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RE: Unintentional sexism? - 1/31/2010 9:07:44 AM

omkfY

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

Feminizing a man is humiliating because it undermines his masculinity,

Feminization isn't my kink, but I've always imagined it like the above. It's 'humiliating' not because there is something inherently wrong with being a woman, but because one of the sub's most basic & ingrained of identities is being stripped away at the will of his Domme.

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RE: Unintentional sexism? - 1/31/2010 9:14:28 AM

LadyAngelika

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quote:

ORIGINAL: omkfY

quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

Feminizing a man is humiliating because it undermines his masculinity,

Feminization isn't my kink, but I've always imagined it like the above. It's 'humiliating' not because there is something inherently wrong with being a woman, but because one of the sub's most basic & ingrained of identities is being stripped away at the will of his Domme.

Both can be true. Everyone has their personal reasons for their kinks. Not everyone wants to be humiliated for the same reasons neither.

- LA

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RE: Unintentional sexism? - 1/31/2010 9:22:22 AM

DVsFox

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Or some people might not even be humiliated by it period. Feminization and humiliation do not necessarily go hand in hand.

DV's Fox

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RE: Unintentional sexism? - 1/31/2010 9:49:40 AM

LadyAngelika

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DVsFox

Or some people might not even be humiliated by it period. Feminization and humiliation do not necessarily go hand in hand.

DV's Fox

I agree with this. And I highlighted the post from Solange where she said exactly this. But I was addressing the issue of why feminization "would" be humiliating.

- LA

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RE: Unintentional sexism? - 1/31/2010 10:34:28 AM

DVsFox

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

quote:

ORIGINAL: DVsFox

Or some people might not even be humiliated by it period. Feminization and humiliation do not necessarily go hand in hand.

DV's Fox

I agree with this. And I highlighted the post from Solange where she said exactly this. But I was addressing the issue of why feminization "would" be humiliating.

- LA

Oh, I know, I was adding for reiteration purposes. :-p

DV's Fox

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RE: Unintentional sexism? - 1/31/2010 11:58:57 AM

LadyDelilahDeb

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Fast reply:

OP, I see the whole question you're asking as multi-faceted.
1. Most of the human race, for most of recorded history, was (and is) "sexist" in the way that you mean.
("It's a man's world" was a caption on a 1950s photo of me and a toddler cousin playing with a ball.)
2. Fetishes such as cross-dressing, being made over into a woman, or being "forced" to do anything (bearing in mind that the definition of WIITWD is consensual at the very least)—those are a mere handful, albeit commonplace fetishes, among the kinky population.
3. The definition of kink/fetish/WIITWD encompasses every possible variation of activities. ("Upside down in a dustbin full of bananas," anyone? I'm quoting from a 1960s novel.)
4. The skewed nature of written, photo, and video depictions (kinky porn) of such kinky fantasy fetishes, based on business models intended to appeal to those humans who want and can afford to purchase such depictions. Most often males.

In short, I think you're leaping after conclusions based on some limited evidence.
And just for the record, I'm one domina who does not have an interest in feminizing my subs. I allow them the option to cross-dress occasionally if that is a preference of theirs.

Lady Delilah Deb

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RE: Unintentional sexism? - 1/31/2010 1:03:29 PM

PeonForHer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lusciouslips19

As far as the Dommes doing it thinking women are inferior...I would say no. As far as Dommes thinking the sub sees it as so and uses that to her advantage....yes.

I think Dom/mes involved in mental play can take society mores and go against them to humiliate because of whats ingrained in us.

Heh. Cuts both ways. As a sub, I could happily go along with 'forced-feminisation' if I were to see that she, the Domme, believes that I'm feeling humiliated as a result of it.

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RE: Unintentional sexism? - 1/31/2010 1:59:09 PM

lusciouslips19

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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: lusciouslips19

As far as the Dommes doing it thinking women are inferior...I would say no. As far as Dommes thinking the sub sees it as so and uses that to her advantage....yes.

I think Dom/mes involved in mental play can take society mores and go against them to humiliate because of whats ingrained in us.

Heh. Cuts both ways. As a sub, I could happily go along with 'forced-feminisation' if I were to see that she, the Domme, believes that I'm feeling humiliated as a result of it.

Topping from the bottom......

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RE: Unintentional sexism? - 1/31/2010 2:00:17 PM

SubRoar

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucienne

There's an element of the OP that could be fairly considered as approval-seeking behavior.

Reading back over my initial post, it does seem a bit sycophantic. Truly, that was not my goal even if it came out that way. (To misquote Bronte "A sensible man ought to find enough approval in himself.") Nor am I a "feminist" of any stripe, if anything I'm a bit too glib in my criticisms.

And Diane, neither am I. (Not a fetish of mine.) And now that we've got the question I didn't ask out of the way, I think we can move on.

LadyDelilahDeb, I think you and others have made some good points. I'm not (despite what it may seem from my initial post.) Overly concerned about this. But nonetheless, I think it's good to bring these things up occasion to get some perspective. Nor was I trying to say that a persons kink isn't okay (that would be very hypocritical of me considering my own.)

Finally, DVsFox. I understand that cross-dressing and feminisation aren't always used for humiliation, and perhaps I should have clarified that. I was talking about a small subset rather then the whole.

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RE: Unintentional sexism? - 1/31/2010 3:29:42 PM

Andalusite

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I'm one of the women who is open to cross-dressers, but not "forced femme" partly for this reason. In general, though, verbal humiliation isn't one of my kinks. Plus, I don't view feminisation as humiliating, so I'd feel stupid and awkward saying things to indicate that I *did* feel that way, even though I didn't mean it. I do think it comes across as a bit condescending and sexist to *want* to be humiliated for being feminized. It's fun if the person wants it, but not if they don't, though I like other forms of "force" and resistance play.

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