Absolute power ?

Absolute power ? (Full Version)

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Aneirin -> Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 8:36:03 AM)
Who is President Obama, what is he, is he really in control, or is he in fact a figurehead for what goes on behind closed doors ? Does he have any actual say in what happens to the US, or is he told what to say ? Is he in fact just the face to blame when things don't go according to plan, in which case, is presidency the test for access to the real power and depending on how the term of office goes, it decides that person's future. I ask this, as thinking about ex Prime Minister Tony Blair, what he was when he was in office, who overseas he had access to and how he changed since that access. With that what he went on to do when he resigned his office, and where he is in the world now, perhaps the creation of a war proved him to be something useful to the real power behind the desk. When we elect a leader, are we in fact electing a figure head ?

Owner59 -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 8:37:34 AM)
[8\|]

LadyCimarron -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 8:43:20 AM)
I would say yes, we are electing a figurehead. Granted he has some powers but he will be gone in 8 years max. His power is limited. The real power players are congressional leaders who can get re-elected an unlimited number of times. The same with the Supreme Court who gets lifetime appointments. And remember it was Congress that passed the law that the president could only serve 2 terms; but they did not put the same restrictions on themselves.

DarkSteven -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 8:45:54 AM)
When any president takes office, he is an albeit powerful member of a group. There is the Cabinet, and advisors... a powerful President will lead that group, and a weak one will be led by it. But nobody that powerful will make decisions without getting input from others.

Elisabella -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 8:50:02 AM)
It's hard to have absolute power when you have to deal with things like congress and re elections.

InvisibleBlack -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 8:54:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aneirin Who is President Obama, what is he, is he really in control, or is he in fact a figurehead for what goes on behind closed doors ? If you're asking the conspiracy theory question of is the President making his own decisions or is he a puppet and someone else is pulling his strings - I will say this: He is exactly as powerful as he wants to be. No matter what deals were cut before hand, no matter what "strings" they may have on him or what blackmail they've got to ruin him - once he's in the Oval Office, he is the President and he has the power. If he chooses not to use it and chooses to do what he's told - that's his choice. If you're saying is the President so heavily influenced by those around him that he is, in fact, not making his decisions because he's relying heavily on the decisions of others: No one can be an expert in every area. Barack Obama is not a military genius or a professional economics expert, or a deep sea engineer - he's a politician from Chicago with a law degree. He has to rely on the opinions of those around him because even if he wanted to develop expertise in any of those areas it would likely take better than 10 years and by then he'd be out of office. As such the question isn't whether or not he's "really in control" but if he's choosing the right people to provide him with answers. I suspect that this would be a hugely contentious issue, depending on your ideology.

Aneirin -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 9:18:02 AM)
Then you in fact have the same problem we have, no matter what party gets into power every four years or so, the people that make the country work are always the same, the civil servants who switch their allegiance to whoever is in power and paying their wages, the unelected power behind the desk. But I have to ask, why is it you have asked if I might be asking the conspiracy theory question, for I was not aware this question was part of a conspiracy theory, it is my own thoughts. Does that make me a conspiracy theorist, or a person free enough to think and ponder my own findings beyond what I am told by others.

tazzygirl -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 9:43:58 AM)
quote: Who is President Obama, what is he, is he really in control, or is he in fact a figurehead for what goes on behind closed doors ? The US government is designed to operate on a checks and balance system. No one office holds all the power. Each can be answerable to the other.

pahunkboy -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 10:35:05 AM)
or is he in fact a figurehead for what goes on behind closed doors ? Does he have any actual say in what happens to the US, or is he told what to say ?/snip Corporate personhood is your answer. Pursuit of happiness, has come to mean - transnational corporations monetizing every breath you take. Our central bank, being that they control money- is the true boss of the US. Well being seems to soley be measured in dollars, which shaman Bernanki, Gieknew, Paulson, and that crowd magically creates that which we worship. Humans have no say so. Our world is a corporate world. We live in a hedge fund. This hedge fund is a war machine. This is why we are still at war. Note that all war debts must be settled in gold. Either party is the corporate party- so expect nothing t change when the neocons get re-elected.

vincentML -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 11:27:07 AM)
jesus, Pa! How do you live with this shit rumbling around in your head? Must be a heavy burden.

Aneirin -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 11:30:12 AM)
That's simple, he comes here to relieve himself.

thishereboi -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 12:20:57 PM)
quote: Who is President Obama, what is he, is he really in control, or is he in fact a figurehead for what goes on behind closed doors ? Well according to this post from the racist thread, he not only controls this country, but is also dictating your foreign policy. quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead When whichever fuckwit some country elects is going to spend the next four years dictating the UK's foreign policy, I tend to take an interest in poltics of the country the dickhead is supposed to be in charge of. I'm funny like that.

pahunkboy -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 12:21:11 PM)
I addressed the question.

kdsub -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 4:51:54 PM)
His powers are listed below: "The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States; he may require the Opinion, in writing, of the principal Officer in each of the executive Departments, upon any Subject relating to the Duties of their respective Offices, and he shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offences against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment. He shall have Power, by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, to make Treaties, provided two thirds of the Senators present concur; and he shall nominate, and by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, shall appoint Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls, Judges of the supreme Court, and all other Officers of the United States, whose Appointments are not herein otherwise provided for, and which shall be established by Law: but the Congress may by Law vest the Appointment of such inferior Officers, as they think proper, in the President alone, in the Courts of Law, or in the Heads of Departments. The President shall have Power to fill up all Vacancies that may happen during the Recess of the Senate, by granting Commissions which shall expire at the End of their next Session. Section. 3. He shall from time to time give to the Congress Information of the State of the Union, and recommend to their Consideration such Measures as he shall judge necessary and expedient; he may, on extraordinary Occasions, convene both Houses, or either of them, and in Case of Disagreement between them, with Respect to the Time of Adjournment, he may adjourn them to such Time as he shall think proper; he shall receive Ambassadors and other public Ministers; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, and shall Commission all the Officers of the United States."

tazzygirl -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 5:04:31 PM)
"Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men." John Emerich Edward Dalberg Acton, first Baron Acton

xBullx -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 7:03:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Elisabella It's hard to have absolute power when you have to deal with things like congress and re elections. I pray that you are right... I suspect that was the original intent.

Elisabella -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 7:11:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: xBullx quote: ORIGINAL: Elisabella It's hard to have absolute power when you have to deal with things like congress and re elections. I pray that you are right... I suspect that was the original intent. [:D] I do wish the founding fathers had done something about corporate lobbying back when it was still in its infancy with the East India trading company and all.

Brain -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 7:14:10 PM)
I think he is surrounded by experienced quality people that he listens to, considers their opinions and in the end he makes up his own mind. Personally or in my opinion, I think he has neglected his progressive base and why I don't know. quote: ORIGINAL: Aneirin Who is President Obama, what is he, is he really in control, or is he in fact a figurehead for what goes on behind closed doors ? Does he have any actual say in what happens to the US, or is he told what to say ? Is he in fact just the face to blame when things don't go according to plan, in which case, is presidency the test for access to the real power and depending on how the term of office goes, it decides that person's future. I ask this, as thinking about ex Prime Minister Tony Blair, what he was when he was in office, who overseas he had access to and how he changed since that access. With that what he went on to do when he resigned his office, and where he is in the world now, perhaps the creation of a war proved him to be something useful to the real power behind the desk. When we elect a leader, are we in fact electing a figure head ?

xBullx -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 7:29:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Elisabella I do wish the founding fathers had done something about corporate lobbying back when it was still in its infancy with the East India trading company and all. If Sam and Ben had only known, I'm sure they would have corrected this oversight.

Elisabella -> RE: Absolute power ? (6/6/2010 7:32:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: xBullx quote: ORIGINAL: Elisabella I do wish the founding fathers had done something about corporate lobbying back when it was still in its infancy with the East India trading company and all. If Sam and Ben had only known, I'm sure they would have corrected this oversight. True. Hindsight is 20/20 and all.

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