Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (Full Version)

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pahunkboy -> Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/13/2010 6:07:51 PM)

This is only the start of public pension mess.  My town has not been hit yet- but they say- we will be bankrupt with in 5 years.  While this article is of teachers- municipal worker pensions face the same plight.   Notice how quick they pass the cost onto the home owner.  Even when renting- those costs factor into the rents.

So people that live in PA will be screwed- for how long?  At some point the home owner will refuse tax increases- then what happens to pensions?

??


==========================
Higher tax bills on way Schools struggle to pay retired teachers
Property tax bills in the Selinsgrove Area School District are going up about $35 this year to meet the school's obligation in Pennsylvania's teacher pension crisis, and are projected to soon jump by more than $200.

Similar hefty tax increases will be felt in communities across the state due to the underfunded Public School Employees' Retirement System (PSERS).

"It's unsustainable," said Jeffrey Hummel, business manager at Selinsgrove Area School District.

Districts statewide are paying 8.22 percent more in pension contributions this year and will see another 10.5 percent rise next year. By 2012-13, the rate is expected to soar to nearly 30 percent and continue to climb the next few years.

If those rates stand, Lewisburg Area School District property owners will pay $265 more over the next four years to meet the rising retirement costs, Superintendent Mark DiRocco said.

"To have to absorb that amount in that short amount of time ... every school district will be cutting programs and real estate taxes will skyrocket," DiRocco said.

Hummel shakes his head at the thought, noting that the average $1,500 tax bill in Selinsgrove will rise $35 this year to cover higher pension costs.

By 2012-13, when costs rise to 29.22 percent, property taxes will jump an astonishing $210 in that year's budget alone.

Hummel is confident the state Legislature will step in before that spike occurs. Otherwise "it would bankrupt school districts and the state," he said.

The state Legislature is working on a solution and the Republican Caucus will make recommendations in a week or so, said state Rep. Merle Phillips, R-108, of RD2 Sunbury.

"Something has to be done to ease the requirements of the cost," he said.

There are more than 547,000 active and retired members of the PSERS pension plan, and about $4.9 billion in benefits were paid out last year.

The money comes from employees who contribute 7.5 percent, and from the commonwealth, school districts and returns on investments in the stock market.

For the past 25 years, a majority of the funding — about 65 percent — had come from stock market investment earnings. As the market flourished, the amount of benefits paid out were increased to 25 percent.

But then investments began turning sour several years ago, and instead of requiring employer payments to steadily rise, the Legislature had allowed school district contributions to fall to about 1 percent in 2001, and hoped the market would rebound and the money would pour in.

It didn't, and then the bottom fell out of the economy in the past couple of years.

Now the pension fund has dwindled and the state still has to pay its obligations.

"We've made some mistakes in allowing school districts to pay so little, and in the short-term, it will cost," said state Rep. Russ Fairchild, R-85, of Lewisburg.

While it's too soon to say what recommendations will be proposed, Phillips anticipates employees will be asked to contribute more and the federal government may be asked to help out.

A long-term solution could involve overhauling the pension system and reducing benefits for new members.

"It's not an immediate solution, but it would help," Phillips said.

Fairchild said the system will have to be changed, even though unions will resist.

He doesn't support a plan favored by Gov. Ed Rendell and the Pennsylvania Association of School Business Officials to stretch out payments and give the state and districts 10 years to fund the liabilities.

Whatever the solution, everyone agrees resolving the financial crisis won't be easy, especially in the shadow of a gubernatorial election.

"They always seem to be deciding these issues on an election cycle," DiRocco said./snip

http://dailyitem.com/0100_news/x371477482/Higher-tax-bills-on-way




Jeffff -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/13/2010 6:10:02 PM)

Gee no mention of a mismanaged or pilfered pension fund?


I wonder why.





DarkSteven -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/13/2010 6:16:56 PM)

No problem. The administrators who created the problem and then sat by and did nothing while it hit crisis point - reduce THEIR pensions accordingly.

I wish this were legal




servantforuse -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/13/2010 6:34:03 PM)

This is a nationwide problem. CA alone has 500 billion in unfunded pension liabilities. New York and New Jersey are right behind them.




pahunkboy -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/13/2010 6:50:12 PM)

--I note how quickly it slaps onto property tax.

here is a story on- how the rich get more.

year 1- taxes double
year 2 taxes double again
year 3- taxes double yet again.

year 4- people no longer want to pay these taxes- and sell the house at a very low price as no one wants to own it.

year 5- the taxes reduce down to the year 0 level.  As the elite who just bought the house for pennies - now owns the whole block.




Brain -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/13/2010 7:16:22 PM)

With Pat Robertson running around in limousines and his private airplane and all the money the other guys like him rake in to buy gold bathtubs I think they should look at taxing religion and maybe some other nonprofits.


Property Taxes And The Non Profit Organization | financial solutions blog

Properties that are exempt from property taxes are not allowed to have any monetary profit, if the organization allows a group to use the property for profit, they can and will lose the status of a non-profit property whether is for their gain or someone else’s. The guidelines for tax exempt properties are very strict. If the organization sell a property to a new owner that new owner is subject to property taxes. If it is another non-profit group, they need to file an application for tax exempt status. If the property is qualified for tax exempt status, it is not for the current year, it is for the next tax year.

http://www.pipexinc.com/property-taxes-profit-organization/




popeye1250 -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/13/2010 11:38:17 PM)

That's the solution, no more tax breaks for "non-profits."
Harvard and M.I.T. own half of Cambridge, Mass.




juliaoceania -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/13/2010 11:52:09 PM)

Dude, being a public school teacher is not that great of a gig. It is pretty low paying considering the level of education one has to have to be hired for that job. Part of the appeal of becoming a teacher is summers and holidays off, the hours can be fairly decent, and the bennies are good.... and part of those bennies is having a pension...

Since public school teachers do not make a lot, they rely on pensions to help them retire... and you are advocating taking their retirement away? I suppose it could be worse, they could have invested in gold




pahunkboy -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/13/2010 11:54:09 PM)

and you are advocating taking their retirement away?/snip

It is not my problem that the stock market lost their retirement.




pahunkboy -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/13/2010 11:57:52 PM)

Aren't teachers supposed to be smart?

1.  they taught the population how to toil for paper fiat --

2.  they themself was not smart enough and lost their money in the stock market.

Why do we need them to teach us how to fail?  




juliaoceania -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/14/2010 12:07:33 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Aren't teachers supposed to be smart?

1.  they taught the population how to toil for paper fiat --

2.  they themself was not smart enough and lost their money in the stock market.

Why do we need them to teach us how to fail?  


They had a deal within their contracts with their districts, and if the investments had done well then the district would not be on the hook. This is not hard to understand, the district thought they were going to get off lightly on the pension because they bought into that whole entire privatization bullshit. Well, it seems that did not work out, so they have to make up their contractual obligations....

Shit happens, the teachers should have their contracts honored.




pahunkboy -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/14/2010 1:07:41 AM)

Shit happens, the teachers should have their contracts honored./snip

but at what cost?   30% annual property taxes  increase is NOT acceptable.

This is outrageous!      According to inflation numbers- there is no inflation-  then the value of housing is down-  my contract with my town - does not allow a 30% annual property tax increase.




Nineveh -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/14/2010 1:26:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Shit happens, the teachers should have their contracts honored./snip

but at what cost?   30% annual property taxes  increase is NOT acceptable.

This is outrageous!      According to inflation numbers- there is no inflation-  then the value of housing is down-  my contract with my town - does not allow a 30% annual property tax increase.



I don't think property taxes are the answer, but that doesn't mean that the obligations of the state and the school district can be ignored.  Higher taxes on financial transactions might do it.  Those are the guys who made a mess of the economy after all.




rulemylife -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/14/2010 7:12:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Shit happens, the teachers should have their contracts honored./snip

but at what cost?   30% annual property taxes  increase is NOT acceptable.

This is outrageous!      According to inflation numbers- there is no inflation-  then the value of housing is down-  my contract with my town - does not allow a 30% annual property tax increase.



You don't have a contract with your town.




juliaoceania -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/14/2010 8:22:48 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Shit happens, the teachers should have their contracts honored./snip

but at what cost?   30% annual property taxes  increase is NOT acceptable.

This is outrageous!      According to inflation numbers- there is no inflation-  then the value of housing is down-  my contract with my town - does not allow a 30% annual property tax increase.



Is it outrageous?

You want to rip off teachers that gave their career to the children of your state, probably many of which taught people your age. You tea party sorts really are the Something for Nothing crowd. Without the teachers in PA your ass would be illiterate and you wouldn't be posting on this message board. I would say that makes you an ungrateful person...

So far you do not believe in tipping the people who serve you and you do not believe in paying the people who educated you.... You know what, you are shaping up to be a cheap bastard




PALEHORSERIDING -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/14/2010 9:01:31 AM)

I dont tip people sorry but do you tip the people at counters who serve you or the people at any place like that that serves you no you dont.

you spell it cheap i spell it smart

Hey guess what the teachers took a risk they lost out on the risk suffer or work for more years.




subrob1967 -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/14/2010 9:25:16 AM)

This is no one's fault but the state, when a teacher is hired, one of the benefits offered to them is a pension. Just because your state is piss poor at managing your tax dollars shouldn't affect a retired teacher's pension.

If the state doesn't like the bed they made themselves, let them renegotiate future bedding needs, and budget accordingly.




pahunkboy -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/14/2010 9:42:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania


quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Shit happens, the teachers should have their contracts honored./snip

but at what cost?   30% annual property taxes  increase is NOT acceptable.

This is outrageous!      According to inflation numbers- there is no inflation-  then the value of housing is down-  my contract with my town - does not allow a 30% annual property tax increase.



Is it outrageous?

You want to rip off teachers that gave their career to the children of your state, probably many of which taught people your age. You tea party sorts really are the Something for Nothing crowd. Without the teachers in PA your ass would be illiterate and you wouldn't be posting on this message board. I would say that makes you an ungrateful person...

So far you do not believe in tipping the people who serve you and you do not believe in paying the people who educated you.... You know what, you are shaping up to be a cheap bastard


They failed.  I want my time back- I and others learned nothing.

If anything taxes should be going DOWN 30%.

It is all fun and games till YOUR taxes rise 30%.




ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/14/2010 9:54:51 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

They failed.  I want my time back- I and others learned nothing.



Speak for yourself.




Musicmystery -> RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers (6/14/2010 10:14:55 AM)

quote:

Schools struggle to pay retired teachers


Unfunded tax cuts will do that.

Not all states are in this position--comes down to which ones planned ahead, and which ones bought votes.




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