RE: What has America done right?

RE: What has America done right? (Full Version)

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sheriff -> RE: What has America done right? (4/16/2006 11:10:19 AM)
America definately saved Australia`s arse during the second world war from the Japanese, thanks Yanks!!

DelightMachine -> RE: What has America done right? (4/16/2006 11:43:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig As another Canadian, I admit that the US is big, and at times bossy, ugly, rude, ignorant, and so on. However, I would rather live next to you guys than anybody else on the planet, thank you very much Yes, and I personally prefer my country sharing a long border with Canada over any other nation, despite some Canadians (NOT you, Arpig) being priggish, smug, small-minded when they think they're being cosmopolitan, showing their insecurity when they boast and being oversensitive. In fact, these Canadians pretty much remind me of what 19th century Americans sounded like. Oddly, all the Canadians I've ever personally met are not like this at all -- in fact, they've been uniformly courteous and good-tempered and generally fun to be around -- so maybe it's just Canadian commentators and politicians and those who are sucked in by that drivel. Or maybe the one's I've met are secret agents of the Canadian Mounted Police, infiltrating our nation with a mask of geniality over a masterful conspiracy of malicious intent. Either way, they're nice guys.

philosophy -> RE: What has America done right? (4/16/2006 11:50:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DelightMachine Yes, and I personally prefer my country sharing a long border with Canada over any other nation, despite some Canadians (NOT you, Arpig) being priggish, smug, small-minded when they think they're being cosmopolitan, showing their insecurity when they boast and being oversensitive. In fact, these Canadians pretty much remind me of what 19th century Americans sounded like. Oddly, all the Canadians I've ever personally met are not like this at all -- in fact, they've been uniformly courteous and good-tempered and generally fun to be around -- so maybe it's just Canadian commentators and politicians and those who are sucked in by that drivel. couldn't possibly be the way they're reported by the American media though.......perish the thought that the media has an agenda........

Level -> RE: What has America done right? (4/16/2006 12:35:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: philosophy quote: ORIGINAL: DelightMachine Yes, and I personally prefer my country sharing a long border with Canada over any other nation, despite some Canadians (NOT you, Arpig) being priggish, smug, small-minded when they think they're being cosmopolitan, showing their insecurity when they boast and being oversensitive. In fact, these Canadians pretty much remind me of what 19th century Americans sounded like. Oddly, all the Canadians I've ever personally met are not like this at all -- in fact, they've been uniformly courteous and good-tempered and generally fun to be around -- so maybe it's just Canadian commentators and politicians and those who are sucked in by that drivel. couldn't possibly be the way they're reported by the American media though.......perish the thought that the media has an agenda........ It always brings a smile to my face thinking about how there are people from the left to the right that think they media has an agenda, usually opposing what said person thinks is right lol. Of course, some do have an agenda... cues ominous music.... The media is made up of human beings.... faulty and prideful and arrogant, as well as fair, decent, and hard working. The media became "human" in my eyes a few years ago, when someone mentioned the word "gravitas" (maybe during the Gore/Bush election cycle?), and within days, you could not turn on a news program without some talking head solemnly intoning how so and so "had gravitas" or didn't have it, or wanted it. It was like watching a pack of kids tossing around the new "cool" word at school. Level

Arpig -> RE: What has America done right? (4/16/2006 1:17:05 PM)
That, my friend is because you have met real canadians...we spend too much of our time drinking beer & smoking various things to bother with being priggish, etc. Actually your analogy of 19th century Americans rings true...many up here are dorks, but over all I think the real* canucks have them pretty much outnumbered. * In this context the word "real" can be taken to mean "drunk" [;)]...and just in case you are wondering, no I am not drunk, but if somebody wants to come by with a 24 and remedy that......HA! Leafs are out of the playoffs...Go Sens!

Alumbrado -> RE: What has America done right? (4/16/2006 4:12:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: wytchywoman quote: ORIGINAL: Alumbrado Whether you have ever bothered to read the War Prayer or not, it covers the same ground as the Onion piece..only Twain's opus was a famous piece of literature long before the Onion even existed. And the Quaker pacifists have devoted and even sacrificed their lives in opposition to war for centuries, right up to the executions of those peace team members a few weeks ago. These are the people and the pacifist concepts you are on record as dismissing in this very thread. It is certainly your right to be a cheerleader for hatred and war, but don't expect everyone to follow you. Read Ayn Rand and then get back to me. You want to talk about Mark Twain? He was a godless atheist who didn't know where to put his shit except on someone other than him. Have a nice evening. We weren't discussing the dystopians, we were discussing the American anti-war movement and your contempt for it. To sum up from your quotes in this thread, anti-war concepts are not something good in your view because Twain was an athiest, and the Quakers don't count.[8\|] Keep those blinders on tightly, hatemonger.

DelightMachine -> RE: What has America done right? (4/16/2006 10:08:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig quote: You still haven't presented an argument showing the reasons why you think we can't win the war on terror Neither have you or GW, but I like your optimism. Some of the evil folk we call terrorists think we are terrorists if not for our direct actions, than for our support of people who do or would terrorize them. M We don't even have a choice about whether to fight them. We only have a choice about whether or not to be aggressive about doing it. Aggressive means, in large part, fighting them over there rather than trying to keep them from coming here. We'd fail at keeping them from coming here, and we'd be cleaning up a lot more body parts. Al Qaeda is not growing stronger and stronger. The indications are that it's becoming less and less popular in the Muslim world as Muslims realize most of Al Qaeda's victims are innocent fellow Muslims. Even Al Jazeera has been forced to admit as much, although grudgingly. If a democratic form of government succeeds in getting established in Iraq, we will have an enormous propaganda coup, and that willl hobble Al Qaeda's ability to get good quality recruits. I'm positive none of this will be easy and it will take decades, not years for this project against Islamic terrorism to be over, but terrorist movements have been defeated in the past: -- the Red Brigades are gone from Germany. -- a similar group in Italy was raging in the '60s, '70s and into the '80s, and it's dead. -- there were anarchist terrorists in the early 20th century in the U.S. I'm told that on the New York Stock Exchange building you can still see scars from a bomb that blew up around Wall Street. -- we had plenty of home-grown terrorists in the U.S. in the '60s and '70s, but they're gone. Islamic terrorists are a bigger problem than any of those, but we've weakened them and we can defeat them. My guess is that an American city will be destroyed, at least the core of it will be destroyed, by a weapon of mass destruction before we defeat them. If we don't defeat them, then more will get destroyed. We can't even surrender to these people without massive destruction, so we'll do the only thing we can do -- fight. The only question is whether we'll fight intelligently and bring this to a conclusion in a relatively few decades, or whether we'll mess up so badly that it will take several decades more. Depressed yet?

DelightMachine -> RE: What has America done right? (4/16/2006 10:17:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig quote: You still haven't presented an argument showing the reasons why you think we can't win the war on terror Neither have you or GW, but I like your optimism. Some of the evil folk we call terrorists think we are terrorists if not for our direct actions, than for our support of people who do or would terrorize them. M Bush has been getting away from that by supporting democratic forms of government. If you mean that we support Israel, well, Israel doesn't terrorize them so much as defend itself from them. If they don't like it, too bad. If you mean countries like Saudi Arabia, I agree, and Bush has made comments saying that basically he agrees we shouldn't be supporting repressive regimes. But it's kind of hard to separate yourself from, say, Saudi Arabia when the world needs their oil and to force them to sell us oil would, well, roil the rest of the Arab world. Bush wants democracy in the Mideast, and I hope they'll eventually get it, but you have to choose your battles. Keeping nukes away from Iran and keeping it from supporting terrorists is more important right now. It looks like we may need to work with some pretty nasty regimes before we get that done, but it's important that we get it done first.

BlkTallFullfig -> RE: What has America done right? (4/16/2006 10:26:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DelightMachine Islamic terrorists are a bigger problem than any of those, but we've weakened them and we can defeat them. My guess is that an American city will be destroyed, at least the core of it will be destroyed, by a weapon of mass destruction before we defeat them. If we don't defeat them, then more will get destroyed. We can't even surrender to these people without massive destruction, so we'll do the only thing we can do -- fight. The only question is whether we'll fight intelligently and bring this to a conclusion in a relatively few decades, or whether we'll mess up so badly that it will take several decades more. Depressed yet? Yes it is depressing and I'm afraid they will destroy more than one city before we get this under control if we ever do... I had hoped for diplomatic and policy driven coersion (justly aplied to all folks of that region), before we went to Iraq (but that ship's sailed), so now can only hope with you that we fight intelligently and end it sooner than later. Thanks for the thoughtful reply. M

Arpig -> RE: What has America done right? (4/16/2006 10:57:24 PM)
It occurs to me, that way back when this all began, bush specifically said that it would be a long struggle, one that would be fought in terms of years or even decades. Why is everybody so surprised that this is the case....did anybody really think that there would be a fast bloodless way to end the scourge of terrorism (not just fundamentalist Islamist terrorism, though that is the most active and virulent form of the disease). I happen to think that it is only by direct action against the terrorists wherever they are that will the world eventually make it clear that terrorism is not only a bad option...it is an option that dooms your movement to failure. I will not waste time delving into what has or has not been done right or wrong so far, only that in a grand strategic sense, the US & Britain are on the right track

MsMacComb -> RE: What has America done right? (4/16/2006 11:43:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig I will not waste time delving into what has or has not been done right or wrong so far, only that in a grand strategic sense, the US & Britain are on the right track With all due respect, where do you see this? We are essentially losing two wars and going bankrupt in the process.

incognitoinmass -> RE: What has America done right? (4/17/2006 4:39:08 AM)
quote: "With all due respect, where do you see this? We are essentially losing two wars and going bankrupt in the process. Nonsense. By any realistic measure we have won the wars and are winning the peace.

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