Where does it end uh part 2 :)

Where does it end uh part 2 :) (Full Version)

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ownedbyPF -> Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 7:38:04 AM)
Okay there is another thread in the Ask Submissives/Slaves called where does it end? It meant literally, the relationship. However it made me think of these questions, which I personally found a little more interesting. I think a more interesting question would be at what point did you realize you no longer defined your slavery? Was it a particular moment? When did you realize that your ideas of how you thought it would be were gone, that he/she had really and truly completely taken over defining what was and how it would be? For Doms/Dommes I'd ask the same in reverse, when did you know they were no longer defining their submission/slavery? Was it a slow process? Was it established almost immediately? Was it calculated? If that hasn't happened, why hasn't it? And do you wish it would? Now I know people like it when the person asking also answers, and I will, but I have to go right right riiiiiight now, so I'll come back with my answers later :) ~s

DarkSteven -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 7:46:36 AM)
Could be two different things. It could be that you want the relationship with that person to end, or it could be that you wanted the relationship to stay, but to be done on a different basis.

Mercnbeth -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 7:52:54 AM)
quote: at what point did you realize you no longer defined your slavery? from the beginning. this slave thought what she had to offer was called submission. HE defined it as slavery.

kyraofMists -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 8:01:49 AM)
I was very lucky in so many ways. I didn't have preconcieved ideas of how it should be. I was brand new to researching this type of relationship and I met him on my first day in a chat room. I had no desire to be a slave, no desire to be poly (didn't even know what that was at the time) and I was only interested in a little slap and tickle. I was definitely not looking for a sadist. What drew me was the idea that I didn't have to hold back who I was and that I could give everything of myself to a relationship. From the very beginning he defined my slavery to him and he defined our relationship to each other. I made sure he was a person with the character that I could admire and I decided to follow where he led. Fast forward over five years and I am happily living in a poly relationship with a sadist who has complete authority over my entire life. Knight's Kyra

lovingpet -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 8:03:51 AM)
I've discussed this before and I like discussing it again and again because it is something that doesn't always get considered. Everything changed for me within the first couple communications. I pretty much was never in control of any of it from the very beginning. He wasn't even REMOTELY what I was looking for. He didn't want the kind of dynamic I thought I wanted. He was into stuff that I placed as hard limits and darn well meant it too. Distance was an issue. I didn't even like his screename because it used text speak and bdsm'y stuff. Still I was drawn. He asked about my limits and what I was looking for and I told him. He responded that, no, that won't do and reworked all of it. I looked at it completely appalled. I made it clear I was appalled too. He decided a demonstration was in order, nothing too extreme and not even real, just online roleplay. Don't you know I slipped right into what I had been railing against only moments before? I was shocked and it was hard to process it all. That was when I knew that, if I stayed, I had no control at all and this was going to lead exactly where he wanted it to go. Realizing what that path is exactly and such has come over time. I have watched a lot of things slip away one by one and I have seen him place new things upon me as well. There never has been a doubt about who was in charge, but I am learning even the pace and the methods are not mine to have a say over either. For me it has been both. The first realization was a bolt of lightning and is why he is who he is to me. The rest has come over time and the understanding has slowly sunk in. I am sure along the way my understanding will deepen and I will feel his grip tighten even more. It took that initial jolt to get my attention. The rest is just a deepening of what I already know. lovingpet

ownedbyPF -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 10:21:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DarkSteven Could be two different things. It could be that you want the relationship with that person to end, or it could be that you wanted the relationship to stay, but to be done on a different basis. Would you mind expounding on this DarkSteven? I know I'm not always quick on the uptake, forgive me, but I don't have a clear understanding of what you mean. ~s

ownedbyPF -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 10:30:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth quote: at what point did you realize you no longer defined your slavery? from the beginning. this slave thought what she had to offer was called submission. HE defined it as slavery. From what I've seen you both write it seems like it worked out quite well :) Thank you for replying. I guess my question would be, at what point did you realize that he was going to define it for you though? You know that moment when you realized that any preconceived ideas you had simply didn't matter/apply? Did that make sense? ~s

antinomy -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 10:36:16 AM)
I really liked your post, lovingpet....it sort of reminded me of another I read this morning about never saying never. Good stuff all around. Your right, it does not always get considered, and I got what you were saying the other day, about not having much of a 'choice' in where you ended up; I, too, have experienced that in the past. It was an amazing thing.

ownedbyPF -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 10:39:36 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kyraofMists I was very lucky in so many ways. I didn't have preconcieved ideas of how it should be. I was brand new to researching this type of relationship and I met him on my first day in a chat room. I had no desire to be a slave, no desire to be poly (didn't even know what that was at the time) and I was only interested in a little slap and tickle. I was definitely not looking for a sadist. What drew me was the idea that I didn't have to hold back who I was and that I could give everything of myself to a relationship. From the very beginning he defined my slavery to him and he defined our relationship to each other. I made sure he was a person with the character that I could admire and I decided to follow where he led. Fast forward over five years and I am happily living in a poly relationship with a sadist who has complete authority over my entire life. Knight's Kyra Oh my gosh, your first day? That's amazing and wonderful! I bolded those parts because I absolutely identify with them! I had always felt like I had to hold pieces back, and that I had to be smarter, or stronger, or whatever was expected of me. Not with him though, with him I could give everything I had and be exactly who I was. We talked three times online, went on a date, and by the end of the night he was completely in control of where we were going and how we were getting there. Like you, on one hand I was being directed, on the other I could still see clearly enough to make sure he was the kind of Man that I could respect, admire, and look up to... that I could trust... the more I got that he was, the more he sort of just swallowed me up. Three years later and I am happily living with a sadist who has complete authority over my entire life :) Thank you for answerring! ~s

Mercnbeth -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 10:48:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ownedbyPF quote: ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth quote: at what point did you realize you no longer defined your slavery? from the beginning. this slave thought what she had to offer was called submission. HE defined it as slavery. From what I've seen you both write it seems like it worked out quite well :) Thank you for replying. I guess my question would be, at what point did you realize that he was going to define it for you though? You know that moment when you realized that any preconceived ideas you had simply didn't matter/apply? Did that make sense? ~s this slave has always operated under the assumption that the other party in any encounter/relationship would be the one defining our encounter/relationship. it's just the way she is. upon discovering that M/s and D/s relationship constructs exist and are desired by some, she actually thought that is what submission meant...until she was introduced to places like this message board, where the majority of folks perceive and define submission in an entirely different way than what resonates for this slave.

ownedbyPF -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 10:49:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lovingpet I've discussed this before and I like discussing it again and again because it is something that doesn't always get considered. Everything changed for me within the first couple communications. I pretty much was never in control of any of it from the very beginning. He wasn't even REMOTELY what I was looking for. He didn't want the kind of dynamic I thought I wanted. He was into stuff that I placed as hard limits and darn well meant it too. Distance was an issue. I didn't even like his screename because it used text speak and bdsm'y stuff. Still I was drawn. He asked about my limits and what I was looking for and I told him. He responded that, no, that won't do and reworked all of it. I looked at it completely appalled. I made it clear I was appalled too. He decided a demonstration was in order, nothing too extreme and not even real, just online roleplay. Don't you know I slipped right into what I had been railing against only moments before? I was shocked and it was hard to process it all. That was when I knew that, if I stayed, I had no control at all and this was going to lead exactly where he wanted it to go. Realizing what that path is exactly and such has come over time. I have watched a lot of things slip away one by one and I have seen him place new things upon me as well. There never has been a doubt about who was in charge, but I am learning even the pace and the methods are not mine to have a say over either. For me it has been both. The first realization was a bolt of lightning and is why he is who he is to me. The rest has come over time and the understanding has slowly sunk in. I am sure along the way my understanding will deepen and I will feel his grip tighten even more. It took that initial jolt to get my attention. The rest is just a deepening of what I already know. lovingpet I love this story lovingpet! I find the part about him responding no to your limits really humorous! I have found that while my Owner certainly took me by storm, he also did so in a very sort of calculated way. I mean he moved me along in a way where sometimes it felt like, shoot still feels like, I suddenly woke up one morning to find that something I had struggled with forever had suddenly disappeared over night! Three years and I still find new nuances, new paths, new feelings. It's really just pretty fantastic! ~s

Mercnbeth -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 10:51:35 AM)
quote: at what point did you realize that he was going to define it for you though beth may come back and answer in her own words but in my opinion you are seeking the answer from the wrong perspective. The 'he' you reference in your question is me. I did NOT "define it"; neither did beth. WE defined it, WE still define it, and WE will always define it. You are wondering if there would be a 'beth' without 'Merc'; well, probably not. However there is also no 'Merc' without beth. We existed before as individuals. Happy, content, functioning, independent, (beth wasn't independent, though) confident and strong. Parted, for whatever reason, one or both of us, will still exist only older. The definition of who WE are however would die. Neither of us had a detailed definition of what we sought when we met; nor could we define what we have in appropriately descriptive words. We now share in each other the same characteristics and traits we had before we met. Combined with extraordinarily compatible complementary sexual desires and fetishes we have a LOT of FUN! We feel the sum of us is greater than the individual totals. We also know that as strong as we are as individuals we are better individually as a couple. As a result we both do our best to keep us alive. edited by beth to add: beth wasn't "independent", though, before she met Master. she was very much supported and dominated by her immediate family.

lovingpet -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 10:57:37 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ownedbyPF quote: ORIGINAL: lovingpet I've discussed this before and I like discussing it again and again because it is something that doesn't always get considered. Everything changed for me within the first couple communications. I pretty much was never in control of any of it from the very beginning. He wasn't even REMOTELY what I was looking for. He didn't want the kind of dynamic I thought I wanted. He was into stuff that I placed as hard limits and darn well meant it too. Distance was an issue. I didn't even like his screename because it used text speak and bdsm'y stuff. Still I was drawn. He asked about my limits and what I was looking for and I told him. He responded that, no, that won't do and reworked all of it. I looked at it completely appalled. I made it clear I was appalled too. He decided a demonstration was in order, nothing too extreme and not even real, just online roleplay. Don't you know I slipped right into what I had been railing against only moments before? I was shocked and it was hard to process it all. That was when I knew that, if I stayed, I had no control at all and this was going to lead exactly where he wanted it to go. Realizing what that path is exactly and such has come over time. I have watched a lot of things slip away one by one and I have seen him place new things upon me as well. There never has been a doubt about who was in charge, but I am learning even the pace and the methods are not mine to have a say over either. For me it has been both. The first realization was a bolt of lightning and is why he is who he is to me. The rest has come over time and the understanding has slowly sunk in. I am sure along the way my understanding will deepen and I will feel his grip tighten even more. It took that initial jolt to get my attention. The rest is just a deepening of what I already know. lovingpet I love this story lovingpet! I find the part about him responding no to your limits really humorous! I have found that while my Owner certainly took me by storm, he also did so in a very sort of calculated way. I mean he moved me along in a way where sometimes it felt like, shoot still feels like, I suddenly woke up one morning to find that something I had struggled with forever had suddenly disappeared over night! Three years and I still find new nuances, new paths, new feelings. It's really just pretty fantastic! ~s It truly is awesome! You want to know something truly hilarious? I still have a copy of that horrible, vile message he sent me that said no to my limits and told me exactly what he had in mind. Dang it! I shoulda run when I had the chance! LOL Okay, I admit it, I never had a chance! giggle lovingpet

ownedbyPF -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 10:58:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth this slave has always operated under the assumption that the other party in any encounter/relationship would be the one defining our encounter/relationship. it's just the way she is. upon discovering that M/s and D/s relationship constructs exist and are desired by some, she actually thought that is what submission meant...until she was introduced to places like this message board, where the majority of folks perceive and define submission in an entirely different way than what resonates for this slave. Thank you for clarifying! That makes complete sense to me. In every relationship I had previously had I assumed they would lead... I'd wait to see where they lead and figure out if it worked for me along the way. I didn't always understand it, but I knew that I needed something very intense, very powerful, very very Dominating. Having said that I also didn't have specific ideas in my head like some people talk about having. The extent of my preconceived idea was "are you strong enough and even harsh enough to utterly rule me?"... and if the answer was no, then I'd move on. Not exactly the same thing as what you are saying, but along the same lines I think. ~s

ownedbyPF -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 11:12:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth quote: at what point did you realize that he was going to define it for you though beth may come back and answer in her own words but in my opinion you are seeking the answer from the wrong perspective. The 'he' you reference in your question is me. I did NOT "define it"; neither did beth. WE defined it, WE still define it, and WE will always define it. You are wondering if there would be a 'beth' without 'Merc'; well, probably not. However there is also no 'Merc' without beth. We existed before as individuals. Happy, content, functioning, independent, (beth wasn't independent, though) confident and strong. Parted, for whatever reason, one or both of us, will still exist only older. The definition of who WE are however would die. Neither of us had a detailed definition of what we sought when we met; nor could we define what we have in appropriately descriptive words. We now share in each other the same characteristics and traits we had before we met. Combined with extraordinarily compatible complementary sexual desires and fetishes we have a LOT of FUN! We feel the sum of us is greater than the individual totals. We also know that as strong as we are as individuals we are better individually as a couple. As a result we both do our best to keep us alive. edited by beth to add: beth wasn't "independent", though, before she met Master. she was very much supported and dominated by her immediate family. Thank you for chiming in! This made me stop and think for a moment. I gues in my mind my Master defines it because he is the one who is in control. I don't think of us as partners, all though I do think of us as one. Hmmm that requires more thought on my part. I think I say as one because regardless of what comes at us in life, we stand together. And I know in a way you are right that it was "us" who defined it because without my reaction to him, my need to be lead, my need for him to consume me... well, we wouldn't be where we are. The needs and responses of both defined it. Got it :) I think! It just really seems like he does all the defining and I do all the Yes, Master! It seems like he can direct me wherever he wants me without my even realizing it half the time. I suppose that comes from having learned my responses well enough to push me wherever he wants me. I don't know... you gave me something to think on :) ~s

littlewonder -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 4:02:39 PM)
I have never defined my slavery. I simply let the chips fall where they may with whoever I was with. Master defined my slavery from before even the first day we met I think by giving me glimpses into his psyche through our conversations.

wandersalone -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/25/2010 5:14:48 PM)
What an interesting question to think about [:)] As I am in a very new relationship and we are still exploring our compatibility I can recall exactly when it changed for me. We were emailing on the other side and after a few in-depth emails about our wants, limits, goals etc he asked if he could start implementing some small changes in how I addressed him etc however I asked if we could defer this as I was not comfortable doing this with someone I had never met. He continued to explain in detail his requirements of a submissive in regards to language, tone, respect etc and these were drilled into me prior to our meeting. At our first meeting we had been sitting and talking for a couple of hours when he gently commented that I had slipped a couple of times in being respectful through my words and tone and WHAM it hit me. My submissive side took over and from then on I noticed a significant change in our interactions. I am now allowing him to set all of the parameters and to my surprise I have even slipped willingly into using the dreaded slashy speak in our email communications because he has requested it!!! Knowing him he knew that the small comment he made would have this result and he let me relax for a couple of hours before he immediately reigned me in with just a few quietly spoken words. grins... have to love the way a dominant mind works. ..... thinking about this a little more...the moment I described above is the moment when I consciously gave control to him rather than me letting go of defining my submission as I tend to be very service oriented and focus on pleasing the dominant so rarely define my submission apart from limits if they are in place. Not sure if that answers your questions....I have a tendency to ramble [:D]

Lorenzo19 -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/28/2010 8:58:49 PM)
My story is not much different than most of the others I have read here. But for sake of completeness and killing some time here goes. 1) girl decides she likes the Guy. 2) Guy decides He likes the girl. 3) Guy tells her how it's going to be. Reminds Me of a couple I met years ago. The Guy was a Sadist Dom. The girl was vanilla. They dated for a long while. The guy never told her about his true self. When The Guy finally told her I'm a Sadistic Master and you will be My slave. she completely submitted to His authority. she complained sweetly that she wished He had told her sooner. just goes to show it don't matter what the girl wants. she wants the Man and that's all that matters if her love is true.

Lorenzo19 -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (2/28/2010 9:06:30 PM)
I just thought of an opposite scenario 1) girl decides what she wants 2) girl finds a Guy to give it to her 3) girl leaves Guy because she is unfulfilled Notice girl is in control of the entire relationship. How many girls/Guys out there has this happened to?

Andalusite -> RE: Where does it end uh part 2 :) (3/1/2010 7:49:27 AM)
Lorenzo, I know a lot of women who decide what they want and find a man who will give them that, who are very happy. Not all women are submissive. OwnedbyPF, I think this came up on the 2nd or 3rd date. His views of slavery were different from mine, but were ones that I felt I could actually commit to abide by. We discussed them in detail, as well as his perspective on the difference between submission and slavery, and how it would play out in day-to-day life both in a relationship in which we have separate residences, and if we were living together. I hadn't agreed to be his slave at that point, but I knew that if we were going to get in a relationship, that was what I was signing up for.[:D]

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