RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion



Message

kdsub -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 1:38:17 PM)

Below are some statistics for the 3,000 plus on death row in 2005 in the US. I have searched many sites with differing statistics but the below are typical and telling.

The bolded statistics add up to at least 20% of murders had murdered before or escaped and murdered. This would not have happened if they had been executed in the first place… again that is 600 innocent lives that would have been saved!!!

Lets say with new strict rules at least half of those could have been rightfully executed with no doubt... that would have still saved 300 or so lives.

65.0% had a prior felony conviction at the time of the murder.
08.4% had a prior homicide conviction at the time of the murder.
07.8% had criminal charges pending at the time of the murder.
26.7% were on probation or parole at the time of the murder.
4.9% were incarcerated or had escaped from incarceration.
14% had accumulated more than one death sentence.
22% were married, 21% divorced, and 03% widowed.
54% were never married.
46% were high school/GED graduates.
39% were under the age of 25 at arrest; 1.9% are under 25 now.
0.2% were 60+ years at arrest; 4.2% are 60+ years now.
The average age was 42 years. (27 at sentencing)

Butch



willbeurdaddy -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 1:42:30 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

Dead is dead, even though it costs three times as much to execute a person than keep them in prison for the rest of their life. You in the US must sure have a lot of money to go to such extravagances.


A bullshit statistic. It isnt executing them that costs, its the idiotic appeal process that allows them to delay it. When execution is carried out promptly it costs $25 bucks.



willbeurdaddy -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 1:43:54 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: flcouple2009

If it is going to be a deterrent they should be public, painful, and ugly.


exactly...even though you were being ironic, I presume



willbeurdaddy -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 1:48:45 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

There's absolutely no evidence that capital punishment has ever worked as a deterrent to crime anywhere.


There is absolute evidence that NOT executing someone leads to innocent deaths. It is the stronges deterrent possible to the same murderer doing it again. That is enough reason in and of itself.

That aside, you are wrong that there is no other evidence.

one of many studies



willbeurdaddy -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 1:50:46 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

As you say, it's strange how pro abortion advocates are always in against the death penalty. They should make their fucking minds up one way or the other.


FYP



willbeurdaddy -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 1:51:54 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ

FR

Someone above referred to lethal injection as "painless".
It isn't always.

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/descriptions-execution-methods





Why should execution be less painful than the method used to commit the murder.



willbeurdaddy -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 1:55:36 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

There are at least two ways to view anti-capital punishment...The first is how can we be sure the person is guilty when so many have been exonerated with new forensic techniques .



so many? how many sentenced or actually executed have been exonerated? Statistics about non-death penalty convictions being reversed are irrelevant, since the standards and circumstances for a death penalty conviction are totally different.



flcouple2009 -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 1:56:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: flcouple2009

If it is going to be a deterrent they should be public, painful, and ugly.


exactly...even though you were being ironic, I presume


be careful when you presume

If you actually expect it to be any type of deterrent being sanitized and behind closed doors isn't gonna cut it



kdsub -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:04:20 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

There are at least two ways to view anti-capital punishment...The first is how can we be sure the person is guilty when so many have been exonerated with new forensic techniques .



so many? how many sentenced or actually executed have been exonerated? Statistics about non-death penalty convictions being reversed are irrelevant, since the standards and circumstances for a death penalty conviction are totally different.


It is hard to find statistics that agree on the number but more than one site has estimated close to one percent. That would have been thirty men in 2005. Now only a few were found innocent where most of them had their sentences commuted to life because some evidence was tainted or found wrong.

Butch



willbeurdaddy -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:06:36 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

There are at least two ways to view anti-capital punishment...The first is how can we be sure the person is guilty when so many have been exonerated with new forensic techniques .



so many? how many sentenced or actually executed have been exonerated? Statistics about non-death penalty convictions being reversed are irrelevant, since the standards and circumstances for a death penalty conviction are totally different.


It is hard to find statistics that agree on the number but more than one site has estimated close to one percent. That would have been thirty men in 2005. Now only a few were found innocent where most of them had their sentences commuted to life because some evidence was tainted or found wrong.

Butch


Interesting, Ive only been able to find 3...ever.



kdsub -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:10:14 PM)

It is hard to find specific instances.. I remember two in Illinois some years back that caused them to have a moratorium on the death penalty. But don’t get me wrong…I’ve no sympathy for them I just think the laws need to be tightened.

You may think differently if you were one of the three...lol



popeye1250 -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:12:54 PM)

Great place Illinois, and you can't carry a gun there to protect yourself from the criminals.



Jeffff -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:14:25 PM)

This is from the ABA web site


Their names spark vague recognition in many Illinois residents: Rolando Cruz, Alejandro Hernandez, Verneal Jimerson, Dennis Williams, Joseph Burrows, Gary Gauger, Carl Lawson, Perry Cobb, Darby Tillis.
Most people may at least remember hearing about some of them. Others could identify who a few of the men are, but come up blank on the rest. Yet the state and residents of Illinois owe a debt to these nine men that is so great, it cannot - and will not - ever be repaid.
They are the former Illinois Death Row inmates who have been found innocent and freed in the decade since the death penalty was reinstituted in the state. In the same period of time, the state executed only eight men. All together, those freed spent a total of 52 years on Death Row, and another 36 in county jails and state prisons.



popeye1250 -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:18:12 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffff

This is from the ABA web site


Their names spark vague recognition in many Illinois residents: Rolando Cruz, Alejandro Hernandez, Verneal Jimerson, Dennis Williams, Joseph Burrows, Gary Gauger, Carl Lawson, Perry Cobb, Darby Tillis.
Most people may at least remember hearing about some of them. Others could identify who a few of the men are, but come up blank on the rest. Yet the state and residents of Illinois owe a debt to these nine men that is so great, it cannot - and will not - ever be repaid.
They are the former Illinois Death Row inmates who have been found innocent and freed in the decade since the death penalty was reinstituted in the state. In the same period of time, the state executed only eight men. All together, those freed spent a total of 52 years on Death Row, and another 36 in county jails and state prisons.


I wonder if the state of Illinois will put that in their tourist brochures?



Jeffff -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:26:26 PM)

LOL.... probably not.

That is my whole problem with the death penalty. Not every case is cut and dried.

You can't kill innocent people just because vengeance feels good.



kdsub -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:28:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffff

LOL.... probably not.

That is my whole problem with the death penalty. Not every case is cut and dried.

You can't kill innocent people just because vengeance feels good.


Jeff but some are...what about those?

Butch



SL4V3M4YB3 -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:33:15 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
65.0% had a prior felony conviction at the time of the murder.
08.4% had a prior homicide conviction at the time of the murder.
07.8% had criminal charges pending at the time of the murder.
26.7% were on probation or parole at the time of the murder.
4.9% were incarcerated or had escaped from incarceration.
14% had accumulated more than one death sentence.
22% were married, 21% divorced, and 03% widowed.
54% were never married.
46% were high school/GED graduates.
39% were under the age of 25 at arrest; 1.9% are under 25 now.
0.2% were 60+ years at arrest; 4.2% are 60+ years now.
The average age was 42 years. (27 at sentencing)

This pretty much describes Satan Claus to a tee.



Jeffff -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:35:54 PM)

I have mixed emotions on that. Is it easier to die or spend 20,30,40,50 years in jail?

And how do we determine what is cut and dried. Video evidence? A bottom line number of eye witnesses?

Years ago I was talking to a cop who was working the John Wayne Gacey case. He told me that they found 32 severed penises in his freezer. That was why they kept looking for bodies.

If that was true, not every killer is so accommodating.

Also, I have no mixed emotions about taking the life of someone who is committing a violent act right in front of me.

Like everyone else, I rationalize.



kdsub -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:45:16 PM)

Yep that is the crux of the matter...how reliable can evidence be? In past threads on the death penalty I said I believe there can be strict laws on CP…I still believe that.

Imagine you were taken to court to testify against a murderer when you saw the crime committed…would you be inclined to agree with a death sentence when he or she was found guilty. Or would you think…will maybe I did not see what I thought I saw… That is what others are saying about eye witness testimony. You could not be relied upon to testify on what you saw.

I think this thinking is bullshit.

Butch



DomKen -> RE: The death penalty...does the method matter? (6/18/2010 2:48:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

There are at least two ways to view anti-capital punishment...The first is how can we be sure the person is guilty when so many have been exonerated with new forensic techniques .



so many? how many sentenced or actually executed have been exonerated? Statistics about non-death penalty convictions being reversed are irrelevant, since the standards and circumstances for a death penalty conviction are totally different.

How many people sentenced to death have been exonerated since 1973? 138. Also at least one completely innocent man was executed by Texas since 1973.

That's 139 innocents versus 1217 executions. That's 10.25%.



Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4 5   next >   >>

Valid CSS!




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy
0.046875