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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 9:52:07 AM   
kittinSol


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 9:53:36 AM   
Sanity


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Its fun to get a little bit prehistoric sometimes...

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Children! Behave! Or I'll go all prehistoric on you.


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 9:54:16 AM   
mnottertail


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  . . .

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 5/7/2010 9:55:06 AM >

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 9:54:52 AM   
kittinSol


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 9:59:46 AM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
Fantasies?

You don't understand the science half as well as you like to pretend that you do, Tim. For example, you asked here "It's not a matter of genes flowing in one direction--where'd you get that?"

The answer is, in the news article that I posted. Why don't you try reading it before ignorantly posting in the thread, so you're up to speed with the rest of us?

You also said "If we had Neanderthal DNA to analyze, presumably we'd find Homo sapien genes as well." Well, here's another news flash for you - the Yahoo News article is based on the Neanderthal DNA that was analyzed.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

You lighten up. Overreacting here, aren't you?

So go back to your war and rape fantasies. I'm still more interested in the genetics.

Oh....don't forget that aliens could have landed and forced them to interbreed as an experiment.


You're drawing a hasty conclusion, Thomas old chap.

Obviously, offspring from a union is going to mix genes from both parents. It's not like we have a wealth of Neaderthal DNA, so enter the speculation. Perhaps the mixing happened earlier, before homo sapiens crowded out or killed off the Neaderthal. Perhaps any number of things. Who knows? There's no reason to suppose the offspring were only born to one of the groups.

But the article points out that, using Neanderthal DNA, we found it in homo sapiens. It does not discuss looking for homo sapiens DNA in Neanderthal, which, presumably, would be quite a challenge. But genes still aren't one way.

As for the rest, I don't understand the science at all, and neither do you. We aren't geneticists.

I do understand the difference between research and fantasies about primitive life. I suppose both have their place. They aren't, however, interchangeable.




< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 5/7/2010 10:00:51 AM >

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 10:08:22 AM   
kittinSol


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Status: offline 		Slighly off-topic, but I wonder how Sarah "Young Earth" Palin took the news. She's probably sobbing in her stew  .

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 10:10:08 AM   
Musicmystery


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Status: offline 		She routinely denies science. Why should this be any different?

Science = more liberal media lies.



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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 10:37:25 AM   
Sanity


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Further speculation - hopefully it won't upset the Palinologists too much if the thread stays on topic some:



Could Neanderthal have been a fearsome predator?

quote:



Neanderthals Hunted, Raped And Ate Humans

Based on the research, Australian independent scholar Danny Vendramini has developed “Neanderthal predation theory”, which argues that the evolution of modern humans—including our unique physiology, sexuality and human nature—is the result of a reaction to this systematic long-term sexual predation and cannibalism by Eurasian Neanderthals.

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/WO0909/S00246.htm



The theory is kind of out there, but not nearly as pretentious as making up mindless ways of using a thread like this one to attack Sarah Palin. 


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 10:42:46 AM   
Musicmystery


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Status: offline 		This is a good example of the importance of separating speculative conclusions from good science.

The article a couple of times says "based on research" and then goes off into the wild claims. Nowhere do we see this research, or even any hint of what it might be or how it was conducted--just the claim that it's there.

It's a fault with much popular reporting on "science." And note that this is not a report about a journal article--it's a book promo.

The genetics study, however, can point to the exact research and methodology, and that's what makes the conclusion fascinating.



< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 5/7/2010 10:44:00 AM >

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 10:44:46 AM   
Sanity


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Its on topic, and far better science than your Palin hijack though.


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 10:48:01 AM   
Musicmystery


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Status: offline 		I simply responded to the Palin post. Talk to kitten about the change.

It's not good science, at least as presented in that article. We have books "based on research" that "prove" aliens colonized Earth too.

Maybe that's when they interbreed Neanderthals and homo sapiens. I mean, based on research.

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 11:10:07 AM   
Sanity


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Even 'good science' isn't all good science, and not all speculation is fallacious.

What does science know about the mechanics of male Neanderthals copulating with female H. sapiens, or how they interacted socially. And why shouldn't we be free to speculate about that here in Casual Banter?

Why do you seem think it has to be proven science before you'll step aside and allow anyone to post about it. You're being ridiculous...

As I pointed out before, you're not informed enough about the topic to be making such self aggrandizing judgments or decisions anyway.


< Message edited by Sanity -- 5/7/2010 11:39:21 AM >

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 1:00:36 PM   
Musicmystery


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Status: offline 		Why do you feel your speculations should stand unchallenged by disagreement?

You're taking this far too seriously. Really.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
As I pointed out before, you're not informed enough about the topic to be making such self aggrandizing judgments or decisions anyway.

Where do you get this stuff? As I already told you--

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
As for the rest, I don't understand the science at all, and neither do you. We aren't geneticists.

Just relax and have some fun, man. The world is not all about you.





< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 5/7/2010 1:59:41 PM >

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 1:12:58 PM   
Musicmystery


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Status: offline 		Science Friday covered this today:

Neanderthal Genome

What makes us human? The sequence of the Neanderthal genome has been largely completed -- and we're not all that different from those ancient relatives. Writing this week in the journal Science, researchers compare and contrast the Neanderthal genome with the genomes of present-day humans from different parts of the world. The researchers also found clear evidence of 'gene flow,' evidence of interbreeding between the species. Surprisingly, on a protein level, the researchers found fewer than 100 differences between the human and Neanderthal proteomes. We'll talk about how we're different from -- and similar to -- our Neanderthal relatives.

Guests:

Richard "Ed" Green
Assistant Professor, Biomolecular Engineering
Baskin School of Engineering
University of California, Santa Cruz
Santa Cruz, California

Richard Klein
Professor, Anthropology and Biology
Stanford University
Stanford, California

So, turns out nowhere near unequivocal as the Yahoo (and yesterday's NPR piece and the description above) article make it sound--very limited, incomplete, contaminated samples--but really interesting stuff, especially how they go about this and all the various side studies.

Their thought is that the mixing happened early, when homo sapiens were emerging, not later as two established groups mating.




< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 5/7/2010 2:01:43 PM >

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 2:38:39 PM   
zephyroftheNorth


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Status: offline 		Y'know, San this goes a long way towards explaining my first boyfriend, although I thing there is a greater proportion of neanderthal in him.

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 3:07:00 PM   
Icarys


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quote:

Y'know, San this goes a long way towards explaining my first boyfriend, although I thing there is a greater proportion of neanderthal in him.

Poopsie is that you?


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 3:14:01 PM   
divi


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Status: offline 		Icarys that is a scary new avatar..very Domly

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 3:17:06 PM   
Sanity


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Cool new avatar photo Icarys, looking at the picture I can't help but wonder how many of our assumptions about long gone species such as H. neanderthalus could be completely erroneous.


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 3:18:43 PM   
zephyroftheNorth


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

quote:

Y'know, San this goes a long way towards explaining my first boyfriend, although I thing there is a greater proportion of neanderthal in him.

Poopsie is that you?



Ah shaddap you big ape! (it did not end well)


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 3:21:20 PM   
Sanity


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Understandable Zeph. The guy on thew right, the white guy, may have more than 4%



People like him have always made me wonder.


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