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RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 7:46:51 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		We were net creditors in 1980, the largest creditor nation in the world.

Then Trickle-down Economic Voodoo, and in 1988, we were the largest debtor nation in the world, with a stock market crash, and an inherited high double digit unemployment recession and a savings and loan crisis/scandal.

So people decided we should do it again.

And now want to bring back the people who brought it to them.



< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 5/7/2010 7:49:05 AM >

(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 7:54:33 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		1913.    You are not as free as you think.  (sorry)

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 8:00:28 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		I believe I just said that.

But people will vote for it again. And things will get worse again.

(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 10:51:08 AM   
NorthernGent


Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

They certainly did pay war reparations. 



Well yeah.....nowhere near the mark though.

They defaulted in the early '20s.....which is why the French occupied the Ruhr.

And then they deliberately concocted a situation where they were unable to pay.

And I suppose the proof's in the pudding.....the French were right....and the English and Americans were too sympathetic.

And it wasn't like the Germans didn't exact a harsh penalty from Russia by the way.....or France in 1871. Typical of the 'strong and order' and 'personal responsibility' crowd....yeah...they're all for it when things are going in their favour....when the shoe's on the other foot though they melt away....

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RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 11:14:46 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: susie

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250


quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Countries all over the world are in a debt crisis. Spending money that isn't there has to end, and end soon. Who bails out these countries when there is no bailout money left. Make the spending that are necessary and do it quickly. The U S is next in line for big trouble.


Servant, in Greece and other countries in the E.U. they get cradle to grave benefits.
In the U.S. if you live long enough you get Medicaid and about $1,000 a month. That's nothing compared to 5-8 week "holidays", month long visits to spas for health reasons, free health and dental, killer maternity benefits, pensions etc.
Most people here in the U.S. get 2 weeks vacation if they're lucky.
I don't know how much the average pension in Greece is but it's most likely a lot more than $1,000 a month. They were talking about upping their "VAT" tax from 22% to 23% and cutting pensions by $100 per month and that sparked the violence.
Looks like they need to cut govt. spending just like the U.S. They can cut the Greeks a lot more because they "get" a lot more than we in the U.S. get!
I have a brother who has 32 years on a Boston area fire dept and he only gets 4 weeks vacation.
Greece is a socialist country and as everyone knows socialism works great until other people's money runs out.
Boy, this "E.U." thang is comming back to bite Europe right on the ass! All the people who didn't want it must be glowering now!


Not sure what countries in the EU give 8 weeks vacation and month long spa visits. Certainly not in the UK. We get 4 weeks holiday. Although we have a National Health Service (which I have to say in my personal experience is fantastic ) it is hardly free as it is paid for out of our National Insurance payments.



Susie, I may be thinking of Sweden, I saw a documentary years ago about something like that and the benefits they got dwarfed what we get in the U.S.!

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to susie)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 3:58:17 PM   
Marini


Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
Status: offline 		I wonder if Greece is ready for "shock therapy"?

Shock therapy may smother Greek economy, extend crisis | Reuters

The world is going to be watching to see how the citizens of Greece,
deal with the "changes" that are coming their way.
I really hope Greece is NOT depending on consumer spending to get them out
of their little "recession".
How much will the consumers have left to spend after all the cuts coming their way,
and higher taxes?

I have always wondered how you can "spend" your way out of a recession/depression.
I hope the citizens of Greece hold on tight to their hats, they are headed for a bumpy ride.

< Message edited by Marini -- 5/7/2010 4:00:48 PM >

_____________________________

As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 4:33:38 PM   
DedicatedDom40


Posts: 350
Joined: 9/22/2005
Status: offline 		Its funny the issue is always the (typical) government spending angle, and not the clever financial "product" gimmicks used by the unregulated free markets of the world to hide it all. When does the discussion (finally) move on to that?

(in reply to Marini)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 4:39:53 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		Forget the bankers with their derivatives, just blame social welfare. Obviously helping those worse off  should be illegal.

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Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 5:43:53 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Remember the movie line " you can't handle the truth "? California alone has unfunded pension obligations of 500 billion. Drastic cuts need to be made in the US and other countries and they need to be made soon.



How much is the sand box costing per day???
or
We could cut school lunch programs
AFDC
WIC
or
We could stop the mortgage interest deduction
We could stop giving tax deductions for children
Make police/fire and trash pick up non paid volunteer work

(in reply to servantforuse)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 5:53:47 PM   
thompsonx


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Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

I have a brother who has 32 years on a Boston area fire dept and he only gets 4 weeks vacation.


Didn't you get 30 days vacation every year you were in the navy and coast guard?

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 6:44:44 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

I have a brother who has 32 years on a Boston area fire dept and he only gets 4 weeks vacation.


Didn't you get 30 days vacation every year you were in the navy and coast guard?


I did.

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 6:48:00 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

I have a brother who has 32 years on a Boston area fire dept and he only gets 4 weeks vacation.


Didn't you get 30 days vacation every year you were in the navy and coast guard?


I did.



But you think others should not?

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 6:51:55 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

I have a brother who has 32 years on a Boston area fire dept and he only gets 4 weeks vacation.


Didn't you get 30 days vacation every year you were in the navy and coast guard?


I did.



But you think others should not?


Sure, if they can afford it! Greece can't anymore, "other people's money" has run out.
Oh sure, I joined the Navy for the great working conditions, high pay and great benefits. That's what everyone joins the military for, to get rich right?

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 5/7/2010 6:53:07 PM >

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 7:04:35 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline 		You were paid with other people's money

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/7/2010 9:25:02 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

You were paid with other people's money


Everyone is.

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/9/2010 3:15:05 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

We were net creditors in 1980, the largest creditor nation in the world.

Then Trickle-down Economic Voodoo, and in 1988, we were the largest debtor nation in the world, with a stock market crash, and an inherited high double digit unemployment recession and a savings and loan crisis/scandal.

So people decided we should do it again.

And now want to bring back the people who brought it to them.




Oh nice, so now, the IMF is going to "loan" Greece $40 Billion!
So, the U.S. Taxpayers are going to help bailout Greece now?
Let's see here, Greece borrowed too much money and spent it and they can't pay it back so now,.....the I.M.F. wants to "loan" them more money which they won't be able to pay back? Didn't Joe Biden say something similar to this recently?
Hey! I have an idear..............let's "borrow" $14 Trillion from the I.M.F. and..............

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/9/2010 5:48:27 PM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline 		The British won't riot, for they are a beaten people

_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/9/2010 7:18:05 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		Holy cow- the Greek bail out is almost a trillion$

(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/9/2010 7:31:39 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		European Central Bank to intervene in markets, Lux finance minister says Submitted by cpowell on Mon, 2010-05-10 01:19. Section: Daily Dispatches EU Crafts $928 Billion Show of Force to Halt Crisis By James G. Neuger and Meera Louis
Bloomberg News
Monday, May 10, 2010 http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=ap50DW8IqhBo&pos=1 ยป read more | email this story

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Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Rioting escalating in Greece, will the rioting spre... - 5/9/2010 8:21:15 PM   
Marini


Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

The British won't riot, for they are a beaten people


Since you are British, your opinion means a lot.
What a sad statement.

I wonder if American's are also beaten down these days.
It would take something drastic for the masses to "wake up",
and riot.

< Message edited by Marini -- 5/9/2010 8:22:30 PM >

_____________________________

As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 60
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