Saneness ? (Full Version)

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Aneirin -> Saneness ? (6/30/2010 4:47:07 AM)

The definition of sane appears to be only that of a  sound mind, but what is a sound mind , what are it's attributes and even more importantly who or what gets to decide if a subject has a sound mind or not ?




laurell3 -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 4:55:45 AM)

Sane, sanity or insanity is mostly a legal term now. Sound mind refers to one's ability to reason, comprehend, evaluate and make appropriate decisions. Typically when whether one was of sound mind comes into question, a psychologist would give the ultimate decision as to whether they were of sound mind, although lay persons testimony or video taped statements by the person in question could be used as well. Really the only place I've ever seen the issue brought up is in the context of wills or trusts.




heartcream -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 5:12:42 AM)

Sane is someone who takes responsibility for themselves and uses their heart and noggin to help make their own decisions.




sirsholly -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 5:17:13 AM)

quote:

Really the only place I've ever seen the issue brought up is in the context of wills or trusts.



There is also the McNaughton Rule, defining criminal liability.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M%27Naghten_Rules






BentUnit -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 5:45:31 AM)

Please.....

If you are NOT an accredited psychiatric professional who has had one on one time with the subject then you have no rights either morally nor legally to evaluate anyone's sanity.

Anything less is arm-chair psycho babble bullshit they have pulled out of their arse.




laurell3 -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 5:47:15 AM)

Yep I know Mcnaughton rather well. It's not a sound mind standard.




laurell3 -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 5:55:16 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BentUnit

Please.....

If you are NOT an accredited psychiatric professional who has had one on one time with the subject then you have no rights either morally nor legally to evaluate anyone's sanity.

Anything less is arm-chair psycho babble bullshit they have pulled out of their arse.



Sigh...it's one of those mornings...

you have mail




BentUnit -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 6:05:46 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3


quote:

ORIGINAL: BentUnit

Please.....

If you are NOT an accredited psychiatric professional who has had one on one time with the subject then you have no rights either morally nor legally to evaluate anyone's sanity.

Anything less is arm-chair psycho babble bullshit they have pulled out of their arse.



Sigh...it's one of those mornings...

you have mail


Thank you.

C-mail received and responded to.

Hugs Sweetheart.




sirsholly -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 6:44:30 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3

Yep I know Mcnaughton rather well. It's not a sound mind standard.
i am not in the legal field, but to my knowledge McNaughton is still used as the standard for assessment of mental incompetence as a criminal defense.




sirsholly -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 6:46:06 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BentUnit

Please.....

If you are NOT an accredited psychiatric professional who has had one on one time with the subject then you have no rights either morally nor legally to evaluate anyone's sanity.

Anything less is arm-chair psycho babble bullshit they have pulled out of their arse.

yer nutz! [:D]




laurell3 -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 7:08:15 AM)

One is criminal, the other is typically civil or at least in the context I have seen it in. Incompetence can be an entirely different thing as well, ie" not able to stand trial or assist in your own defense temporarily or permanently but not meeting Mcnaughton Ie: knowing the difference between right and wrong.




BentUnit -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 7:10:48 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

ORIGINAL: BentUnit

Please.....

If you are NOT an accredited psychiatric professional who has had one on one time with the subject then you have no rights either morally nor legally to evaluate anyone's sanity.

Anything less is arm-chair psycho babble bullshit they have pulled out of their arse.

yer nutz! [:D]



Maybe..

But is that your considered professional opinion?

<wink>




laurell3 -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 7:11:51 AM)

She's not nuts, THEY usually never admit it! [;)]




JstAnotherSub -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 7:12:27 AM)

If someone tells me they are completely sane, I know beyond a shadow of a doubt they are fucking wackos to be avoided.

But I do bless their hearts!




juliaoceania -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 7:17:12 AM)

Michel Foucault

quote:

Madness and Civilization
Main article: Madness and Civilization
The English edition of Madness and Civilization is an abridged version of Folie et déraison: Histoire de la folie à l'âge classique, originally published in 1961. A full English translation titled The History of Madness has since been published by Routledge in 2006.[26] "Folie et deraison" originated as Foucault's doctoral dissertation;[27] this was Foucault's first major book, mostly written while he was the Director of the Maison de France in Sweden. It examines ideas, practices, institutions, art and literature relating to madness in Western history.[28]
Foucault begins his history in the Middle Ages, noting the social and physical exclusion of lepers.[28] He argues that with the gradual disappearance of leprosy, madness came to occupy this excluded position. The ship of fools in the 15th century is a literary version of one such exclusionary practice, namely that of sending mad people away in ships. In 17th century Europe, in a movement Foucault famously calls the "Great Confinement," "unreasonable" members of the population were institutionalised.[29] In the eighteenth century, madness came to be seen as the reverse of Reason, and, finally, in the nineteenth century as mental illness.
Foucault also argues that madness was silenced by Reason, losing its power to signify the limits of social order and to point to the truth. He examines the rise of scientific and "humanitarian" treatments of the insane, notably at the hands of Philippe Pinel and Samuel Tuke who he suggests started the conceptualization of madness as 'mental illness'. He claims that these new treatments were in fact no less controlling than previous methods. Pinel's treatment of the mad amounted to an extended aversion therapy, including such treatments as freezing showers and use of a straitjacket. In Foucault's view, this treatment amounted to repeated brutality until the pattern of judgment and punishment was internalized by the patient.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michel_Foucault#Madness_and_Civilization




sirsholly -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 7:17:54 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BentUnit

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

ORIGINAL: BentUnit

Please.....

If you are NOT an accredited psychiatric professional who has had one on one time with the subject then you have no rights either morally nor legally to evaluate anyone's sanity.

Anything less is arm-chair psycho babble bullshit they have pulled out of their arse.

yer nutz! [:D]



Maybe..

But is that your considered professional opinion?

<wink>

Bent...all kidding aside, there was a long thread about this sort of issue. Yes, i am a psych professional, and no, i will not give a serious professional opinion over the internet, other than suggesting someone would benefit from seeking therapy. It is dangerous, stupid, and professional suicide.




laurell3 -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 7:22:31 AM)

Holly,

You don't use the term sane or insane anymore in the psych fields correct?




BentUnit -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 7:23:48 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

ORIGINAL: BentUnit

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

ORIGINAL: BentUnit

Please.....

If you are NOT an accredited psychiatric professional who has had one on one time with the subject then you have no rights either morally nor legally to evaluate anyone's sanity.

Anything less is arm-chair psycho babble bullshit they have pulled out of their arse.

yer nutz! [:D]



Maybe..

But is that your considered professional opinion?

<wink>

Bent...all kidding aside, there was a long thread about this sort of issue. Yes, i am a psych professional, and no, i will not give a serious professional opinion over the internet, other than suggesting someone would benefit from seeking therapy. It is dangerous, stupid, and professional suicide.



Have I told you lately how much I love you.

Bravo in proving the very point I was trying to make.

You're a doll.




sirsholly -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 7:31:26 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3

Holly,

You don't use the term sane or insane anymore in the psych fields correct?
To the best of my knowledge, they never really were used, nor were they ever "medical terms" as far as i know...just general catch-alls (although i could be wrong on this)
" Insanity" was tossed around freely years ago, such as with the term Insane Asylum, but it was not a diagnosis..just the end result of the illness itself.





juliaoceania -> RE: Saneness ? (6/30/2010 7:39:27 AM)

The wiki article I posted is about a theorist named Michel Foucault who studied the treatment of the mentally ill and the labels we applied to them, as well as how different cultures defined mental illness...

I found his ideas to be very interesting... he also wrote about sado-masochism too...




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