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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 8:26:52 PM   
LadyAngelika


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger

Do you ever come here and start a dialogue with someone-and that it has nothing to do with what you actually commented on? It's like some obscene thing where you say "The sun is shining,it makes me happy"

And they reply "You really have to do something about your fixation with super-novas-have you considered seeking therapy?"


Are you asking me this personally or to the board? I'm not sure as you replied to me in response to something I wrote.

I don't think I ever got such an out in left field response to my questions, though I have had people completely rip my head off because they misinterpreted my comments and chose to assume the worst.

Is that what you mean?

- LA


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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 8:29:00 PM   
Smutmonger


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See how it feels?

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger

Do you ever come here and start a dialogue with someone-and that it has nothing to do with what you actually commented on? It's like some obscene thing where you say "The sun is shining,it makes me happy"

And they reply "You really have to do something about your fixation with super-novas-have you considered seeking therapy?"


Are you asking me this personally or to the board? I'm not sure as you replied to me in response to something I wrote.

I don't think I ever got such an out in left field response to my questions, though I have had people completely rip my head off because they misinterpreted my comments and chose to assume the worst.

Is that what you mean?

- LA



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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 8:29:45 PM   
LadyAngelika


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Status: offline 		I'm actually not sure what you are trying to prove to me Smutmonger...

I've had a loooooooong day. You might have to spell it out. ;-)

- LA

< Message edited by LadyAngelika -- 2/23/2010 8:30:28 PM >

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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 8:31:22 PM   
Smutmonger


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Status: offline 		The disconnect when people refuse to stay on topic-and begin feeding thier little gripes and fantasies in.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

I'm actually not sure what you are trying to prove to me Smutmonger...

I've had a loooooooong day. You might have to spell it out. ;-)

- LA


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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 8:51:32 PM   
LadyAngelika


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger

The disconnect when people refuse to stay on topic-and begin feeding thier little gripes and fantasies in.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

I'm actually not sure what you are trying to prove to me Smutmonger...

I've had a loooooooong day. You might have to spell it out. ;-)

- LA




Well yes. There are many reasons to get off topic. I have done it myself sometimes. Sometimes it was a natural flow away from the convesation and sometimes I admit, it was pure silliness.

However, I will say that I'm trying to find the link between getting off topic and what you address in the OP.

Are you getting off your own topic? ;-)

- LA


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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 8:55:08 PM   
lucylucy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger
Do you ever come here and start a dialogue with someone-and that it has nothing to do with what you actually commented on? It's like some obscene thing where you say "The sun is shining,it makes me happy"

And they reply "You really have to do something about your fixation with super-novas-have you considered seeking therapy?"

You've nailed it! That's exactly how some of these discussions go. It can be comical but it can also make me want to tear my hair out. Many posters seem convinced that everyone else is sick and in an unhealthy relationship, and no matter what the original poster says about how that's not true, it's taken as evidence that things are really, really bad and the original poster is in deep denial.

< Message edited by lucylucy -- 2/23/2010 8:56:08 PM >

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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 8:58:26 PM   
LadyAngelika


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lucylucy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger
Do you ever come here and start a dialogue with someone-and that it has nothing to do with what you actually commented on? It's like some obscene thing where you say "The sun is shining,it makes me happy"

And they reply "You really have to do something about your fixation with super-novas-have you considered seeking therapy?"

You've nailed it! That's exactly how some of these discussions go. It can be comical but it can also make me want to tear my hair out. Many posters seem convinced that everyone else is sick and in an unhealthy relationship, and no matter what the original poster says about how that's not true, it's taken as evidence that things are really, really bad and the original poster is in deep denial.


lucy, when I see people doing that, I assume it is saying more about the analyst and their need to analyse everyone than the one being analysed.

I have learned to just respond "I guess if that's how you've decided you are going to see me, not much I can do about it. I know those near and dear to me know different." and then I invoke that oh so lovely little CM feature called Hide. :-)

- LA


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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 9:05:35 PM   
Smutmonger


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Status: offline 		The analysts never seem to be able to self analyze-sort of like the insane shrink-too funny!


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika


quote:

ORIGINAL: lucylucy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger
Do you ever come here and start a dialogue with someone-and that it has nothing to do with what you actually commented on? It's like some obscene thing where you say "The sun is shining,it makes me happy"

And they reply "You really have to do something about your fixation with super-novas-have you considered seeking therapy?"

You've nailed it! That's exactly how some of these discussions go. It can be comical but it can also make me want to tear my hair out. Many posters seem convinced that everyone else is sick and in an unhealthy relationship, and no matter what the original poster says about how that's not true, it's taken as evidence that things are really, really bad and the original poster is in deep denial.


lucy, when I see people doing that, I assume it is saying more about the analyst and their need to analyse everyone than the one being analysed.

I have learned to just respond "I guess if that's how you've decided you are going to see me, not much I can do about it. I know those near and dear to me know different." and then I invoke that oh so lovely little CM feature called Hide. :-)

- LA



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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 9:05:36 PM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

I'm actually not sure what you are trying to prove to me Smutmonger...

I've had a loooooooong day. You might have to spell it out. ;-)

- LA


He was posting on another thread some "egocentric" stuff in the submissive forum because we read a post that the submissive entitled "getting through rough patches with self-esteem intact". Some of us read a certain tone in her post, which was extremely short.. perhaps this thread is related to that one? I do not know for sure, but since there is the same "egocentric" comment, I am thinking perhaps it is... could be wrong...

I will only say, if I made a really short thread about low self esteem and others interpreted my statement about suffering from low self esteem in the context of my relationship.. well if I did not intend to make a statement about my self worth, perhaps I would have selected a different set of words...

Words have meaning, and when people interpret your words as meaning something that the dictionary and other sources state is a valid way of interpreting them.. well if that isn't what you mean you should clarify your meaning and not blame the other people for taking a valid interpretation of your words... Instead this person got really defensive about her relationship...

Now I think the OP in this case thinks that we interpreted her through our own experience.. he is right, I have nothing but my own experience as to interpret words like "self esteem", because when I discuss self esteem it means "self worth"....

Words are wispy things, selecting the ones that will communicate what we want is a rather tricky business, which is why it is better to clarify your meaning than get bent because someone else has a different dictionary than you do..

Just me, etc



< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 2/23/2010 9:06:47 PM >

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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 9:15:17 PM   
lucylucy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania
Words have meaning, and when people interpret your words as meaning something that the dictionary and other sources state is a valid way of interpreting them.. well if that isn't what you mean you should clarify your meaning and not blame the other people for taking a valid interpretation of your words... Instead this person got really defensive about her relationship...

I agree that people often don't word their posts (and responses) as precisely as they should. I've been guilty of that myself and I teach English, for crying out loud and should be more careful. But it happens. And while I will argue that words do matter and that precision does matter, I also think that context matters tremendously, and in a forum like this, where most people aren't professional writers, it just doesn't make sense to me to argue about whether the OP used the perfect words. If a poster says he or she didn't mean what I think their words mean, I try to take them at their word and say, ok, well, here's why I misunderstood . . . but I don't argue with them about whether their words reveal deep, dark conflicts in their relationship.

_____________________________

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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 9:24:21 PM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lucylucy

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania
Words have meaning, and when people interpret your words as meaning something that the dictionary and other sources state is a valid way of interpreting them.. well if that isn't what you mean you should clarify your meaning and not blame the other people for taking a valid interpretation of your words... Instead this person got really defensive about her relationship...

I agree that people often don't word their posts (and responses) as precisely as they should. I've been guilty of that myself and I teach English, for crying out loud and should be more careful. But it happens. And while I will argue that words do matter and that precision does matter, I also think that context matters tremendously, and in a forum like this, where most people aren't professional writers, it just doesn't make sense to me to argue about whether the OP used the perfect words. If a poster says he or she didn't mean what I think their words mean, I try to take them at their word and say, ok, well, here's why I misunderstood . . . but I don't argue with them about whether their words reveal deep, dark conflicts in their relationship.


Like I said in that thread, if she is happy she is free to discount my reply, but I still do not understand her getting huffy over well meant replies based upon the basis of what she wrote. My interpretation was not over the top, and I am more than happy to concede I do not know fuck-all about her life, she is her own personal expert... but reading her post with the interpretation that I did was not anymore "egocentric" than anything the OPer of this thread has ever written.. .objectivity... how can we be objective when there are multiple interpretations with the ones we select being based upon our own personal experiences.. it can really be no other way. But yanno, I am turning out to be a post modernist lil bitch..lol


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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 9:27:58 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline 		I know that when I start an OP, I come here with my half formed ideas. I'm notorious for not using the right words sometimes. Some of it is a language issue but more often than not, is due to the fact that they are half formed ideas and I don't have the right words to explain them.

I always appreciate when people I'm discussing with (not arguing with) give me the opportunity to revit my OP without judgement. It is a sign of maturity in my opinion.

- LA




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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 10:13:36 PM   
stella41b


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From: SW London (UK)
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger

I always find this to be an interesting topic. In a community that seems to express so much about relevant communication-and can't even seem to process the more clear posts here in objective terms?

Instead,I seem to see a large number of repetitive posts that have to do with "Interpeting this with how I would feel in that situation." Which does no good as advice.

It sort of cues me to why so many D/s relatioships fall into ruin in such a short period of time. How can you possibly understand where another person is coming from-if they HAVE to be the same as you?


In order to reach any sort of conclusion you have to employ either deductive reasoning (drawn from an underlying principle) or inductive reasoning (drawn from a specific example or a consensus of specific examples). Go through any thread here on these boards and you will find examples of both.

I'm of the opinion that you cannot get to know anyone on any sort of level until you start directly interacting with them, and going by their profiles and what they post can only at best give you a very superficial knowledge of that poster and their life. Also in any thread or posting even with the best will you are only getting one interpretation of any situation which is being presented and all you can basically do is to take whatever is written at face value. Unless of course you know the person more intimately.

The 'this is what I would do/think/feel in your situation' to me is nothing more than providing a hypothetical example from which the original poster can infer whatever they need or wish to through comparison and contrasting themselves with the person offering the advice. Some posters may have experienced similar situations in their lives and will be able to relate in that way, others may offer an opinion from simply imagining that they are in that situation and putting themselves in the position of the other poster.

Sometimes you do get chorus members from the Collarme hit musical Therapy! who feel that this is the answer, but often I just kind of assume that in many cases a well-meaning friend would suffice, if there was one available to talk to at that particular time. This follows that the person is coming to the boards because they don't have such a friend available, prepared to understand, or that they need further information, reassurance, validation, or even attention.

Community or not, we are all individuals, we all walk our own paths through life and we all have our own individual and unique experiences which can be shared for the benefit of others, and I don't quite see where people are assuming that the original poster is the same as them, or indeed in any way similar.

But then again, I'm not the OP.


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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 10:18:41 PM   
Smutmonger


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Status: offline 		The problem being-that one must seek clarification-rather than assumptions.

Denial of having made an incorrect assumption-and then seeking to cover your embarrassment at being WRONG in your deductions..by attempting to make it seem the origional posters "mistake" is the silliest thing imaginable.

Were I do do this with a partner-I think she would soon leave, out of pure frustration with my pig-headed stupidity.

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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 10:29:12 PM   
juliaoceania


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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger

The problem being-that one must seek clarification-rather than assumptions.

Denial of having made an incorrect assumption-and then seeking to cover your embarrassment at being WRONG in your deductions..by attempting to make it seem the origional posters "mistake" is the silliest thing imaginable.

Were I do do this with a partner-I think she would soon leave, out of pure frustration with my pig-headed stupidity.



You know, pigheadedness abounds in all sorts of forms, even those who insist they are the purveyors of objectivity and have perfected the non-egocentric method of reading internet message boards....


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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 10:45:21 PM   
stella41b


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From: SW London (UK)
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger

The problem being-that one must seek clarification-rather than assumptions.

Denial of having made an incorrect assumption-and then seeking to cover your embarrassment at being WRONG in your deductions..by attempting to make it seem the origional posters "mistake" is the silliest thing imaginable.

Were I do do this with a partner-I think she would soon leave, out of pure frustration with my pig-headed stupidity.


Are you referring to me personally here?


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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/23/2010 11:06:40 PM   
Whiplashsmile4


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Status: offline 		You're forgetting about the threads that get started from the "It's all about me" perspective. The ones that don't present any questions, provoke any thought, nor are asking for any input by other users. Why? Because it's all about them.

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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/24/2010 12:11:52 AM   
Smutmonger


Posts: 995
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quote:

ORIGINAL: stella41b

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger

The problem being-that one must seek clarification-rather than assumptions.

Denial of having made an incorrect assumption-and then seeking to cover your embarrassment at being WRONG in your deductions..by attempting to make it seem the origional posters "mistake" is the silliest thing imaginable.

Were I do do this with a partner-I think she would soon leave, out of pure frustration with my pig-headed stupidity.


Are you referring to me personally here?



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Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/24/2010 12:13:01 AM   
Smutmonger


Posts: 995
Joined: 2/17/2010
Status: offline 		I never admitted to godlike perfection.

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger

The problem being-that one must seek clarification-rather than assumptions.

Denial of having made an incorrect assumption-and then seeking to cover your embarrassment at being WRONG in your deductions..by attempting to make it seem the origional posters "mistake" is the silliest thing imaginable.

Were I do do this with a partner-I think she would soon leave, out of pure frustration with my pig-headed stupidity.



You know, pigheadedness abounds in all sorts of forms, even those who insist they are the purveyors of objectivity and have perfected the non-egocentric method of reading internet message boards....



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RE: Communication,vs "it's all about me" - 2/24/2010 12:33:51 AM   
stella41b


Posts: 4258
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From: SW London (UK)
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger

no.
quote:

ORIGINAL: stella41b

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger

The problem being-that one must seek clarification-rather than assumptions.

Denial of having made an incorrect assumption-and then seeking to cover your embarrassment at being WRONG in your deductions..by attempting to make it seem the origional posters "mistake" is the silliest thing imaginable.

Were I do do this with a partner-I think she would soon leave, out of pure frustration with my pig-headed stupidity.


Are you referring to me personally here?





Ah okay, as the context wasn't exactly clear to me which is why I was asking.

The thing is on a message board you get all sorts of people - it's the Internet - and people come here from all sorts of backgrounds. Among those you will find some that project their own emotional take into whatever they post. It's unfortunate, but so are many other things, this isn't a perfect world we live in.

However much of the advice that's offered on these boards by its very nature does tend to be rather superficial, and that's often because we are often not sure how much information the person is prepared to give out on a public message board. Sometimes it can be dealt with in more detail by going over to the other side and entering into some sort of correspondence to find out more in private.

Personally I wouldn't trouble the boards with something that is really personal but instead turn to someone I know and seek their advice privately. However there are times when I need a consensus of different opinions and in this aspect I've found these boards here to be among the best you can find on the Internet.

Just my 0.02


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