RE: Religion and me

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Kirata -> RE: Religion and me (3/25/2010 2:29:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NorthernGent it's the people with the one true path to salvation (politics/religion/whatever) who will cause you some serious damage I tend to think that a religion, properly speaking, is something that functions as a re-ligio -- a means, a method, by the practice of which we may become reconnected in a deeper way to the universe in which we live and to each other. Unfortunately, most of what passes for "religion" in the Western world is primitive myths, offered up as literal fact, which serve mainly to separate us from each other and from the world we share. I think this is perhaps why many people prefer to speak in terms of spirituality rather than "religion." K.

kdsub -> RE: Religion and me (3/25/2010 3:39:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NorthernGent quote: ORIGINAL: belladevine FAITH is for those who do not KNOW. Religion sucks the life out of every body and mind. Considering religion is a very human construct - it is the mind. Nothing wrong with religion - it's the people with the one true path to salvation (politics/religion/whatever) who will cause you some serious damage were they ever to get into a position of power. In fact - you may enjoy their company. Do you believe absolutely without any doubt that there could not be a source of life and intelligence in this universe from which we may have descended? You do realize the time is coming when man will be able to construct new life forms with intelligence that will be able to grow and transform according to natural selection? To these life forms we would be Gods…What notions would we give these new intelligent forms for social survival…would they be along the lines of religion when primitive. Would it be reasonable to expect a new intelligence to be able to absorb all the absolute laws of nature? We have not reached that point in the hundreds of thousands of years we have existed as a race. I think there is a source…I think life would be almost a miracle in nature and rare indeed. Along the same lines as something from nothing and time without beginning or ending. It would be far more logical for life to spread from a source…altered…manipulated to survive in a particular environment. Life cannot survive if static…the universe is too unmerciful and changing…it must be spread throughout the universe if there is a chance for its survival. Just as we must spread beyond our planet to survive. If we were to create life would we be morally obliged to guide their development or should we place them in their environment and let them develop on their own? Butch

ckyeraa -> RE: Religion and me (3/25/2010 3:40:37 PM)
hello how are you

JstAnotherSub -> RE: Religion and me (3/25/2010 4:06:52 PM)
this

GotSteel -> RE: Religion and me (3/25/2010 5:57:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata TPWA What's the problem with atheists? That a lot of us have read the bible or just that we've noticed that it mentions more than one way to treat others?

Aneirin -> RE: Religion and me (3/25/2010 7:09:36 PM)
So given your thought about mankind creating new forms of life, could it stand that we are the very same as what we create, in that we were created by others who did the same as we are doing now. If so, then 'God', could be that creator, a singular word for many. But of what created us,I believe they were not the ultimate creator, they were lacking in their intelligence. I say this because of testicles they have to exist outside the body for them to have a chance at working correctly. Now if our creator was so perfect,why could they have not created a male reproductive system that could exist within the body envelope like the female of our species. Many creatures in nature have the male reproductive organ within the body, and it only comes out when it is required, why are we so primitive, could it be those creatures that have their male reproductive system within the body are in fact more advanced than humans and other animals ?

Kirata -> RE: Religion and me (3/25/2010 7:19:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GotSteel What's the problem with atheists? That a lot of us have read the bible or just that we've noticed that it mentions more than one way to treat others? Well that was a bit tongue-in-cheek. But let's see. Did you truly think that kdsub was unaware of the fact that there are also behavioral prescriptions in the Bible with which he would not agree? Or was your "crap" comment and the quote from Deuteronomy intended to demonstrate your supposed superiority over the common plebians of benighted humanity? I'm giving you only two options because you gave me only two. [:D] K.

Termyn8or -> RE: Religion and me (3/25/2010 7:44:46 PM)
destiny I sense that for some reason you want a chair in opposition to me here. I sense this because it sounds like we agree on alot of things, and it's a devil's advocte type of thing. Cool. What really tipped it off was the fact that my response was going to be so full of your words that I noticed. But to the point, indeed there is a proclivity for religions to do two things. Try to prove that they are the one and true way to the Creator and everlasting happiness. And then comes that those of all other faiths will of course burn in hell because they did not follow the one true way. What if there is a heaven ? What if all that's been said is malarkey and we all go except for the very nasty. Would we meet those of other faiths there ? Can we say that there are no Shintoists that have lived a life in compliance with say Juedo-Christian tenets ? (at least the usual concept of them) Or a Buddist, maybe even an atheist. Are the rules not the rules for everybody ? If you follow them all you still burn in hell because you didn't believe this certain book ? I find it hard to believe that an omnipotent being capable of creating the universe would impose such a condition on some extremely valuable reward. Especially in light of the fact that this entity is also responsible for creating all the confusion, and the conditions where some are never made aware of the "right" religion. So with all this, and with the assumption that no book really carries more weight than another because we simply weren't there; after we are dead we may find ourselves bowing to some ex-Emperor of Japan, a statue in Mecca or a totem pole in southeast Arizona. How the hell would we know ? And speaking of hell, do we burn if an Iatollah says so, or how about the Pope ? T

kdsub -> RE: Religion and me (3/25/2010 9:57:56 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aneirin So given your thought about mankind creating new forms of life, could it stand that we are the very same as what we create, in that we were created by others who did the same as we are doing now. If so, then 'God', could be that creator, a singular word for many. But of what created us,I believe they were not the ultimate creator, they were lacking in their intelligence. I say this because of testicles they have to exist outside the body for them to have a chance at working correctly. Now if our creator was so perfect,why could they have not created a male reproductive system that could exist within the body envelope like the female of our species. Many creatures in nature have the male reproductive organ within the body, and it only comes out when it is required, why are we so primitive, could it be those creatures that have their male reproductive system within the body are in fact more advanced than humans and other animals ? Of course who can say...but would we as a race make another superior to our own on purpose? I think not...But as time goes by as in Darwinism is there any reason this inferior race could not progress to be our equals or superiors? Would we even have the desire to make a life form…I think we would it is not far-fetched fiction. It would be easier to make a primitive form rather than a complete equal intelligent entity. If we had the power to spread life through the universe how would we go about it? Would it be easier to start from scratch or take an existing form and alter it to be more intelligent? There are many logical possibilities in science that could produce just such a future. Who is to say it has not happened in the past…especially when we really have no idea how far back the past goes. I am not making up a religion or science fiction book just trying to show there are possibilities that cannot be dismissed with an absolute certainty…and anyone who does is an absolute fool. Butch

NorthernGent -> RE: Religion and me (3/25/2010 10:48:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub Do you believe absolutely without any doubt that there could not be a source of life and intelligence in this universe from which we may have descended? I really do not care Butch. Not being flippant - just the way my mind works. People have their interests - and whether or not there is a god/creator simply does not interest me. I suppose I'm one of those people who has always been interested in people/society - a humanist really. Were god to come down tomorrow and knock on my door for a cup of tea - I'd be interested to hear what he's got to say for himself and what exactly is going on up there - but that'd be it - once he'd gone I'd get on with my every day life in exactly the same vein. Put it this way - I'd much rather spend time in the company of Margaret Thatcher than god - though in Margaret's mind she quite probably thinks she's god - nevertheless - I'd be far more interested to hear about her principles and policies when dealing with the unions than what god did in a 7 day period thousands of years ago. Believe without any doubt? I don't feel strongly enough about the issue to have an opinion either way - though I am a 'seeing is believing' type of person. quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub You do realize the time is coming when man will be able to construct new life forms with intelligence that will be able to grow and transform according to natural selection? New life forms eh....... there's a bit of the conservative in me on this issue.....what's wrong with this life and life forms? I quite like the way it is.

Kirata -> RE: Religion and me (3/25/2010 10:57:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NorthernGent New life forms eh....... there's a bit of the conservative in me on this issue Me too. I'd have more confidence if they could come up with a genetically modified tomato that actually tasted like one for a change. K.

Vendaval -> RE: Religion and me (3/26/2010 12:42:34 AM)
Your explanation makes a good deal of sense, Kirata. The divisive nature of many Western religions turns many people off to the idea of religion in general. Spirituality is a much more inclusive point of view that allows for differences of opinion and belief.

GotSteel -> RE: Religion and me (3/26/2010 7:14:29 AM)
I was endeavoring to demonstrate in a lighthearted manner that there's a bit of Confirmation bias going on when people claim the bible agrees with them.

Termyn8or -> RE: Religion and me (3/27/2010 12:54:35 AM)
Actually the Bible doesn't disagree with much. The question is whether it was froth with insight and/or portent or was it more of a plan ? If it was a plan there are parts missing. T

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