RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From

RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (Full Version)

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subfever -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 8:38:53 AM)
quote: Logic really doesn't rank high on the list of 'ways to determine what one should do'. Indeed. Government, religion, and business (yes, I know... not always separate entities) are well aware of this fact, and have been exploiting this endlessly.

subfever -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 8:51:48 AM)
quote: Logic really doesn't rank high on the list of 'ways to determine what one should do'. As an afterthought, I noticed the manner of which you expressed ways to determine what one should do. Would you care to be more specific?

cpK69 -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 9:41:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: subfever quote: Logic really doesn't rank high on the list of 'ways to determine what one should do'. As an afterthought, I noticed the manner of which you expressed ways to determine what one should do. Would you care to be more specific? One recent example; it does not seem logical to come up with a plan to bring in more revenue from the people, to give to those in government, when government obviously does not care about the people, and will only use it for their purpose; to rule over us. Nor does it seem logical to criticize people for attempting to ‘get something for nothing’, when the objective of the system we live with, is to get as much as possible, while giving as little as possible. Their winning; yay them!!! Kim

subfever -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 10:33:28 AM)
quote: One recent example; it does not seem logical to come up with a plan to bring in more revenue from the people, to give to those in government, when government obviously does not care about the people, and will only use it for their purpose; to rule over us. Kim The government does cares for the people... to the extent that the people must be pacified to the degree of which to avoid rebellion. quote: Nor does it seem logical to criticize people for attempting to ‘get something for nothing’, when the objective of the system we live with, is to get as much as possible, while giving as little as possible. Ah... but you see.. it's okay for those at the top of the food chain to manipulate the system to extract billions, on the backs of those at the bottom of the food chain... without them adding any value to humanity or the ecosystem. Perhaps those at the bottom of the food chain who willingly support this system, support it because they would do the very same thing if they could somehow claw their way to the top. Either that, or they simply can't see what's really going on. If there's anything in between, I'd sure love to hear it. quote: Their winning; yay them!!! Good grief... unless I'm misunderstanding you, you're rooting for the wrong team! That's blasphemy! While I agree that they have done a remarkable job of pulling the wool over the eyes of the collective masses, I don't for one moment believe that you're rooting against the people.

belladevine -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 10:50:14 AM)
I think that my founding fathers were pretty intelligent and Just like Me in A lot of ways. They wrote the UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION and THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE. They wanted to be United and Independent.....kinda like a switch. They were Smart Ass Masochists. They were trying to light the way to a free America for We the People and (Wee are People too). It is not easy being A Slave. Trust Me on this 1.

belladevine -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 11:23:45 AM)
Uncle SAM wants to let people choose BDSM for themselves.

cpK69 -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 11:36:26 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: subfever The government does cares for the people... to the extent that the people must be pacified to the degree of which to avoid rebellion. Well, we are job security, and somebody has to do the dirty work. quote: Ah... but you see.. it's okay for those at the top of the food chain to manipulate the system to extract billions, on the backs of those at the bottom of the food chain... without them adding any value to humanity or the ecosystem. Am I wrong in thinking capitalism is as stystem of manipulation? quote: Perhaps those at the bottom of the food chain who willingly support this system, support it because they would do the very same thing if they could somehow claw their way to the top. Either that, or they simply can't see what's really going on. If there's anything in between, I'd sure love to hear it. Every day I go to work, I suport the system. I don't know how to stop and continue to exist. quote: Good grief... unless I'm misunderstanding you, you're rooting for the wrong team! That's blasphemy! Just pointing out the true victors, according to the objective. I'd prefer a whole differnt game. quote: While I agree that they have done a remarkable job of pulling the wool over the eyes of the collective masses, I don't for one moment believe that you're rooting against the people. No, but I can't go against their ability to choose. I suspect, a large part of the wool pulling is done by the collective masses, themselves. Kim

subfever -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 12:13:10 PM)
quote: Ah... but you see.. it's okay for those at the top of the food chain to manipulate the system to extract billions, on the backs of those at the bottom of the food chain... without them adding any value to humanity or the ecosystem. Am I wrong in thinking capitalism is as system of manipulation? No, you're not wrong. quote: Perhaps those at the bottom of the food chain who willingly support this system, support it because they would do the very same thing if they could somehow claw their way to the top. Either that, or they simply can't see what's really going on. If there's anything in between, I'd sure love to hear it. Every day I go to work, I suport the system. I don't know how to stop and continue to exist. Until the system is changed, those of us who require income have no other choice but to continue exchanging our labor for cash, simply to make ends meet. So in that sense, we support the system. However, this doesn't mean we need/want/ought to support it philosophically/ideologically. quote: While I agree that they have done a remarkable job of pulling the wool over the eyes of the collective masses, I don't for one moment believe that you're rooting against the people. No, but I can't go against their ability to choose. I suspect, a large part of the wool pulling is done by the collective masses, themselves. I suspect you're right.

cpK69 -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 12:36:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: subfever However, this doesn't mean we need/want/ought to support it philosophically/ideologically. Well, no, but at some point, if we want the system to change, we're going to have to act. There's got to be a way. Kim

pyroaquatic -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 1:36:07 PM)
Stop using money. Start Bartering. Cash... pieces of paper forged by whatever means to support itself. What does it represent now? How is that any different three years ago. Six years ago. We are at a deficit. Apparently by some mediocre means we have made it this far. Looking at the Wiki for deficit... and it does not look good. We have been in surplus for how long? Where is the tipping point now?

subfever -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 8:41:25 PM)
quote: Well, no, but at some point, if we want the system to change, we're going to have to act. There's got to be a way. Kim It's far too early to change the system. We're not ready yet by even a long shot. The best we can do now is get on the same page, and build a foundation by communicating with others. Real change will not come from the politicians. It will come from the people.

Silence8 -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/12/2010 9:40:04 PM)
You're never going to stop exchange. You can control money without eliminating it altogether. That's a short-term solution that would have real consequences. Plus, the war. End it. Slowly scale down military (everyone knows this in his/ her heart of hearts) with full compensation for all brave soldiers, etc.

cpK69 -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/13/2010 5:30:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pyroaquatic Stop using money. Start Bartering. Something tells me, it is our beliefs toward 'value' that is our biggest problem; not money itself. Money is just a vice that can be used against us because of those beliefs. quote: ORIGINAL: subfever It's far too early to change the system. We're not ready yet by even a long shot. It will come from the people. How much of the system, do you think, is the people? quote: The best we can do now is get on the same page, and build a foundation by communicating with others. We need truth. Even if the truth is "I don't know". Kim

subfever -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/13/2010 6:27:12 AM)
quote: You're never going to stop exchange. You can control money without eliminating it altogether. That's a short-term solution that would have real consequences. Plus, the war. End it. Slowly scale down military (everyone knows this in his/ her heart of hearts) with full compensation for all brave soldiers, etc. As long as we adhere ourselves to a monetary system, there will be greed, corruption, hunger, pollution, and war.

subfever -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/13/2010 6:44:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: subfever It's far too early to change the system. We're not ready yet by even a long shot. It will come from the people. How much of the system, do you think, is the people? People adapt to the system. If you take a Chinese baby, and raise him in Sydney, he will speak and behave like an Aussie. We are products of our environment. quote: The best we can do now is get on the same page, and build a foundation by communicating with others. We need truth. Even if the truth is "I don't know". Truth is a major obstacle. Most people don't want the truth, if it conflicts with their POVs and identities. The last president who told the truth was Carter, who is considered a man of high morals by most standards, but also considered the most ineffectual president of modern times.

cpK69 -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/13/2010 7:15:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: subfever Truth is a major obstacle. Most people don't want the truth, if it conflicts with their POVs and identities. I think this brings us back to the witty phrase, with a catchy tune, idea. I'll give starting it a whirl... [;)] "Oh, open your eyes. Why can't you see? I can't be you, and you don't want to be me. All this running is getting us nowhere fast. Move two steps forward; slide three steps back..." probably not... [>:] Kim

reynardfox -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/13/2010 8:31:49 AM)
Where do Aristos come into this? Are you French or something? Madam Guillotine is long gone. Get wise, banks are run by riff raff, not royalty.

thompsonx -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/13/2010 11:02:40 AM)
Get wise, banks are run by riff raff, not royalty. How does one tell the difference?

subfever -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/13/2010 11:23:35 AM)
quote: Where do Aristos come into this? Are you French or something? Madam Guillotine is long gone. The title is lifted from the article linked to from the original post. quote: Get wise, banks are run by riff raff, not royalty. They certainly have the wealth of royalty. In any event, I'm wise enough to know that regardless of what you want to call them, they're a hell of a lot smarter than the sheeple who willingly support their system.

subfever -> RE: The Aristocratic Tyranny Our Founding Fathers Sought to Protect Our Republic From (4/13/2010 11:31:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cpK69 quote: ORIGINAL: subfever Truth is a major obstacle. Most people don't want the truth, if it conflicts with their POVs and identities. I think this brings us back to the witty phrase, with a catchy tune, idea. I'll give starting it a whirl... [;)] "Oh, open your eyes. Why can't you see? I can't be you, and you don't want to be me. All this running is getting us nowhere fast. Move two steps forward; slide three steps back..." probably not... [>:] Kim Don't get too discouraged. Though still in its infancy, the movement now has almost 400,000 members worldwide. Orientation in text

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