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Why so religious ? - 3/24/2010 7:46:43 PM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline 		Of all the threads that go on in this forum about how intertwinded the US is with what happens in their nation, one thing  that comes across next to politics is religious issues why ?

Why is the US so religious ?

Or if I rephrase that, why does the US seem to go on so much about religion ?


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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/24/2010 8:02:55 PM   
DarlingSavage


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Status: offline 		Cause we got those crazy born agains trying to run everything.

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/24/2010 8:08:27 PM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline 		I mean, it seems to me that if say a person perhaps a politician is speaking out, trying to convince someone,sooner or later, god comes into the conversation, as if god was another weapon to use in that convincing.

If you can't blind 'em with science and baffling with bullshit is not working, trundle out the god thing, that will convince them,

honestly, it does seem like that.


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Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/24/2010 8:17:23 PM   
Thadius


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

Of all the threads that go on in this forum about how intertwinded the US is with what happens in their nation, one thing  that comes across next to politics is religious issues why ?

Why is the US so religious ?

Or if I rephrase that, why does the US seem to go on so much about religion ?


There is really no simple answer to that question. It is like asking why Europeans are so serious about their football, or Germans their beer.

I suppose it is because of how close the topic is to each individual personal freedoms, believer or not.

Even the first settlers arrived here mainly because of religious reasons, perhaps that spirit still lives on in the modern American. There is something uniquely different about the spirit of our people, not that it is better or worse than other places, but it is simply different. We have different feelings on guns, health care, religion, sports, and government. Perhaps, it is related to us being seperated from the continent and Asia. The fact that we didn't go through the state run religions, or the revolts surrounding them.

Whatever the cause, and even with detractors, I would have it no other way.

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/24/2010 8:18:39 PM   
DarlingSavage


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Joined: 9/18/2009
Status: offline 		I'm sure it does. That made me laugh! I'll show you! God's on MY side and YOU'RE going to HELL! The bible says so! So there! LOLOL!



I really don't know what to tell ya. My conception of the powers that be are not really considered mainstream, however, I do love bringing up some atheist points I've heard and showing off a couple of sites on the bible and stuff. They make some damn good points regarding the bible. They start bringing up JC and all that, I just use bible scripture right back at them. I don't believe the same as they do, but my grandpa was a preacher for Assembly of God, so I know exactly what it is they're into and what they believe and it is NOT culture friendly. They spend far more time preaching hellfire and damnation than they do "god's love". I'm gonna go off on a tangent here. I better quit while I'm ahead.

These are the links I like to use, though, if you'd like to take a look at them.
god is imaginary
evil bible


(edited to remove video - Mod21)


< Message edited by ModTwentyOne -- 3/25/2010 11:36:31 AM >

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/24/2010 8:23:15 PM   
mikeyOfGeorgia


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

I mean, it seems to me that if say a person perhaps a politician is speaking out, trying to convince someone,sooner or later, god comes into the conversation, as if god was another weapon to use in that convincing.

If you can't blind 'em with science and baffling with bullshit is not working, trundle out the god thing, that will convince them,

honestly, it does seem like that.



so much for the separation of church and state...LOL

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/24/2010 8:29:37 PM   
TheHeretic


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From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

Of all the threads that go on in this forum about how intertwinded the US is with what happens in their nation, one thing  that comes across next to politics is religious issues why ?

Why is the US so religious ?

Or if I rephrase that, why does the US seem to go on so much about religion ?




We should let the atheists have all the fun? 

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/24/2010 9:08:10 PM   
Aneirin


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Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline 		Not really, one can believe in whatever they like, whatever is personal to them, but why bring it up in the job so to speak, why force people to hear what a speaker believes, when they in fact only wanted to hear in the case of a politician what they were going to do about political things, Preaching is for the church ministers, or is it they can be one in the same in some places.

Only one politician in the UK that I am aware off quoted God in his politics when he was doing his best to convince people, and that was ex Pm Tony Bliar. This was unusual for him, it was a complete first but although it was known he was a religious man, he never before brought up his religious beliefs in his job of politics. Notably, he did this after lengthy conversations with Herr Bush on invading Iraq, it was thought, perhaps some Bush had rubbed off on him, perhaps more than was perhaps healthy. Interesting how he has now converted to catholicism, the ultimate cop out, do whatever and confess after, everything then will be ok.


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Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/24/2010 9:32:48 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		Perhaps because my country has no cultural memory of a civil war over religion?  Ya'll are a bit more cautious, perhaps?

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That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/24/2010 11:39:25 PM   
Vendaval


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Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline 		One of the signs shown on the news during the anti-health care reform protests stated, "Trust in God, not the government".

That seems to sum up the belief systems of many in the U.S.[/font]

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/25/2010 3:25:53 AM   
vincentML


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Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline 		You make some good points, Thadius. Much to do with a separated culture here and a 100 year religious war in Europe. Or was it 30 years? I always get them confused.

But in fact the Colonies did have state religions and rebellions against them such as that lead by Anne Hutchinson

Additionally and importantly to the OP, we have had at least four major Evangelical or revivalist movements in our two hundred plus years of history, arising I think out of the rural regions of the South and West, which have had lasting impact. I suppose it is a chicken/egg question whether the revivals influenced our national character or vice versa. Many of our Presidents came from the South and the West (Ohio was once considered "west") and there has been a long tradition of Preacher influence in Washington along with prayer breakfasts and a national cathedral. The wall of separation has not been very sturdy I don't think, for good or ill.

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Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/25/2010 5:18:53 AM   
thishereboi


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quote:

but my grandpa was a preacher for Assembly of God, so I know exactly what it is they're into and what they believe and it is NOT culture friendly.


And you really think your grandpa represented all religious people? That explains so much. Thanks for sharing.


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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/25/2010 10:46:50 AM   
LadyEllen


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Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Really I think you'd get a better handle on this by reversing the question - that is, why religion doesnt play such a part in the national worldview and politics here as it does in the US (and in certain EU states, Poland for instance).

From my point of view, I dont see how religious conviction should not be a significant influence in social policy and legislation, after all if you believe your religion is the best model to govern society then how can it be that given opportunity to do so, you should not use it to direct or at least inform your political and legislative programmes?

The question then comes down to why religious belief and practice are (or have remained perhaps) so much more widespread in the US and elsewhere than in the UK where few believe anything specific and even fewer engage in any sort of practice?

E

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/25/2010 10:49:58 AM   
tazzygirl


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Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		unbelievable... i thought the exact same thing when i read that post, boi.

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/25/2010 11:20:47 AM   
Thadius


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Joined: 10/11/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

You make some good points, Thadius. Much to do with a separated culture here and a 100 year religious war in Europe. Or was it 30 years? I always get them confused.

But in fact the Colonies did have state religions and rebellions against them such as that lead by Anne Hutchinson

Additionally and importantly to the OP, we have had at least four major Evangelical or revivalist movements in our two hundred plus years of history, arising I think out of the rural regions of the South and West, which have had lasting impact. I suppose it is a chicken/egg question whether the revivals influenced our national character or vice versa. Many of our Presidents came from the South and the West (Ohio was once considered "west") and there has been a long tradition of Preacher influence in Washington along with prayer breakfasts and a national cathedral. The wall of separation has not been very sturdy I don't think, for good or ill.


Thanks for the catching that writing error, what I meant by state run is national government run (i.e. Church of Englund). Indeed there were states that had official religions, and even continued to have them even after the ratification of the Constitution. For many years the Capitol housed the largest worship services and biggest congregation in the nation. It is mainly after the SCOTUS changed the freedom of religion clauses to mean "seperation of church and state", that we get into a wierd area of determining what constitutes state sponsorship and endorsement of religion. I still contend that the language in the Constitution was to keep Congress from creating and funding a national religion, and to keep them from interfering with the religious practices of the various states, municipalities, and individuals. I mean the language is fairly clear "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." I further find it funny that the same people that would argue for this language to mean "seperation of church and state", try to use the word militia in a modern literal sense to go after the 2nd Ammendment.

I surely believe that atheists, agnostics, monotheists, and polytheists can coexist peacefully in this nation, the key to it is to stop worrying about converting the others, and to stop trying to prevent the others from expressing their views. I say that as a practicing pastor of a church, it is not my job to convert anybody, it is my job to plant a couple of seeds here and there. If they are meant to grow they will, if not nobody got hurt in the process. I approach most topics in the same way, if I can instill a bit of curiousity about a topic and somebody goes and researches it themselves, I feel like I have accomplished something, even if they come away from it with a different opinion than mine.

Sorry for the slight derail, but I believe it is topical.

I wish you well,
Thadius

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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/25/2010 11:28:51 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		I think Thadius said it best. I just look at the puritanical beginnings of this country. That people came here so that they could practice their religioun without persecution. So my uneducated guess is that, they got a strong foothold. The lack of persecution allowed every whacked out crack pot cause that can fit the umbrella of religioun over it to thrive. It still does.

And while I detest organized religioun and the way many evil whackos hide behind it..........I also, wouldn't have it any other way.


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RE: Why so religious ? - 3/25/2010 7:22:21 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

And you really think your grandpa represented all religious people? That explains so much. Thanks for sharing.




Did she say "all," Boi?  She spoke to her inside knowledge of a particular sect.  Just because she still needs to take out the anger at her family out on God doesn't make her perspective invalid.  There are some HORRIBLE people who call themselves Christians and do evil in the name of that.

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If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


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