Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power

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beej -> Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/8/2010 7:00:59 PM)
i'm with a switch, Wood, who usually doesn't switch within relationships. Wood always had submissive women until his ex, a dominatrix whom he topped and then they switched often. as advised by some of you, i've been pondering how i will establish my dominance mode with him so that he will become accustomed to responding mentally/emotionally to my authority, and then the physical will follow from that since i can't just tackle him, lol. i asked him about his dominatrix and the things that she did to keep him in check. he gave me the list and there were a lot of degrading things on it. his domme got off on using him like he was dispensable, like he was nothing to her. we were talking about props, and Wood suggested some things that i might want to get so that i could break him in in that same degrading fashion. the thing is, i'm not interested in degradation. i'm still figuring out what my dominance vision will be for him, and i'm new to this so it will be a little while before i can turn my vision into a program, but fucking him over worse than i would a two bit whore isn't a long term goal for me. however, do you think i should do it in the short term just because i know and he knows that he will respond to it? he has already made it very clear that it will be hard for him to relinquish his dominance and that i should plan to keep him restrained for long stretches whenever i get started. so if i push the degradation button, it would be like the fast track to establishing myself. i'm reluctant to do it because Wood hated the degradation, and he gets squirmy whenever he asks about what i have planned. obviously, that's one of his weaknesses and i exploit it by keeping him in suspense about my plans. threatening him with degradation is one thing, but if i actually do it, do you think it'll do more damage than good? if i start at a really potent level like that and then try to ease back to what i want to do, will i ruin my own program before it gets started?

allthatjaz -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/9/2010 1:25:32 AM)
I had to smile when I read he has already made it very clear that it will be hard for him to relinquish his dominance and that i should plan to keep him restrained for long stretches whenever i get started. This sounds just like my partner at the beginning of our relationship :) The reason he wants this is because he's feeling kind of embarrassed about switching with you and he's trying to get the message across that its going to be tough for you. If he is taken by force then he didn't have a choice, did he?!?! You need to keep talking. He needs to adjust and start accepting instead of putting up this silly fight. It may well be that your going to have to restrain him the first couple of times but if you have to continue every time you dominate him then its going to mean too much effort on your part and it will get boring. You also need to tell him that your NOT his ex and the things you will be doing are going to be a carbon copy of what she did. He's clearly topping you from the bottom and you need to nip that in the bud now. Start as you mean to go on. If you don't like the thought of degradation then that's your call and not his. If you go in full swing just to please him then you will be expected to please him for ever more. Degradation is a fairly broad word. It could be anything from standing him in front of him and berating him for having such a useless cock (thats something I am not into) or you can role-play the sex Goddess and demand he serves you as a lowly slave (I find that very hot) I need to ask you a question here. Are you doing this for him as his submissive? or are you doing this because you really do desire to take him?

beej -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/9/2010 7:57:47 AM)
allthatjaz: quote: I had to smile when I read he has already made it very clear that it will be hard for him to relinquish his dominance and that i should plan to keep him restrained for long stretches whenever i get started. This sounds just like my partner at the beginning of our relationship :) The reason he wants this is because he's feeling kind of embarrassed about switching with you and he's trying to get the message across that its going to be tough for you. If he is taken by force then he didn't have a choice, did he?!?! hahahahahah. wonderful. i can hear it in his voice, the struggle to cope with it. i love it. quote: I need to ask you a question here. Are you doing this for him as his submissive? or are you doing this because you really do desire to take him? i asked myself that same question. when he first mentioned it, i think i responded as his submissive and also from the appeal of not getting bossed around all the time. as we talked about it, i started acting from my own source of aggression and i knew that i wanted to conquer him. this will sound vague, but i'm still fleshing it out: when i imagine dominating him, it's like i want to reach into his chest and wrap my fist around the things that touch him deepest whether from fear or passion, and look into his eyes so he can see that i could ruin him, but i won't this time because yielding to me reminded me that he cares and that i do too. quote: It may well be that your going to have to restrain him the first couple of times but if you have to continue every time you dominate him then its going to mean too much effort on your part and it will get boring. You also need to tell him that your NOT his ex and the things you will be doing are going to be a carbon copy of what she did. He's clearly topping you from the bottom and you need to nip that in the bud now. well said. i'll bring that up in our next talk. from what he's said so far, he seems to keep asking if i'll do things like her because he's scared of a repeat. her degradations were of that "you have a useless cock" variety. the way you might tell a woman over and over, "you're only good to lay on your back and open your crack" and abuse her meanwhile. that's not my bag, even if he is a man and he can take it. i don't want him cringing from what i will do; i want him salivating despite his pride, lol. i do intend to bend him to my will, but the joy will be in bringing his talents to bear upon my wishes and not in acting like he's talentless. a specific thing: she used to fuck him with a strap-on, and he hated it, so that was one of his suggestions for props that i buy because it would wear him down pretty quick while i had him restrained. i've never tried that before, but i'd rather have his cock doing what i want it to do for me than put time into that. there's plenty of humility to be had in our play already, on his part and mine. hmm. i think what i'll do is provide my list of things that i'm thinking of doing, and perhaps someone could say if it seems efficacious or not. i figure i'll spend most of this weekend landing hard on my butt anyway, but i want to give it the good old college try, lol.

allthatjaz -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/9/2010 8:06:04 AM)
You talk and feel like a dominant woman. Your going to do just fine [;)]

beej -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/9/2010 9:39:47 AM)
allthajaz: thanks! :) REALLY looking forward to it.

AAkasha -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/11/2010 8:37:09 AM)
A big part of learning to "be dominant" is learning about what pushes your buttons and makes you feel powerful - and more importantly, what excites you and turns you on. Your absolute authentic joy, amusement, and sexual arousal that comes from a result of HIS helplessness, suffering, humiliation or desperation is probably the single most powerful tool in your arsenal. I am generalizing a bit, but I do think most submissive men, and bottoms, react very favorably to a femdom who is really, really getting off on her dominance - vs. going through the motions. Also, when you are purely driven by your own lust and needs - and not by kind of (indirectly) satisfying his, you come across as much more selfish and ruthless. In the moment, of course. I'm only talking about in the context of "a scene," or "playtime," or when you are exercising your dominance. You mentioned that degradation seems to be a trigger for him, but not very attractive to you. Don't discount it fully yet. Instead, try to get your head around what you could find hot about degradation. Don't think of it in terms and context of what he presented to you and you visualized. Degradation is something that - to me - when it's portrayed in porn or I read about what subs want/desire, it's so awful that it's lame. I mean - who wants to dominate a man who acts like a pathetic loser and then gets off on it? Why on earth would I want to stomach having to witness (no, create) a man who used to be someone I held in high esteem acting like a (gag) "worthless worm"? Come on - piss, spit, namecalling -- all of that, it's just so campy, it makes me squeamish, it's almost as embarrassing for me to WITNESS when I picture it in my head. Is this kind of where you are? The thing is, degradation is damn, damn sexy - when done right. What is "right"? Well - what is right, is what's right for me. What is right will be what is right for you. And it's not only the acts, it's the timing. For me, degradation is perfect at a perfect moment, when I am feeling a certain sadistic streak, when I feel I have him emotionally in just the right spot. But for me, I find shame sexy. I like it when a man looks down because he's embarassed. I like it when I hold up a mirror and he can't LOOK at himself, and I have to grab him by the chin and say "LOOK." To me, those moments are far more impactful than the single "acts" that got him to that place. Those acts are just props. Just like a whip or a cane or a dildo or a pair of clamps. They are a series of actions I take to make him look at me "that way." With humiliation and degradation, don't feel like you have to go all or nothing. Experiment with little bits of 'embarassment' he has to endure, or discomfort. There is a delicious kind of squirming a man does when his ego is in pain. This is often far more intense than when his body is in pain. Emotional squirming is as sexy as squirming from bondage. Learn to see and appreciate conflict in his eyes. Try to find out what you think is sexy and hot about his emotional vulnerability. I have no idea if any of this helps - I'm just rambling....but the bottom line is - experiment. At your pace. With acts you enjoy. Don't measure your success against how your actions rank compared to his history; measure your success by how excited you get by what you discover along the way. In the end, you'll be a much more capable domina as a result. Akasha

beej -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/11/2010 10:51:52 AM)
quote: Why on earth would I want to stomach having to witness (no, create) a man who used to be someone I held in high esteem acting like a (gag) "worthless worm"? It's just so campy, it makes me squeamish. Is this kind of where you are? yes, exactly! YES. quote: To me, those moments are far more impactful than the single "acts" that got him to that place. Those acts are just props. Just like a whip or a cane or a dildo or a pair of clamps. They are a series of actions I take to make him look at me "that way." i think this is what's nagging me. with the single acts that he has suggested, even though he hates them, he knows how to endure that. he'll brace himself and go through the motions, and that's not what i want at all. based on all that i know of him and what he loves about me when i submit, i think my plan will really twist him up, but it feels maybe too tame? lemme run it by you: the specs: he's a naturalist, likes to fuck outside in the dirt, and doesn't want me smelling like anything but skin and sex. he also doesn't want me to masturbate, but he makes every effort to keep me worked up and wet and wanting him all day. that's an ego thing, i guess, but he satisfies it when i'm with him; the sex was endless. he also likes for me to be domestic. my plan: i get the jump on him, and then i get him in a locked collar with a leash and some plastic shackles (i'm thinking of making some with cable ties from the hardware store). he's got one of those enormous bathtubs, so i want to make him scrub that tub while i prop my feet up on his back and drink a glass of wine. i want him to run me a lavender bubble bath, and then i want him to sit on the floor while i soak and snicker and whatever else i want. i may ask for a shoulder massage, but chiefly at the end, i want to stand up and hike my leg up on the tub ledge, and make him eat and finger fuck my soapy cunt. i get giddy just thinking about the faces he'll make, the frustration, the fact that i'm taking pleasure in something other than his cock. i'd keep him on a leash for hours while we did other things, and every now and then i'd put his nose in my lavender pussy until i could see that he was wanted some badly, until i could see that he wanted me however i came to him and not just how he requested. then i'd throw him on his back on the bed and fuck him. hee. any good?

AAkasha -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/11/2010 12:48:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: beej quote: Why on earth would I want to stomach having to witness (no, create) a man who used to be someone I held in high esteem acting like a (gag) "worthless worm"? It's just so campy, it makes me squeamish. Is this kind of where you are? yes, exactly! YES. quote: To me, those moments are far more impactful than the single "acts" that got him to that place. Those acts are just props. Just like a whip or a cane or a dildo or a pair of clamps. They are a series of actions I take to make him look at me "that way." i think this is what's nagging me. with the single acts that he has suggested, even though he hates them, he knows how to endure that. he'll brace himself and go through the motions, and that's not what i want at all. based on all that i know of him and what he loves about me when i submit, i think my plan will really twist him up, but it feels maybe too tame? lemme run it by you: the specs: he's a naturalist, likes to fuck outside in the dirt, and doesn't want me smelling like anything but skin and sex. he also doesn't want me to masturbate, but he makes every effort to keep me worked up and wet and wanting him all day. that's an ego thing, i guess, but he satisfies it when i'm with him; the sex was endless. he also likes for me to be domestic. my plan: i get the jump on him, and then i get him in a locked collar with a leash and some plastic shackles (i'm thinking of making some with cable ties from the hardware store). he's got one of those enormous bathtubs, so i want to make him scrub that tub while i prop my feet up on his back and drink a glass of wine. i want him to run me a lavender bubble bath, and then i want him to sit on the floor while i soak and snicker and whatever else i want. i may ask for a shoulder massage, but chiefly at the end, i want to stand up and hike my leg up on the tub ledge, and make him eat and finger fuck my soapy cunt. i get giddy just thinking about the faces he'll make, the frustration, the fact that i'm taking pleasure in something other than his cock. i'd keep him on a leash for hours while we did other things, and every now and then i'd put his nose in my lavender pussy until i could see that he was wanted some badly, until i could see that he wanted me however i came to him and not just how he requested. then i'd throw him on his back on the bed and fuck him. hee. any good? Is that exploitation or is it tease & denial? Is it degrading for him? I think maybe a bit objectifying, but not really degrading. As far as tease & denial goes, it's very effective though. But I read the description and it's not that bad for him, is it? As far as ego deflation goes. I think a lot of vanilla men would line up for that kind of teasing show :) What kind of degradation has he hinted at in the past? Akasha

beej -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/11/2010 3:06:46 PM)
hmm. the scented soap would offend what he thinks is right as far as being a naturalist. it would very definitely piss him off. also, i like finger play during sex, but he won't do it when he's in charge. penis and tongue only, so that was what i stood to gain. but maybe that's not good enough to make him remember my reign. he said that he and his ex used to switch on a dime because she was really good at triggering him. first day that he met her, she made him stock her fridge, rearrange all of the furniture, she fucked him with a strap on in front of someone, slapped him around, there were watersports, and then she fucked him like a whore, he said. and that was pretty much her MO all the time: my power will be in treating you like you're nothing to me. i'm already itching to slap the shit out of him, but that's just conflict. i don't think i'm much of a sadist, but i may be a control freak. before i joined the forum, i was rummaging through posts and saw one about predicament tortures, i think it was called, that really got my juices going. the psychological element was thrilling, but i don't think i'm advanced enough for that. fundamentally, i want to get inside him because he's strong but in a brute, basic, uncomplicated way. physically and emotionally, he's a show not tell kind of person. me, i'm cerebral; that's how i enjoy most things in life. when he's in charge, i enjoy things his basic way, and it's powerful because that's where all of my feelings are, so he gets things out of me that i don't want gotten out. his dick gets right to the root of my special shit, i just won't admit it. that's what i want is to get to the root of his special shit, but being a brute to him isn't going to do it, see what i mean? he's too good at brute. he said his ex made him cry from pain and humiliation. he seems sure that i'm going to make him cry too, but he doesn't know why; he thinks he'll cry for me before i do it for him. i think it's because he knows that i could hurt him, i dunno, i guess because i've got a cold streak in me. i want him to cry because i totally fucked him up on the inside. i mean, i'm not looking to be a career dominatrix here; i just want to get HIM, lol, the same way he's trying to get me. thanks for your help on this. i would appreciate any suggestions. :)

beej -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/12/2010 9:39:14 AM)
i got it! i got it. incubated last night. i'll get the jump on him, cable tie hands and feet, might just go for a choke chain around the neck. other props will be a wooden ruler, latex gloves, and lube. i'll give him twenty licks on the ass right off the bat, and then i'll ask him questions. insofar as he answers correctly/to my satisfaction, i'll reduce the licks by one until there are none left. if he doesn't answer right, i'll add a lick, so he'll have some choice about how long he has to endure. a heartfelt or pleading "Yes Ma'am" may get a small reward. meanwhile since i'll be on his back and he won't be able to see, i'll snap on a rubber glove at some point very close to his ear. wait a little bit and lube him up, just get his anticipation/fear going. whenever i want, i'll give him one finger, or two, or three, or take one out and see how he squirms or doesn't. this way i get to twist his fear of brutality to my own ends and also subdue him in a way that he will respond to. hee.

Andalusite -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/13/2010 8:33:43 PM)
I think the problem is less his reaction to those things, since he has enjoyed them, though with mixed feelings, in the past. Since they don't feel natural or comfortable to you, I think it would be awkward, and interfere with you developing your style of dominance or topping. Personally, I'm not much into humiliation play - just haven't really seen the appeal. I might play with it a bit in a roleplaying context (ie. schoolgirl/bully), but just going into it without the roleplay to spark ideas would feel very artificial and stilted.

beej -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/15/2010 5:42:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Andalusite Since they don't feel natural or comfortable to you, I think it would be awkward, and interfere with you developing your style of dominance or topping. well said. in the end when i was actually there, i leaned toward what felt natural and expedient, and he responded quite well to my authority and desire without my having to do anything special! it was a great moment. :)

AAkasha -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/17/2010 12:02:57 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: beej quote: ORIGINAL: Andalusite Since they don't feel natural or comfortable to you, I think it would be awkward, and interfere with you developing your style of dominance or topping. well said. in the end when i was actually there, i leaned toward what felt natural and expedient, and he responded quite well to my authority and desire without my having to do anything special! it was a great moment. :) And that's what it really comes down to, when it's all said and done. So much of "effective dominance" comes from being able to be in the moment, own your own pleasure and enjoy yourself. At least, that's what submissives and bottoms generally respond to, in my experience. Akasha

Andalusite -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/17/2010 11:25:38 PM)
I'm glad you both had a wonderful time! At some point, you might decide to explore humiliation - whether or not you do is fine, but I think that it's best that it be something you are interested in, and in a way that flows naturally for you. My best to both of you in your journey together. [:D]

hardbodysub -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/21/2010 11:31:29 AM)
quote: he reason he wants this is because he's feeling kind of embarrassed about switching with you and he's trying to get the message across that its going to be tough for you. If he is taken by force then he didn't have a choice, did he?!?! It's also highly possible that it's not exciting for him unless he feels truly helpless. Personally, it's a lot more exciting for me if I'm REALLY physically unable to resist. It doesn't seem like real dominance to me if she's in control only because I allow it.

allthatjaz -> RE: Pushing Exploitative Buttons to Establish Power (3/23/2010 2:13:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hardbodysub quote: he reason he wants this is because he's feeling kind of embarrassed about switching with you and he's trying to get the message across that its going to be tough for you. If he is taken by force then he didn't have a choice, did he?!?! It's also highly possible that it's not exciting for him unless he feels truly helpless. Personally, it's a lot more exciting for me if I'm REALLY physically unable to resist. It doesn't seem like real dominance to me if she's in control only because I allow it. I know what you mean. I have known a good few men that need to feel physically overpowered. The problem is overpowering. My partner used to be very much that way and I really did overpower him once or twice. Once we were sleeping in a poly friends house and I got the other girls in whilst he still slept and we proceeded to sit on him and hold him down whilst one of us tied him. One against five of us was good! Another was a bit of sensual rope. Sensual until I knew he was secure and the noose went round his neck! How many times could I get away with this? How hard did I have to think to come up with some new idea to trick him? how quickly did he get wise to my little escapades? I could of course just tell him that I am going to tie him up but thats not overpowering is it? I am not built like a brick shit house. He can throw me over his shoulder with ease.

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