RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (Full Version)

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Tantriqu -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/20/2010 8:21:17 PM)

I get something similar from the do-me male subs, just on the other end of the spectrum: I have a few hard limits: no bi's, crossdressers, doms, but they think my hard limits don't apply to them or I don't mean them.
And yes, they think they're infinitely desirable and aren't used to being told 'no' or 'eurgh', or they get turned on by the manipulation, which I don't play.



ranja -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 2:29:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomImus

quote:

ORIGINAL: Miyani
Well, here's my question. Are your two favorite things actually necessary in every single scene you do? The third favorite isn't a hard limit, why is it out of the question to explore that activity with her?


My OP was really more about her expectation that I would automatically do things her way not a request for suggestions on how to make the situation work although I do appreciate your input.




there is just so much angst about this topping from the bottom stuff and hard limits and soft limits and limits getting broken...

i am all for compromise, manipulation and having a good time

maybe you were too hasty to dump her, and maybe it was for the best



rideemwet -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 4:23:22 AM)

While others have mentioned limits are fluid, could it be possible that she specifically wanted someone to press those "soft" limits.  In other words, were they soft limits instead of hard limits?  At the risk of criticism, I will say that most subs (maybe not bottoms, but subs) want to be pushed OUT of their casual comfort zone and be able to hang responsibility for what happens on the Dom.  "He made me do it" therefore I'm not a bad person, its his fault.   (Sorry for the M/F assumption in the pronouns there).  

While I will respect someone's true limits, its surprising how fluid they really are, to the point that I usually don't ask what her limits are, I find out as I go.  Verbalizing a limit often sets it as a limit in someone's mind.  And I never expect someone to know all of their limits, as its very likely that at some point I'll be leading them into unknown territory, so its my responsibility to detecting impending phobia/panic, and work around it (usually just go slower so it doesn't become a limit).

I asked a sub I played with once if I could ever get her to break the law for me.  Her answer was a firm "no".  So the next time we got together I encouraged her a bit (about an hours drive) to hurry up to get over.  When she got there I asked her "Did you speed?"  (This is Atlanta highway traffic, EVERYONE speeds).  Uh, yeah.  I got her to break the law even though she said she wouldn't.  It was a good lesson for her ...

To put this in context of the earlier posts, most of my experience is based on short-term relationships (less than a year), but not one play-session dungeon negotiated scenes.    I "play" in a public dungeon too, but thats just that, play, a chance to socialize, a chance to observe and learn from other people, etc.



CaringandReal -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 5:37:18 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

The little TNG girls especially expect you to leap at the chance to play with them and they don't get that some men don't live to play with them.



???

The Next Generation?



DomImus -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 6:02:05 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ranja
i am all for compromise, manipulation and having a good time


I'm not opposed to compromise. We agreed on one thing and disagreed on two others. We could have split the difference - I agree to set aside one of those activities and she agrees to abandon one of those limits and she gets to pick which one to keep and which one to let go. That would be fair. A strategy for another day, perhaps.





GotSteel -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 6:55:08 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger
I just don't like being used as a sex toy-I deserve better.

I can completely understand that, I'm sure a lot of people aren't into casual play for the same reason.



GotSteel -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 7:07:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Andalusite
It sounds to me like she didn't understand why you weren't open to casual play with things that both of you liked, just because your tastes weren't a perfect match for a LTR.

I could understand if the OP wasn't into casual play or wasn't into it without the possibility of it going farther but that doesn't seem to be the issue.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Andalusite
Anyway, you decided not to play with her, so no matter why that is, it was rude of her to keep pushing.

OP, was she being pushy or just confused that you had no interest in doing one of your favorite things to a girl you thought was cute enough to spend time tracking her down.....because that confuses me....




GotSteel -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 7:21:43 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomImus
I'm not opposed to compromise. We agreed on one thing and disagreed on two others. We could have split the difference - I agree to set aside one of those activities and she agrees to abandon one of those limits and she gets to pick which one to keep and which one to let go. That would be fair. A strategy for another day, perhaps.

Well, I suppose whether or not that would be fair would really depend on what limits we're talking about. What exactly did you expect to do to this girl?



Andalusite -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 7:29:18 AM)

Yeah, I don't get it. Unless those are the *only* 3 activities he's ever interested in doing, I'd think he'd have a good enough imagination to come up with lots of things to do to/with her without breaking her hard limits. Of course, they may not be so hard - like I said earlier, I think people get defensive and set in stone because some people deliberately set out to push soft limits as much as they can get away with. Still, once he's told her she's not interested, I figure she should respect that.

For that matter, I don't see how only playing with people whose tastes coincide with his makes him more dominant or prevents him from being a service top. If someone has those same 3 favourite activities as he does, then him doing them to her *is* satisfying her needs, and she's not necessarily submitting (although she might be). The difference between bottoming and submitting is mindset, not whether or not I am obeying orders, or have asked for any input into what toys he uses, or even how much I enjoy the activity.



allthatjaz -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 7:54:21 AM)

I think another thing here to consider is the amount of people that have no limits or will go along with your likes simply because they don't have the ability to say 'no'
The sort of people who don't have the capacity to say 'no' are the same sort of people that either don't recognize choice or go along with things they don't want because of a desire to please. The problem I see with people who can't say 'no' is their 'yes' is always very cloudy.
I see someone that can set limits or say 'no' to certain activities, as someone who understands their boundaries and edges. They have enough self worth to understand what they want and what they don't want and are able to clearly express a choice.
That is not to say that those choices won't change under the right circumstances and perhaps this is how she was thinking. 'I'm not ready to go there yet but if the time feels right, perhaps I will go there' sort of thought. The fact that she still wanted to play with you signifies that she wasn't repulsed by the two things she gave as hard limits.





Miyani -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 8:01:23 AM)

I wasn't suggesting ways to make things work, it's clear that you don't want to play with her. I was asking a question in return. WHY was it impossible to compromise, since it was just a playdate? Why DID that have to end the discussion?

I don't know that I've ever had people assume I would do things their way. At least not people who were actually interested in talking, meeting, anything beyond the usual HNG crap. But I've met many people who expect that, since we're both people before we're Domme and sub, we'll each take the others wants and needs into account. It's true, she should have stopped pushing when you said no, but you seem to be assigning her motivations she may not have. It sounds to me more like she had been interested in you, looking forward to playing, and she was confused as to why you were more interested in activities than in her.



domiguy -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 8:04:29 AM)

What we tend to forget is that subs also have discretion...What someone might "do" for another they might not be willing to do with you.

Water seeks it's own level, so do subs. Sucks to always try and out kick your coverage.



Miyani -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 8:04:33 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomImus
We could have split the difference - I agree to set aside one of those activities and she agrees to abandon one of those limits and she gets to pick which one to keep and which one to let go. That would be fair.


Oh, no no no no. Fair? Not even a little bit. "I'll do to you the things I enjoy (and apparently ONLY the things I enjoy), if you get rid of a hard limit for nothing more than a playdate?" That's not fair. That is you getting the things you want, and her forcing herself into something she doesn't want.

Here's fair. "Well, I really enjoy only one thing that you enjoy. So let's do that thing. There can always be more playdates, and maybe we'll branch out from there."



allthatjaz -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 8:21:41 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

What we tend to forget is that subs also have discretion...What someone might "do" for another they might not be willing to do with you.

Water seeks it's own level, so do subs. Sucks to always try and out kick your coverage.


Repeated just because I think this ^ should be read twice.



Smutmonger -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 8:35:28 AM)

A lot of people who look for something hopefully more long term are going to see some hard limits as "deal breakers."

Sort of like a plumber showing up-but you wanted an electrician.



Smutmonger -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 10:02:54 AM)

And lets be truthful here-if you are quite happy in your own life alone....Why the fuck WOULD you compromise-to be UNHAPPY WITH someone?



GotSteel -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 5:08:07 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smutmonger
A lot of people who look for something hopefully more long term are going to see some hard limits as "deal breakers."

Sort of like a plumber showing up-but you wanted an electrician.

I agree getting into a relationship that you'd find unfulfilling is a terrible plan. But that doesn't seem to be the topic of this thread, I'm under the impression that we're talking about a casual play date.



Smutmonger -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 5:34:11 PM)

I'd do the same with a play date if what she was interested in bored me.



Smutmonger -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/21/2010 5:39:14 PM)

After all, if I just wanted to get my "dick wet", I'd be dating VANILLA women.



DesFIP -> RE: Dominants: Has this ever happened to you? (4/22/2010 2:38:22 PM)

But it isn't about doing things that bore you. It's about only doing the things that both of you like. So if you like these three activities you could still enjoy yourself for a half hour as would she. Limiting the casual play to stuff you both like, unless you only like doing things the other person doesn't like?



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