Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselves From Ugandan Anti-Gay Bill They Inspired

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Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselves Fr... - 1/4/2010 9:15:33 AM

Brain

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It’s bad enough they do a despicable thing like going over there and advocating the death penalty but now they don’t have the guts to defend or admit what they did. Why can’t they mind their own bloody business?

What an asshole this guy is.

But for his part, Don Schmierer says he feels "duped," and that he had "no idea some Ugandans were contemplating the death penalty for homosexuality" and that "some of the nicest people I have ever met are gay people."

Yes, surprise, surprise: you go off to Uganda to talk about how "the gay movement is an evil institution" and how they have an agenda of "defeat[ing] the marriage-based society" and somehow, people take this to mean that homosexuals should be killed or something. How terrible that things like this get misconstrued. Right, Scott Lively,
who said this on his website?

Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselves From Ugandan Anti-Gay Bill They Inspired

Ten months ago, three American evangelicals trooped off to Uganda and, using the power of their words, helped convince officials there to create the Anti-Homosexuality Bill of 2009, that would make it illegal -- and punishable by death -- to be gay. If you hang in long enough while reading today's New York Times article on the matter, the reporter eventually gets around to naming them!

The three Americans who spoke at the conference -- Scott Lively, a missionary who has written several books against homosexuality, including "7 Steps to Recruit-Proof Your Child"; Caleb Lee Brundidge, a self-described former gay man who leads "healing seminars"; and Don Schmierer, a board member of Exodus International, whose mission is "mobilizing the body of Christ to minister grace and truth to a world impacted by homosexuality" -- are now trying to distance themselves from the bill.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/01/04/anti-gay-evangelicals-att_n_410372.html

Post #: 1

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 9:20:26 AM

submittous

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Joined: 6/12/2004
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There had been an organized anti gay push in northern Colorado and Wyoming for a while and then Matthew Shepard was killed and hung on a barb wire fence and all those same churches were crying "it wans't us" ... but they sure played a part.

Same here.

_____________________________

"If you are lucky enough to find a way of life you love, you have to find the courage to live it." John Irving

(in reply to Brain)

Post #: 2

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 9:40:16 AM

Moonhead

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Joined: 9/21/2009
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Are you really surprised that the snivelling little cunts are trying to weasel out of taking any responsibility for this now?

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to submittous)

Post #: 3

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 9:45:42 AM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
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Brain, those people are Assholes!
On the other hand I really don't care what happens in "Uganda."
How much money are (they) trying to get out of us?

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"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to Brain)

Post #: 4

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 9:49:47 AM

Moonhead

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Joined: 9/21/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Brain, those people are Assholes!
On the other hand I really don't care what happens in "Uganda."
How much money are (they) trying to get out of us?

They're not. The Missionaries took a lot of money out of Uganda when they went back home, though. Presumably you're cool with that?

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 5

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 9:54:53 AM

PolyVinyl

Posts: 49
Joined: 7/28/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Brain, those people are Assholes!
On the other hand I really don't care what happens in "Uganda."
How much money are (they) trying to get out of us?

What...umm...does that mean?

(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 6

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 9:57:34 AM

Moonhead

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Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PolyVinyl

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Brain, those people are Assholes!
On the other hand I really don't care what happens in "Uganda."
How much money are (they) trying to get out of us?

What...umm...does that mean?

While a pretty smart guy, Popeye has this fixation with foreign aid and other fiscal contributions America makes outside of the country.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to PolyVinyl)

Post #: 7

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 10:49:00 AM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Brain, those people are Assholes!
On the other hand I really don't care what happens in "Uganda."
How much money are (they) trying to get out of us?

They're not. The Missionaries took a lot of money out of Uganda when they went back home, though. Presumably you're cool with that?

Moon, sorry but I just don't care one way or the other. I'm American not Ugandan.
And I don't have a "fixation" with foreign aid I just don't want my govt. involved in it for numerous reasons "corruption" being one of the major reasons.
We have people living under bridges in this country and returning Veterans can't get the help they need and our congress in this years budget voted for $45 Billion in "foreign aid" and that's up from $36 Billion last year! There's something *very wrong* with that picture!
If individuals want to give of their own funds fine, that's the way it should be done but when the lobbyists in D.C. are making billions from this you know there's a lot of corruption going on!

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to Moonhead)

Post #: 8

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 1:15:39 PM

Moonhead

Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Brain, those people are Assholes!
On the other hand I really don't care what happens in "Uganda."
How much money are (they) trying to get out of us?

They're not. The Missionaries took a lot of money out of Uganda when they went back home, though. Presumably you're cool with that?

Moon, sorry but I just don't care one way or the other. I'm American not Ugandan.
And I don't have a "fixation" with foreign aid I just don't want my govt. involved in it for numerous reasons "corruption" being one of the major reasons.
We have people living under bridges in this country and returning Veterans can't get the help they need and our congress in this years budget voted for $45 Billion in "foreign aid" and that's up from $36 Billion last year! There's something *very wrong* with that picture!
If individuals want to give of their own funds fine, that's the way it should be done but when the lobbyists in D.C. are making billions from this you know there's a lot of corruption going on!

No argument with any of that, but your government must be getting something out of it, or they wouldn't be doing it. I take it they're still threatening to cut off funding to countries that refuse to do as they're told?
My own feeling tends to be that if America does feel it can dictate other countries foreign policies, then it had better be offering them something in return, so I can't really share your indignation about the set up. Sorry.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 9

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 2:13:14 PM

Brain

Posts: 3792
Joined: 2/14/2007
Status: offline

I'm not surprised but it's not right to murder people just because they are gay. You would think if a person is religious they would have a conscious. Too bad they won't have to arrest anybody for murder because it's legal.

(in reply to Moonhead)

Post #: 10

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 2:37:06 PM

Moonhead

Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brain

I'm not surprised but it's not right to murder people just because they are gay. You would think if a person is religious they would have a conscious. Too bad they won't have to arrest anybody for murder because it's legal.

Er, when did I say otherwise? I get very annoyed when halfwits who don't have any problem with eating a non kosher diet, tattoos or pre marital sex start throwing shitfits about one bloody line of Leviticus that happens to back up their ugly little prejudices.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to Brain)

Post #: 11

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 2:42:08 PM

submittous

Posts: 345
Joined: 6/12/2004
Status: offline

Since at this point almost all of US foreign aid goes to military help and almost all of that means checks cut from the government to US corporations like Rayethon, Hallibuton etc the reason the government like to do it is payback to big contributors....

_____________________________

"If you are lucky enough to find a way of life you love, you have to find the courage to live it." John Irving

(in reply to Moonhead)

Post #: 12

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 2:47:38 PM

Moonhead

Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

Since at this point almost all of US foreign aid goes to military help and almost all of that means checks cut from the government to US corporations like Rayethon, Hallibuton etc the reason the government like to do it is payback to big contributors....

Ah. So they've stopped paying it to rich people in poor countries and are now paying it to war profiteers instead? I didn't realise that came under the foreign aid budget.
Still, at least popeye's fears about the money leaving the country are misguided, then.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to submittous)

Post #: 13

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 2:51:32 PM

Kirata

Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brain

It’s bad enough they do a despicable thing like going over there and advocating the death penalty but now they don’t have the guts to defend or admit what they did.

There is NO evidence, zip, nada, zero, that they have anywhere at any time advocated the death penalty for gays. Taking a look at the actual New York Times article, every bit of evidence suggests that the men are shocked and that they were used by anti-gay Africans.

"What these people have done is set the fire they can’t quench," said the Rev. Kapya Kaoma, a Zambian who went undercover for six months to chronicle the relationship between the African anti-homosexual movement and American evangelicals.

Mr. Kaoma was at the conference and said that the three Americans "underestimated the homophobia in Uganda" and "what it means to Africans when you speak about a certain group trying to destroy their children and their families...."

Many Africans view homosexuality as an immoral Western import, and the continent is full of harsh homophobic laws. In northern Nigeria, gay men can face death by stoning.

It's not a pretty story by anyone's standards, but neither is the way you just make shit up to jerk off to.

K.

(in reply to Brain)

Post #: 14

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 5:08:15 PM

submittous

Posts: 345
Joined: 6/12/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brain

It’s bad enough they do a despicable thing like going over there and advocating the death penalty but now they don’t have the guts to defend or admit what they did.

There is NO evidence, zip, nada, zero, that they have anywhere at any time advocated the death penalty for gays. Taking a look at the actual New York Times article, every bit of evidence suggests that the men are shocked and that they were used by anti-gay Africans.

"What these people have done is set the fire they can’t quench," said the Rev. Kapya Kaoma, a Zambian who went undercover for six months to chronicle the relationship between the African anti-homosexual movement and American evangelicals.

Mr. Kaoma was at the conference and said that the three Americans "underestimated the homophobia in Uganda" and "what it means to Africans when you speak about a certain group trying to destroy their children and their families...."

Many Africans view homosexuality as an immoral Western import, and the continent is full of harsh homophobic laws. In northern Nigeria, gay men can face death by stoning.

It's not a pretty story by anyone's standards, but neither is the way you just make shit up to jerk off to.

K.

Yea, and the preachers who said gays were an abomination and god hated them didn't actually say to beat Mathew Shepard to death.... so it's ok.

_____________________________

"If you are lucky enough to find a way of life you love, you have to find the courage to live it." John Irving

(in reply to Kirata)

Post #: 15

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 5:26:14 PM

Kirata

Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

Yea, and the preachers who said gays were an abomination and god hated them didn't actually say to beat Mathew Shepard to death.... so it's ok.

People say what they say, not what they don't say. I know that's probably tricky to get, but look at it like this: If I say, "fuck you," and some girl hears me and does, that wasn't what I meant.

K.

________________

edited to add:

Well shit, that wasn't exactly the brightest example of NOT saying something... lost a foot on that one.

< Message edited by Kirata -- 1/4/2010 6:15:12 PM >

(in reply to submittous)

Post #: 16

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 5:31:24 PM

submittous

Posts: 345
Joined: 6/12/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

Yea, and the preachers who said gays were an abomination and god hated them didn't actually say to beat Mathew Shepard to death.... so it's ok.

People say what they say, not what they don't say. I know that's probably tricky to get, but look at it like this: If I say, "fuck you," and some girl hears me and does, that wasn't what I meant.

K.

So are you saying no one is responsible for what they say?

_____________________________

"If you are lucky enough to find a way of life you love, you have to find the courage to live it." John Irving

(in reply to Kirata)

Post #: 17

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 5:44:50 PM

Kirata

Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

So are you saying no one is responsible for what they say?

I'm saying that the people who murder gays are the ones responsible for what they do, not some other guy. Look at all the crap that neo-Nazi's spew about Jews. You can say whatever you want. But if you go kill one, you're toast. That's the way it is. Freedom of speech is a horrible idea, except for every other one. So get used to it.

Yanno, some of these mentally defective preachers rant about abominations at the drop of a hat, and reel off long lists of things that "God hates." But if some day some fool decides to run out and kill an adulterer or a fornicator, I doubt anyone will hold Preacher Bob responsible because he said, "God hates them."

If you recall, however, what started this exchange was that Brain said those men went over there, "advocating the death penalty." There is zero evidence that they did any such thing, and my comments made no other point except that one. If you have a problem with him getting called for posting shit like that, we'll just have to disagree.

K.

< Message edited by Kirata -- 1/4/2010 6:39:31 PM >

(in reply to submittous)

Post #: 18

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 8:12:01 PM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
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At some point one is responsible for the inevitable conseuences of their words......intelligent people can certainly consider the end game involved when the ignorant are incited.
Free speech is a great thing.....so's responsibility towards the ultimate and predictable consequence of volitile and incendiary speech

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If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to Kirata)

Post #: 19

RE: Anti-Gay Evangelicals Attempt To Distance Themselve... - 1/4/2010 8:18:42 PM

tnai

Posts: 29
Joined: 9/6/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

At some point one is responsible for the inevitable conseuences of their words......intelligent people can certainly consider the end game involved when the ignorant are incited.
Free speech is a great thing.....so's responsibility towards the ultimate and predictable consequence of volitile and incendiary speech

If you tell someone that a building is on fire or that they are wanted for murder so they go into hiding sure. If you state your religious beliefs whatever they may be and someone goes even farther then you do I don't think a reasonable person can be held accountable for that.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 20

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