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Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 4:37:19 AM   
RCdc


Posts: 8674
Status: offline 		Sir Terry Pratchett says he is ready to be a test case for assisted suicide "tribunals"

This is a main headliner in the UK today.  I was wondering how people felt about assisted suicide?  Would you commit it?  Would you ask someone to commit it?

the.dark.

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 4:47:42 AM   
ranja


Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline 		I think assisted suicide, euthanasia, should be an option for certain people

i would hate to commit it, but i would do it if required,
i would ask for it if i was so unfortunate to believe i needed that way out.

i think the UK has to be more lenient on this than it is at present

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 5:01:53 AM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		I've given a lot of thought to this, for many years and I believe we should have this option. It provides a way to end suffering that little can be done for relief in many area's. Often times, especially when one doesn't have the medical care they might need, they are ill and have all sorts of life struggles to deal with at the same time as a devestating illness. Quality of life doesn't seem to be of much worth when every moment of every day you are suffering in multiple ways.

Your basic options are to deal with it and watch as your life crumbles and maybe your isolation becomes even worse as people often leave your life and finding a way to end it on your own. Knowing many in this situation and my own limited version of it and spending years or hours depending on the situation trying to comfort people in this situation, we need more options. I was a part of a group of people who tried to help and we dealt with suicide situations at least twice a week. One day I asked myself, why am I trying to convince them to live when living is pure hell? Right now, most would have to take their own life and the means to do so could actually make things harder for them and trumatic for someone who finds them or has to clean them up and even publicity about it.

When you are ill you typically have this survival instinct that is very difficult to just stop having. Even when you mentally/emotionally know what is best, it is hard to actually take the steps to end your life in the ways you may have open to you, which isn't much that I would call easy to do or acceptable. It would be easier to just go to sleep rather than to shot yourself or stand in front of a train or jump off a cliff/whatever.

It is more humane in my opinion to give us safer options and choices that would be easier for others in our lives to handle as well as for us to actually do. It isn't easy making that choice and dealing with the hell of an illness slowly taking you out and all that comes with it and adding how to stop it in a controlled spin, ought to be a bit easier on people who already have it too rough.

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 5:04:03 AM   
maybemaybenot


Posts: 2817
Joined: 9/22/2005
Status: offline 		I am opposed to assisted suicide. Having said that I am totally in favor of terminal sedation aka palliative sedation. I am a hospice nurse and have had patients request this and have paticipated in it. My own Father was in a horrific fire last spring, the only part of his body not 2nd or 3rd degree burned was from his nose up. After 3 days, I requested he be terminally sedated. I was his health care proxy and he and I had discussed this option many times, and it was what he wanted in certain circumstances. The Burn surgeon and MD had a family meeting with my Mother and siblings and I and we discussed it and they would not do it, unless the entire family agreed. Which they did. They removed his life support and gave hhim the appropriate medications, he died peacefully 8 hours later.

Some may see this as euthanasia, but I do not. I am of a similar mind to Dr. Ira Byock in the link below.

http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1724911,00.html

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 5:04:07 AM   
Level


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Status: offline 		I tend to think it should be an option; very difficult topic, in a number of ways.

*waves to the dark beauty*

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 5:40:31 AM   
Louve00


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Status: offline 		Yes, it is a difficult topic.  I can understand why it could/should/would be warranted for some circumstances.  But I do have concerns over some aspects (or the aspect of abusing this issue) if it were made an option that was easy to carry out. 

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 6:35:43 AM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc
I was wondering how people felt about assisted suicide?  Would you commit it?  Would you ask someone to commit it?

It is a complex situation.

If I was suffering from dementia, or was having a terminal disease in its final stages, or a dehumanizing disease, I would consult with my relatives and friends and ask them to bring me to the sea and swim towards Iceland.
Alternatively, I would like to be dispatched by either a soldier, or a psychopath or a friend.

I most certainly do not want to be subjected to the inhumane conditions that prevail in hospitals and nursing homes. I would rather die in the gutter.

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 6:41:41 AM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		The problem with dementia is that if you are too far gone, you can't make that choice whether offically or on your own and anyone who takes part, even by taking you to do your will, could have legal ramifications. If you know the dementia is coming and is going to get worse and how soon... that is the time to do it, if that is what you want. While you are still in your right mind.

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 6:54:49 AM   
Rule


Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline 		Quite.

I think that principle should be abolished. If one is no longer capable of deciding for oneself, then both the relatives and if necessary a judge should decide for the afflicted party.

In the absence of that, one can only hope for either Divine intervention, or the mercy of a psychopath (who may act as an instrument of Divine intervention).

< Message edited by Rule -- 2/1/2010 6:55:23 AM >

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 6:59:29 AM   
LaTigresse


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Status: offline 		I have no problem with it at all. I have no religious beliefs that make it 'wrong' and I would prefer to make that decision before I become a burden on the people I love most. Barring an earlier surprise, I hope I am able to make that choice prior to forcing my family to decide what to do with mom/grandma.

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 7:03:37 AM   
RCdc


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

I have no problem with it at all. I have no religious beliefs that make it 'wrong' and I would prefer to make that decision before I become a burden on the people I love most. Barring an earlier surprise, I hope I am able to make that choice prior to forcing my family to decide what to do with mom/grandma.


Your post made me question - 'why do people not talk about it in advance'.
I know that we have sat down and voiced our opinion as a family on what should be done should the unforseen occur.  I don't really see it as any different from being an organ donor and holding the card.  Is it because people find it too depressing?  Unfortunately it happens that we don't always get to grow old gracefully or even know how long we have until we make that decision.

the.dark.

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 7:04:45 AM   
RCdc


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Level
*waves to the dark beauty*


Twirls and waves to MrLevel

the.dark.

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 7:21:10 AM   
LaTigresse


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

I have no problem with it at all. I have no religious beliefs that make it 'wrong' and I would prefer to make that decision before I become a burden on the people I love most. Barring an earlier surprise, I hope I am able to make that choice prior to forcing my family to decide what to do with mom/grandma.


Your post made me question - 'why do people not talk about it in advance'.
I know that we have sat down and voiced our opinion as a family on what should be done should the unforseen occur.  I don't really see it as any different from being an organ donor and holding the card.  Is it because people find it too depressing?  Unfortunately it happens that we don't always get to grow old gracefully or even know how long we have until we make that decision.

the.dark.


I cannot say for everyone everywhere but I know it has been my life experience that the time nearer death is almost taboo to discuss with most people. It is as though people are so afraid of it, that not discussing it will keep it from happening. Granted I don't want it to happen tomorrow, my to-do list is still way too long, but it's certainly not something I am afraid of. For me, death is just part of the cycle of life, not some horrible scary end.

I hate the way death is dealt with. The cold, removed, way it's handled. The importance placed on preserving the remains. The ridiculous amount of money wasted on it. The sacrilege of laughter and fun at a funeral or wake. The expectations of what it all should be. How unprepared we are in all ways, that are most important.


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My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 7:36:04 AM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

If one is no longer capable of deciding for oneself, then both the relatives and if necessary a judge should decide for the afflicted party.



What a wonderful way to open the door to all sorts of abuse: genius  .

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 7:39:13 AM   
RCdc


Posts: 8674
Status: offline 		My personal experience is pretty much the same as you have described - thanks for your thoughts LaTigresse.
I really have a hard time seeing death as such a negative thing.

the.dark.

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love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 7:51:09 AM   
Phoenixpower


Posts: 8098
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

I have no problem with it at all. I have no religious beliefs that make it 'wrong' and I would prefer to make that decision before I become a burden on the people I love most. Barring an earlier surprise, I hope I am able to make that choice prior to forcing my family to decide what to do with mom/grandma.


Your post made me question - 'why do people not talk about it in advance'.
I know that we have sat down and voiced our opinion as a family on what should be done should the unforseen occur.  I don't really see it as any different from being an organ donor and holding the card.  Is it because people find it too depressing?  Unfortunately it happens that we don't always get to grow old gracefully or even know how long we have until we make that decision.

the.dark.


That being said, sometimes people do talk about it in advance but their family might not necessarily get it.

In my case, I think it triggered it when my auntie died when I was 13 or my own car accident, however, I make clear since childhood that I would not want to be buried the "normal way", I would want to be burned...and then buried as ashes...now...looking at my family...I doubt that this would happen simply as they are the most awful listeners I know

So sometimes its not only the issue that people might avoid to talk about it but also others might avoid listen to it.

I already realise it here even in regards to pets.

I live near a main road, not directly on it...but not really far away from it either. Back hom I felt being further away from the main road, nevertheless a few of my cats got run over.

Now, when I got my cats I dared to mention to a so called friend "well, lets wait and see how many cats I will still have once I am going to relocate" (as her concern was taking cats abroad)...gosh she went mad at me, how dare I to think like that...

well...I simply prefer to be realistic that this "can" happen near a mainroad...and prefer to be mentally prepared for it then to live in my denial bubble of reality that this will never ever happen...

or on another occassion a person we both knew from work, with down syndrom and other medical problems, was poorly and she was in her 60s...i dared again - meaning it neutrally - to mention that this age is already rather old for people with down syndrom and looked it up how old they used to get 1 or 2 decades ago.... needless to say...she went mad at me again...

so even when you think about it and express your view, or when you give neutral facts about that aspect of life in regards to pets and other people...there are people out there who prefer to live in denial about that aspect of life and simply don't wanna hear it.

apart from that I do agree to that view:

quote:


I think assisted suicide, euthanasia, should be an option for certain people
i would hate to commit it, but i would do it if required,
i would ask for it if i was so unfortunate to believe i needed that way out.






< Message edited by Phoenixpower -- 2/1/2010 7:55:03 AM >

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The PAST is history, the FUTURE a mystery, NOW is a gift - that's why it's called the PRESENT

www.butyoudontlooksick.com/navigation/BYDLS-TheSpoonTheory.pdf

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 7:53:57 AM   
Rule


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Joined: 12/5/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule
If one is no longer capable of deciding for oneself, then both the relatives and if necessary a judge should decide for the afflicted party.

What a wonderful way to open the door to all sorts of abuse: genius  .

So qualify yourself as a judge.

(in reply to kittinSol)
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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 8:14:13 AM   
Domin8tingUrDrmz


Posts: 1269
Joined: 4/8/2006
From: Portland Metro, Oregon
Status: offline 		One could always write up a living will while in their sane mind. In such a will add to it that if euthanasia or some form of euthanasia becomes available and they suffer any conditions that warrant euthanasia that their life be ended peacefully. That would be far safer than relying on others to make decisions for oneself.

I am all for death with dignity. For the person suffering, and even their family, it allows the pain to end. Financially, it relieves the burden of expensive ongoing medical bills from taxpayers and the family if the one suffering has no insurance. Some people may think it's terrible to suggest ending one's life due to medical expenses (and I would agree if that were the sole reason). In my opinion, if I were suffering a terminal illness I'd rather my life be ended than for my children, grandchildren, s/o or anyone else be burdened with the medical costs of keeping me alive long after my natural death.

EFT

< Message edited by Domin8tingUrDrmz -- 2/1/2010 8:15:03 AM >

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 8:15:55 AM   
susie


Posts: 1699
Joined: 11/21/2004
Status: offline 		When I was diagnosed with my brain tumour, I was told that there was nothing that could be done and I was given around 6 months. At the time my partner, parents and myself discussed my "future" including the possibilty of going to the clinic in Switzerland where assisted suicide is performed. We all agreed that was the best option if the signs were that I would suffer too much. Luckily I saw a surgeon who was able to remove the tumour and with follow up treatment at the moment things are looking good.

As the brain tumour was a secondary cancer there is a chance that I will suffer some sort of recurrence in the future and those discussions on my treatment still stand. Knowing that we have all discussed it upfront and everyone is clear on what would happen has made everything much easier to cope with.

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RE: Assisted Sucide - 2/1/2010 8:43:45 AM   
CarrieO


Posts: 2432
Joined: 1/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

I have no problem with it at all. I have no religious beliefs that make it 'wrong' and I would prefer to make that decision before I become a burden on the people I love most. Barring an earlier surprise, I hope I am able to make that choice prior to forcing my family to decide what to do with mom/grandma.


Your post made me question - 'why do people not talk about it in advance'.
I know that we have sat down and voiced our opinion as a family on what should be done should the unforseen occur.  I don't really see it as any different from being an organ donor and holding the card.  Is it because people find it too depressing?  Unfortunately it happens that we don't always get to grow old gracefully or even know how long we have until we make that decision.

the.dark.


Very good point.  I've discussed this option with those closest to me.  I've also had this discussion with my surviving parent who has been very clear in her wishes. 

I see death as just another step on the road.  I've dealt with the death of close family members and, given my mom's age and circumstances, I see myself dealing with these kind of issues in the near future. 

I do feel it should be a legal option but I fear that would open the door to a whole host of problems and misuse. I'm not sure how to go about the legalization of this.  I also agree with LaTigresse in the way we handle death and the taboos surrounding it.  We've (society in general) taken the reality out of so many commonplace things...sex, birth, death...and made them negative, wrong, inappropriate conversation topics and a sin, it's no wonder people aren't as open to talking about it (death).

Thank you for sharing the BBC link.  "It seems sensible to me that we should look to the medical profession, that over the centuries has helped us to live longer and healthier lives, to help us die peacefully among our loved ones in our own home without a long stay in God's waiting room," Sir Terry said."  He does have a point.  I'll be curious to what else comes of this.

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