear waste, and can generate large amounts of power.


Advanced engineering is underway, and one of the goals of the project is to use pre-qualified and off the shelf materials and components. The ITER fusion reactor will generate ten times more power than it needs to maintain the fusion reaction.


A usable fusion power plant would replace coal and oil power plants, and would have a dramatic impact on CO2 emissions, which may contribute to global warming. Fusion plants would also be pollution free. China, which uses a lot of coal that is causing pollution problems, is a partner in the project.

http://www.designnine.com/news/content/hydrogen-fusion-power


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Profile   Post #: 20
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