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CynthiaWVirginia -> RE: Parenting and Parents today (5/2/2010 4:44:41 PM)
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quote:
Okay. So you're about to enter a room with a wooden floor. I have been mopping that floor. It is wet.
I prevent you from entering the room by shouting 'No!!' slapping you across the face and pulling you out of the room.
Acceptable behaviour to you?
Ah but you see, I'm applying the exact same logic as you did in your example and hitting you to stop you entering a room with a wet floor.
I see your point, however I don't see where one has anything to do with the other. Let me post a different scenario. I have a young child I've told not to go into the street. I have explained that coal trucks and cars are big and he's small, and if they hit him there would be broken bones and blood and needles at the hospital... (Yes, I actually spell things out that clearly.) I tell him to hold my hand or my shirt. He was on an elastic child's leash to train him, and help me have some control, and I also warned him repeatedly that if he went into the street without me leading him across, I'd smack his butt. When he forgot and went into the street...the sidewalks are narrow and cars were just three steps away...yes, I smacked his bottom once, every time he broke my rule and endangered himself. Never in anger though. My kid was in his own little world with autism, and words didn't always sink in...after a swat, when I had his attention, the rule was stated again loudly and immediately (DO NOT GO INTO THE STREET) and then I'd say why (cars will hit you and squish you like a bug, and then mommy will be all alone), and then I'd rub his hair...he liked that, and we'd continue. This has nothing to do with the adult stepping onto a freshly mopped floor scenario...that would be more of a revenge for putting dirt spots on the floor instead of ensuring someone's safety and doing whatever is necessary to establish a voice in their head that keeps them safe.
quote:
You are hitting a child. Your intention, action and this causes a reaction. There is a relationship between you and your child defined at that moment by communication (the swat).
A swat doesn't define...the love, responsibility, and blood/sweat/tears that it takes to guide and raise a child into a person who is...a mensch. Unlike many more liberal parents I know of around here, I do not live for the day when I can finally get the kid out of my house and be free again. I've met many parents who have a hate/hate relationship with their children...and these same parents are the ones who gave me so much unwanted advice when my son was little. They knew everything, I was too controlling, yada yada yada. Their kids are the opposite of mine...defiant, disrespectful, drug and alcohol problems, teen pregnancies, jail time, and...not being able to feel empathy for anothers' pain. I prefer my way over theirs.
quote:
You are the adult, you are using reasoning, logic, you are the one delivering the swat.
What about the child? You know, the one who receives the swat? Do you know how they feel? Do you care?
Maybe it's the way I do it, but the 1-5 swats I give have never provoked rage nor have been called unfair. Usually it's been only one or two.
5 have been reserved for if he ever lies to me and I catch him (I make sure he has no reason to lie to me though, and I have never needed to punish him over this. He's 20 now), or if he forgot himself and thought he was the man of the house and made a physically threatening gesture (happened only twice when he was getting used to all that extra testosterone and agressive feelings) while he was angry. He's welcome to get angry all he wants, and tell me so in great detail, but he is never to raise his fist to me. This happened only during one year; he is a very peaceful person who knows how to talk things out fairly.
As for the question of knowing how they feel...I would rather have had a parent who would hug me when I was good, and give me a smack when I earned it than ignore me and count the days till I'm out of their life, or to treat me as if I were a fully fledged adult from the time I was 11. On the other side of the coin, because of my father I can say that I wish parents never hit when angry or gave long spanks or even beatings. However, I would have forgiven him anything if only he had loved me even a little bit. On his deathbed, he refused to say one word to me. I've been a child, and yes, I know how it feels. Yes, I care how my son feels/felt. If I didn't care...I would have had an abortion, given him away to someone else just to be rid of him, had him institutionalized when I had the chance, or...let him lead his own separate life like he's a stranger living in my house instead of someone I love and enjoy spending time with.
Btw, from about 8 years old on up, he's only needed spanks maybe two or three times in a year, some years we've even had none at all. I'm not looking for an excuse to nail him, he hasn't trembled in fear at the sound of my voice or felt sick to his stomach with worry that I'll find something wrong and go on a long hateful tirade. My son has also told me that he prefers the swats to the "You have disappointed me" lecture.
quote:
Unlike you, the child doesn't use logic, or rational thinking, but uses reasoning based on feelings and emotions. You even stated that these swats would have been used before the age of reasoning sets in.
If rules, reasoning, and careful tending won't handle the situation, a pop on the fanny along with the words "I SAID NO!" cover a lot of rational/emotion/reasoning territory. After merely one or two times of being swatted, the word no carries more weight even with a toddler.
I'm not picking apart what you said to be antagonistic or target you, but only because some good issues were raised and I wanted to give my opinion about them. I think it's wonderful that some families can raise their children without any yelling or swats or spanks, and have the children grow up to be unselfish, thoughtful, kind, decent, loving human beings. Obviously any corporal punishment would be overkill, for them.
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